nickCR

Hi Guys, Finally after over a year we got our CCTV system setup. The software is nice but I wonder how I can go about setting up alarms when a camera detects motion? Is there anyway to have the map show a flashing red icon where the motion is detected. Can I automatically show the camara on the screen when there is motion detected? Is there anyway we can make adjustments in the software to force the camera to go into night mode? There are 2 camaras that stay in color even at night. Camara models are IP7330 and the other is IP8332 both by Vivotek. Thanks in advance, Nick

I guess if you have someone dedicated to watching the monitors all day they will notice things, but in our case the guards have multiple things to do and an audible alarm would be best. Hopefully eXacq puts this in their software in the near future. Yeah I don't believe there are any settings available at all , they are Vivotek cameras, pretty much bottom of the barrel for IP stuff. Thanks for your help though! Much appreciated

Sure makes sense, is there not an audible method or is making the camera with motion appearing in one of the boxes the best way to do this? Ok no problem, do cameras normally have the ability to adjust that sensitivity?

Hello All, So we ( a 121 home residential complex ) are almost ready to pull the trigger on our CCTV system. The map of our complex is attached. I would really welcome comments / recommendations on which Ubiquiti wireless products to use to network the blue points to the red dot. Multiple points can be wired into one router which is connected via wireless to the main collection point ( the red dot ). The blue arrows are the fixed IP cams (Vivotek IP7330). The half circle on the bottom of the map is intended to be a PTZ (Vivotek SD-7151) however i'm starting to think I should switch it out for two fixed cameras. If the dome isn't in the viewing area of something going on then it won't catch it. If we put fixed cameras there then we'll capture everything. I am also debating changing the fixed IP7330 cameras for AXIS M1113 which will need an enclosure. However maybe there are other cameras that would do a good job. Basically I would love to see that the system could handle H.264 video on all channels and have the capacity to add more cameras in future. Line of sight shouldn't be a problem since the red dot is really the highest point on the property and we can put the Ubiquiti Antennas on the roofs. The furthest point is about 400 mts from the red dot. I think in future we may want to have megapixel cams in certain areas that require more visibility, but that is certainly a down the road thing. Software is pretty much determined to be eXacq. Thanks in advance! Nick

Where you going to run on Ubuntu/Debian? Looking at the spec sheet, it's a pretty old version of Ubuntu. Yes was planning to use Ubuntu.

I'll make sure that the provider is aware that the Ubiquiti products do not have PoE out of the box. I understand Ubiquiti is quite well priced and PoE isn't needed by everyone .... Anyway I was looking at that H264 WebCam 3.7 Professional and I might give their trial a go. If it works well then we can use it and maybe get some better cameras in place of that The fact that it runs on Windows though might be an issue.

Hey Guys, Thanks for all your replies!!! I completely agree with you guys and I think we need better cameras no doubt about it but we have a limit and that limit is the price we are paying. I know there are cheaper software packages out there but you guys recommended eXact and they have a distributor here in Costa Rica. We finally settled on the following: Cameras: Vivotek ( I know there are other solutions, but we will need to explore them in future ) Wireless: Ubiquiti Nanostations M5 ( Very pleased about this ) Software: eXact They will wire 2 cameras. They will wireless bridge club house 2, guard house 1 and 2 and each camera on the north road. We plan on expanding the system internally in future. So when this happens we will replace the exterior cameras and use those Vivotek cams inside the complex. I did look at the image samples that the Vivotek provides. Like I said before we do not need to recognize anyone, that isn't important. We just want to know if something is happening some where so that security can go and deal with it. So the Nanostation M5 will "NOT" output PoE to the Vivotek? We need to grab power for the wireless device anyway but it would have been nice to have only one wire going into the camera. This is only an issue in 3 spots since we will have the Nanostation connect into a router in the two guard houses and can power the router directly from the guard house. Thanks again for all your replies! I really appreciate all the help!

Might have made that mistake Fixed the main title just for ya!

The wireless that he proposes to use is: Argtek CPE2615 http://www.argtek.com/ I don't feel very comfortable with this but I don't know what you guys think... Also anyone ever heard of these? http://www.ethernetextender.com/ethernet-extension-products/865.php

I think here you have a few issues to consider. 1. The wireless devices are not pretty and it's likely that in a big "mansion" it will 'not' be ok to hang a big white block from the sealing. 2. It's imperative that you get at the very least a blue print or some pictures to know what your dealing with. Now for some ideas: If there are several cameras in one area then at least you could get a hub setup to link those cameras and one wireless bridge to the main AP for that cluster of cameras. For that matter the CB/AP could be placed outside without any trouble at all and probably help keep it looking clean and pretty. If that isn't an option I'd really check out those Mobotix cameras that were recommended in my thread. They are too expensive for our application here but I think they might be right up your ally. That is if they don't need a central security officer watching the cameras all day and just need to pull the video when required from the SD. As a last resort finding a tiny Wireless device (USB stick size) might be the only solution. In absolute worst case I guess you could place the cameras close to external walls and go through the wall outside then up to the roof for each camera but that sounds painful but it could be done. Then on the roof you have all the wireless CB/AP. I'm no pro, just throwing out some solutions.

LOL ... it's a love hate relationship .... honestly though no i'm not sorry because at least this way I won't look like an idiot by having us install a system that sux. BTW it's nice to see you visiting the thread again I've learned a ton from you guys and from other post on this forum. I've always liked IP based stuff, I do all my own networking at home and even have a Linksys IP cam that i've played around with. So I must admit this was a topic of interest to me so that's probably why I enjoy learning about it even though it is a little over whelming. I might not understand that specifics yet but I get the big picture. Well business is business right I'm sure the $15K-$16K he will charge for this will result in a decent profit. I found a couple of videos on the internet of the IP7330 and the video isn't perfect but it's not half bad. We will without a doubt be able to see whats happening in the exterior of the complex. Our biggest concern are these two empty lots which are quite dark at night. Seems like this little guy is up to the task. On a separate note when everyone started talking about channels and all that I did check with him to see what kind of analog system he suggested. Includes the same number of cameras but they are PARANTEK - ACP-RV052 and the dome is D-Max DOH-240Se with a Kguard KG522 system. I just don't see the benefit in buying an analog system much less one that only has 9 channels.

buellwinkle: Thanks for your very detailed reply. This has been a huge learning experience for me. I've been looking and drilling my head into the wall trying to figure out what's best and with all the options there isn't one "BEST" solution but there are definitely things to stay away from. I most certainly don't want to look bad by recommending a cheap system that won't work. I agree that Foscam is crap and i'm not happy with the provider anymore. He doesn't seem to be doing a very good job at working with me. I told him we wanted to find another software package that wasn't zoneminder that could support more cameras. His reply was well I can get it but then I don't know what cameras we can use. This was the most unprofessional statement that he could make. The ONLY part of the entire quote that he had which was good was the Engenius wireless AP's, but then he left out materials like wiring and tubing, etc. I want to clarify something here. We are not interested in identification. We have a full time security team that is fully armed and with an alarm or something to notify them of movement they can respond immediately to any threats. With that said, I found a dealer here that distributes Exacq software. They came the same day I called them. Their first quote was $30K with a 5.8 ghz system which many here pointed out was a little overkill (the wireless system that is). I continued to work with the provider. We calculated the exact distances and found that we can do a wired setup to the main entrance where we were going to have 2 cameras. So perfect we can upgrade to MP cameras later with no problem at all which is a big benefit since there is really the only location were "identification" would ever really be necessary. Aside from that we worked on a system that was closer to what we can ask the neighbors for in a payment. His last quote was for a little over $15K, with a 2.4 ghz system vs 5.8 ghz. The cameras he proposes are the same Vivotek cameras (IP7330 & SD-7151). Like I mentioned before, I have used this brand and I really like them but maybe you guys will have another take on that. To my knowledge Vivotek is a decent brand name when it comes to cameras (not as good as some but no where near as horrible as others). Also take into consideration that we live in Costa Rica. Just the import tax here is 30%, then 13% sales tax and shipping on top of it usually brings the cost to around 50% more form that in the states. For example the IP7330 is $437 and the SD-7151 is $1,978. The only thing i'm up in the air about is the wireless system he proposes and until he provides the model number I won't really know if it's good or not. He wants to use a 2.4 ghz system. I know this frequency is congested but I think people were ok with the Engenius products and the brand he proposes does have a CPE that operates on a band that is completely out of the residential frequencies. He has done a lot of installs in the country including a lot of government institutions which require quality security. He also provides a 18 month waranty on his system. So at least I can't look that bad for 18 months Anyway when I get the wireless model i'll post up the specs. Also please feel free to let me know what you guys think of the Vivotek equipment. Thanks in advance for you help!

thanks guys for your replies. rory: Yes I know they make cards that handle more channels but the option they were offering only had a card for 16 channels. thewireguys: We will look into them. hardwired: Thanks for clarifying that for me. I figured that was the case but I just wanted to double check. So really if the Super G is 2.4 ghz with maybe 35-70 Mbps then I think we're looking pretty good. The only downside is the 2.4 ghz but as explained if the using the same product as a AP then we should have a much larger range of channels to choose from which sounds pretty good to me I'll see if he can get Wireless N but unfortunately I don't think it will be very accessible here in Costa Rica. That's great news about Exacq software. I guess there is an entire array of things you could do with this feature then. For example you could probably program it that if it detects motion to zoom in on it. Run a tour. Etc.. Thanks guys for all your help, it's really helped me get to a point where I can make an educated decisions about the setup.

Will Engenius 2.4 ghz Super G be ok or do we need to look at 5 ghz? The best 'provider one' can get is Engenius 5 ghz "A" band which i'm not sure on the through put. Is it equivalent to the 300 mbps that we could get on "N" or would be be better off going with the Super G solution?

hardwired thanks for all your replies. I think really you've answered all my questions and now i'm just working with the providers to get the best solution possible for the price. Last night we meet and I presented both offers and explained that I would like the system to be expandable. It seems though that the residents only want the exterior protected and are not very interested in the interior of the complex. One neighbor even wanted us to eliminate the cameras in the club houses (i'm not in favor of this of course). Basically here is the site design: Two cameras in the front entrance (one entry, one exit) - 100 mts SW from the main AP One camera on the S side of the complex - 75 mts S from the main AP One camera on the SE side of the complex - 200 mts SE from the main AP One dome PTZ camera on the NE side of the complex - 200 mts NE from the main AP One camera on the N side of the complex - 400 mts N from the main AP One camera in the club house 2 - 100 mts NW from the main AP One camera in the club house 1 - main AP is located here I asked provider one to look for some different software that could handle a larger array of cameras. Do you guys know if ZoneMinder or Exacq or some other type of software could do this: Once motion detection is detected on a camera that it will sound an alarm or turn on a light or something like that? Maybe we could just make a noise come from a viewer pc in the guard house? Thanks in advance, Regards, Nick

There are a total of 7 exterior fixed cameras (vga) and 1 dome camera (no megapixels cams - yet) I did have an idea last night. Since this is a residential complex we could mount the NanoStation / SkyConnector on the roof of the nearest home (since we need to get the power from that home anyway). I'm almost 100% positive that this would provide direct line of sight to the main access point. I'm not sure how these wireless products work but what I was hoping for was to have in both entrances a wireless receiver that connects to a router so we could have the ability to add more cameras to the network (entrances could eventually be equipped with cameras to capture license plates, one to monitor the interior of the guard house and another to monitor the office above the guard floor). If possible i'd also like the router to provide access to a work station that would be able to access the video via INTRANET (not www). I'm sure each client bridge will have a maximum bandwidth so it's understandable if we would have to run the work station on it's own wireless receiver. Is this possible or does each camera require it's own NanoStation? I would also like the same to be said for the club house 1 and club house 2. Currently we will only have one camera in each club house but it would be ideal to have 3 cameras in club house 2 and 4 cameras in club house 1 with one camera in each club house being megapixel. Being a computer programmer i'm always thinking ahead and that's one of the main reasons i'm all for the IP system. I also feel that the SkyPilot system is rather overkill. Do the Ubiquiti NanoStations require a proprietary access point like the SkyPilot or can you just use a DLink DIR-825 or the like and connect some high gain antennas? Thanks in advance! Regards, Nick

Hardwired sorry for the delay but thank you very much for taking the time to respond. I had a chance to meet with the exacq distributor here and he has come up with an expensive but very professional system. He is proposing the usage of a wireless system called SkyPilot. I'm a little concerned about this though considering the 1x SkyPilot SkyAcces (AP) is $4,936 + 8x SkyPilot SkyConnector Mini ($336 ea) are a total of $2,688. The nice thing about the above is that it's a MESH system which someone previously recommended seems good for redundency. I am curious does the Ubiquiti system require such an expensive AP? I emailed them and they suggested that we get the NanoStation M5's. Do we need a special AP to connect them like the SkyPilot system? The cameras they are quoting are Vivotek cameras and I've used that brand in the past and am happy with their products. The ones they are including are 7x - IP7330 and 1x SD-7151. An enterprise class server with Exacq software with the required # of licenses. Thanks in advance for your help! Regards, Nick

So i'm a little confused. I see that a lot of these wireless products use the 802 channel. What makes them different from consumer wireless? I'm curious because I work on my home network a lot ... Right now I have a DIR-825 (2.4ghz & 5ghz) system with a,b,g,n capabilities. If I installed DD-WRT I get channel 12, 13, 14 in addition to the 11 that are normally provided. Do the Engenius / SENAO / Ubiquiti wireless systems run on a different frequency from the 1-14 channels that are available for consumer usage? Thanks for your help this is the only point I wanted to clarify. Regards, Nick

Never mind I see that it's a commonly discussed Wireless solution here on the forum and often compared to Ubiquiti. So I guess this provider A is using a decent wireless product. The cameras seem to be the only issue really and maybe putting a slightly better camera will make his proposal the best. I did get another provider to come yesterday. They were recommended to me by an exacq sales person (I called to inquire about the software and they told me to talk to him). Hopefully on Monday i'll receive his quote and we'll see what the cost will be from there.

Thanks for your reply what does that mean? Are they good or bad?

Hey Guys! I spoke to the provider finally about all the recommendations here. Basically I misunderstood two things. 1. The cameras that he quotes are WiFi cameras but they will be connected via wire to a AP/CB which works on 2.4 ghz (Super G). 2. The Wireless product he proposes to use is made by SENAO : http://www.senao.com/English/Default.aspx?TYPE=vipplayercard.htm&PT=product_t&tv_TCAT_POS=0&PID=02010022&CATNO0=B&CNT=0 I did find out what software he will use on the NVR (Linux) which is called ZoneMinder : http://www.zoneminder.com/ Seems to be good but i'm not up to speed on the good and bad of the actual software so I don't know. In part this is why he wants to use the camera he quoted because it is compatible with the ZoneMinder software. I did see there are quite a few Cameras on the list that are compatible with the software and I told him today that the budget is a little more flexible now so maybe we can get better cameras. The foscom cameras are quite commonly discussed on the ZoneMinder forums and people seem to be fairly happy with their performance. What do you guys think about the wireless product? Have any of you used them before? I will probably send those companies that you guys recommended with the wireless products emails to get their recommendations based on the site plan. Thanks in advance! Nick

Guys thanks very much for all your replies! I have definitely set in stone that the IP system is the way to go. I also like the NVR (it has 1TB of space which should be enough), still waiting for find out what software it will have. The ANPR is certainly something we will do next round, currently we only have enough money to do the exterior but the nice thing about IP is that we can add as many cameras as we need Soundy: Thanks for your help, it's cleared up a lot of questions. You make a very generous offer Ted: Thanks for the link, they seem like a very nice product. hardwired / zmxtech: Thanks for your comments. Ubiquiti is a great recommendation and I have passed that on. I'll check back in when I meet with Provider A. I already sent him an email breaking the news to him that the wireless system he's suggesting won't quite cut it and provided him with some of the suggestions provided here. Lets see what he has to say

Matt, Thanks for clarifying and yes I think the wireless bridges you are talking about are the way to go. Can you recommend any that you have worked with in the past that provided good results? If we can't go wireless then we will need to find a good waterproof switch that we can buy quite a few of to get to where we need to go with wires. Either way I think the infrastructure is the key element here, because it really won't mater what cameras we get as long as we have the RJ45 connections setup then we can easily just change out the cameras, assign IP and wham done deal (I love the IP system too, very easy and scalable). If they do have some special channel it is probably consumer channel 14 or something like that but still on consumer frequencies. I'd send ya a plane ticket if I could convince the rest of the comity that we need a consultant but I doubt they would be game. Regards, Nick

Soundy, thanks for you continued support. What is it that you like about "Provider A's" plan better the fact that it's IP based or that it's based on Wireless? I checked the distances and the furthest camera is 162.68 meters and the closest would be 93.27 meters, this is taking into consideration jump points with routers (not direct from the machine room). There is another option which could work, run CAT5e in with the existing Cable TV wires and add a weather proof PoE repeater every 85 meters or so and pop out where and when needed. Like these: http://www.korenixsecurity.com/products/weatherproof-ethernet-switch/jetnet-2006-rj I found online some wireless solutions but it seems that I would spend around $8K just on the wireless equipment. Something like this maybe for the wireless: http://www.videotransmitters.com/Products/5-8GHz-Video_2 The fiber optic options out there are also quite expensive and NO one in the country really knows how to do that stuff very well also I can see the gardeners digging down to plant a tree or something and rupturing the wire.... I called bs too, I've been doing a lot of networking wireless and wired for years. I think he meant to say channels, like when you go on DD-WRT there are extra channels that not many people have but anyway it's still consumer grade. BTW funny enough my Grandparents live in Maple Ridge and I'm originally from Victoria / Vancouver. Now though, I live down here in Costa Rica. I'm not the installer either, I'm just a resident of the complex and part of the security comity which is reviewing the quotes etc. Thanks again for your help!

Hi guys, thanks for your replies. So I just spoke to "Provider A". The cameras he wants to install are these: http://www.foscam.com/ Model # FI8904W He claims that they run on a different frequency than home units but I don't see that at all in the specs. They look like cheap made in China electronics. Soundy: Thanks for the clarification. It makes sense that consumer products are not what we need here since there are SO many home and so many probabilities for interference. zmxtech: Thanks for putting it so blunt. I kind of felt that was the case but needed some conformation. Also it's important to note that we want this system to be expanded to cover the inner parts of the complex in future. Mainly more cameras in the common areas and inner roads so we can monitor whats going on. I guess that leaves me with two additional questions: 1. Labor aside if you guys were doing this what would you estimate the cost of the actual equipment to be, for this type of install be? 2. What type of equipment would you use and how would you set it up? (GeoVision PC?, NVR?, etc?) Maybe just some model #'s would be a huge help. Thanks in advance.