mike_va

For whatever reason, Axis has started assuming everyone knows how to make this work. They used to provide a lot more information.

We set the background...

also nice that I can cover the top of the culdesac for daytime plate capture with one 3MP camera (Pan 502, go for about $200 used on ebay). partial shot attached

CNB is actually set at a faster shutter speed, P1344 is at 1-30s. Lit up by a Raytec.

I did a quick experiment a while back, good coax vs. cat5 and cheap baluns. Coax was slightly better. Shielding of coax varies widely, usually stated as a %. For the trouble of coax I can see why people would do baluns. I also have some cheap coax from a box system which is not bad at all. Where you start to notice more probably is real environments - i.e. routed by noisy lines. I would not waste time upgrading cables if going to IP (even non-MP) is an option for you - MUCH better picture quality.

Is that with IR?

I've gotten better pics at night, even not using IR. Better contrast/focus. I suppose there is a little bit of IR from the house lights etc. Still every little bit helps at night. I've also used non-IR corrected with varying success, it depends. Also on MP cameras with a small sensor you can clearly see the focus shift even without an IR illum. If you can afford it and have day/night I'd do the IR corrected.

This is what we did with some domes. Got some 1/4" vinyl board at home depot. Cut a hole so you only see the dome. The 1/4 will fit right where the mesh plastic stuff is, that comes out in 10 or 12" pieces. The good news is once you do that, people coming over never notice the cams. P.S. I asked my girlfriend (and we have cameras all over our house) and she said "no".

Here are some party goers that were out on a night we did some testing (~75 yards, Axis P1344 Raytec RM100-10. Want to get this quality another ~25 yards out (on the sidewalk), and invisible. Analog cams (like the BBM-24F) can give even better sensitivity and contrast, but you get half that FOV for that resolution. However even having said that the light is just not getting out that far, seems to fall of quickly. The P1344 actually helps since it is a 1/4" sensor, so it is zoomed in more - I only have few lenses that go out that far. What I really need is a 100-150mm lens at f1.0...probably exists somewhere from some old spy operation. Anyone has a good idea on this one I'd love to hear it. I want enough detail to have an event dealt with by the police. Even given the lack of resolution someday may try the Axis 1602, saw some test results from that which were most impressive. The current setup is two Axis P1344 zoomed in a just a little more, giving complete coverage to the entrance to the culdesac. The other thing that is great is this setup does a great job of plate capture.

Actually 850nm and 950nm IR are completely invisibly for human eye. The "red glow" is visible because of little side peak of radiation of IR LED within the visible range. Thus, in theory, using special IR filters which cut visible range it would be possible to reduce the red glow. Such filters are used in photography, but they are expencive. There are filters of different density. I suppose the same filters are used in IR illuminators with incandescent lamp (like UF500). Did anybody try such filters with IR LED illuminators? now that I recall I did use the UF100 940nm .. that has LEDs I think . never opened it up. But it also had the same type of filter over the front of it that the UF500 did In fact all their IR lights use a similar filter, even the EX26 LED and the little EX12

Yes, the UF100 uses halogen and thus is probably a glass filter, due to the heat. The Bosch units some at least use black perspex 962, which allows some red glow through. Also tested some older Osram small 5mm black 940nm, which did not have a red glow. Maybe it was just distributed and less contribution from each. Did 9x to get a similar power to the 1A units. However, they also have slightly different curves so this makes sense.

I tried some, to no avail. You're right, it's that side peak like I posted the data from. The magnalight uses a borosilicate filter, maybe this is what the old Bosch used?

FWIW, just tested some osram 1A 940nm LED units (as it appears Bosch uses) and there is still a red glow...granted it is a lot less, but still.

Not quite correct, an IR bullet for example will give you reflections. Separate IR unit and camera thru separate windows should fine. I've got an outdoor IR, and inside camera is looking at it through a window. I've also verified that IR will go through the window. Note that glass blocks some IR, so will not be quite as sensitive.

fast. he said slowest under any conditions meaning if you can't set it fixed to a fast speed in the menu, it will revert to a slow shutter speed under low light. e.g. some Bosch have default shutter in addition to fixed. Default maintains that shutter as long as there is enough light, then slows it down. Fixed is just that, fixed period.

Try also reading the extreme cctv patent, it is great. #7016518 http://www.google.com/patents/about/10_097_936_Vehicle_license_plate_imaging.html?id=0ySVAAAAEBAJ

So. You can capture clear images of license plates using a "regular" camera, but it needs to be a pretty good regular camera. The following features are essential: * Fast shutter speed. 1/1000th of a second works well. * The camera must allow you to set this shutter speed as the slowest under any lighting conditions. * Progressive scan helps a lot, especially at larger capture angles. * For night-time capture, a good source of light is absolutely critical. * You also need a way to filter out the glare from car headlights. Commercial cameras typically use an IR-pass filter and an IR illuminator to solve the latter two problems. As you have probably realized by now, there's no way in hell you're going to get all that for $150. You could do it for $250: CNB BBM24F or Bosch 495 used ~$100, CNB MIR 10 deg IR unit ~$100, IR long pass filter ~50. I've had good luck with both those. I can't remember if the shutter speed can be set on a Bosch LTC0355 ~$5-10 used, if so you could do it for $150-ish. It helps if you shop for the steepest cutoff longpass you can find, if you get serious I can look up what I used I think it was from B&H, screwed on to the lens. Long pass cast material from Edmunds does not have a steep cutoff. Look for 087C material. Record at 2CIF expanded. Also depends how large of an area you are trying to capture, it worked best for me zoomed in to about the width of a car. Unfortunately I don't think you're going to find progressive scan in that price range. The CNB works really well for some reason, really brings out the contrast on the plates. Also it helped being up above the car, not right at headlight height. I can't remember for certain but the attached is I think with the cast longpass and a big Raytec but you're looking at much less distance. This pic is cropped somewhat to remove the entire plate.

I played with some Qsee and some of them had stains on the glass. I think it is from the plastic outgassing (think like new car smell). Cheap plastics will do that. Cleaned off with windex has not been an issue going forward. Wide angle is fine to see what is going on but make sure you get some narrow to get identification and make out plates.

As a point of reference, here is a partial crop on a Axis P3344 at 1-60s and 21dB, with and without the big Bosch. Where the culdesac curves on the right side is about 50-60 yards out. The IR is just on the ground at the right side of the pic, you can see the shadows.

The other remaining aspect will be if the lenses are corrected at 950 also... Wish Axis did like the 1080p Bosch and provided day and night auto focus points. The IR corrected lenses I have do provide a better picture at night even without an IR illuminator on. Wonder if anyone makes a 950nm corrected 100mm lens...May end up with separate day and night cameras.

It will be an interesting experiment. Osram says there is a tiny amount of red glow, 50-100x times less but we shall see. Edit - replaced pic with 950nm version oops

I'm building some IR devices, just to play around. Found some nice tight optics and the same IR units that Bosch uses in their newer units. Should be fun. The numbers above sounded maybe a little theoretical, it can be adjusted based on published numbers from Bosch Raytec etc. Going to try to get there, but I want to do it with IP cams so we shall see. I'll report back after I get something built. Decided to lay out some circuit boards. The only thing that nags at me is the HID unit, since if they can do a steep cut at 850 with no red glow as they claim then they might utilize the sensor a little better. Some of the plots I've seen show the CMOS is closer and 940 vs 850 than CCD. Time to see what can be done.

I considered the UF500 but it did not look like it could get there. It seems from the charts we can't quite hit the 300ft mark with these and the 940nm (50% loss)? What's involved in turning up the power? The Magnalight looks like it would do it at 1400' (with a tight but adequate spot), and it seems the HID has a lot more IR than halogens. Magnalight is a complete unknown to me. Bulbs look to be good for a year, and are not too expensive. Fairly low power consumption at 35W. Supposedly still a little better than LED's at output. They do have a return policy. The Bosch SuperLED model looks pretty cool though. This is something that would not be quite as easy to build, as they probably take wide angle LED's and set the angle with the optics. It would also sacrifice some distance but be wider than the Magnalight.

Interesting idea, but I'm trying to be invisible to the jokers that come and take the GPS in the middle of the night. It's fine being visible as a deterrent, but when it comes to prosecution I'd like as little connection as possible. A month or two ago, two guys walked down the culdesac (pretty rare) since enclosed and tried the neighbors car doors. As they were coming across I think they saw my dome cams and left. Two other times I've seen people inside cars down at the end of the culdesac rummaging around. Classic situation people around here have too much money (2nd median income in the country) and don't lock the car doors. So people know where to come for an easy GPS. They may have seen the IR units, but you have to know what they are. Anyway, just trying to be as invisible as possible to the neighbors, thieves and teen vandals... I like the idea though.

This person is me. It's pretty noticeable in a residential setting, it's gotten a lot of what the heck looks...