voip-ninja

Thanks for the input on Avigilon. What's the name of their iPad/Android app? I'd like to take a look at it to see what kind of reviews, etc, it gets. The lack of a Mac Viewer is a problem for me also, I have all Macs in my house.

The iPhone app for me is very reliable, but only if you use MJPEG for both live view and recording formats. If you use MPEG4/H264 it is extremely problematic resulting in having to log out and back into the app to do things.

I think that it depends on the installation location. My wife and I like the low profile and much more covert "look" of using IR and not having lights burning all night long all around the property. Long term, there is also some issue of cost, as, in some areas of the country electricity is .25 per kwh which means that running six 30 watt lights 12 hours a day, 365 days a year carries a cost of about $150 or more per year, which, while not a lot of money is also not chicken feed. Even in areas of the country where electricity is cheap, it will work out to something like $5-$10 per month in electricity costs. For comparison my IR illuminator pulls 10 watts and lights a huge area. Over a long enough period of time it will eventually break even cost wise versus using multiple 30 or 60 watt halogen flood lights.

Here's an example video of the TCM3511. From the video it looks like it is mounted about 10-15' up and it has the kind of night performance I get from the Samsung. Relatively good IR performance but only in a very limited area... totally unsuitable for a larger outdoor location. m3A_kUqev-o

Do you have motion video of the ACTi working with "zero light"? In my experience this is not possible. If it has IR emitters then the issue is what is the throw distance of the beam and what is the beam width. I have not yet seen a dome that is worth a damn when it comes to light up of a wide area with a 2.5-3mm lens angle.

It depends on the model of illuminator. Many budget illuminators have automatic day/night switches. Higher end ones can integrate with a camera and allow the camera to turn it on and off, and even to set the IR intensity.

It is Axton AT7, they make a bunch of different versions with different range and field of view, it has an automatic on/off switch for day/night operation. It was about $200. They make a higher end AT-8 that has more capability for variable intensity controlled by camera, etc. They also make some PoE powered versions, the two I mention are 12V power. I don't have any experience with the Samsung bullets, only the 5080R domes.

And here's the Axis P3364-VE with the Axton in basically pitch dark conditions other than itty bitty nights from the neighbor's garages. Nuut2cFzoJY

I think that the idea that you are going to get good IR performance at 50-60' with these cameras is unrealistic. While that is the maximum range, the IR is in a tightly focused beam and that's why if you want better performance you will need external IR. I have two of the 5080R Samsung cameras, and I use the IR in doorways. It actually works decently for its purpose, which is to record things like my dog waiting at the door, 12' away from the camera. You aren't going to get good facial recognition with IR though in most cases... I have just put an Axis P3364-VE in and the performance of it in the evening is quite good... but I am using an Axton illuminator in conjunction with it. Even without the Axton the PQ is pretty acceptable to me with nothing but my garage lights and street lights on. Without the external IR it would struggle when the garage lights are off as it's simply pitch black in my neighborhood at night. Here's a sample video of the performance of the 5080R with integrated IR, as you can see it does an admirable job providing lighting in a doorway, but it would be worthless if trying to cover a large area; 7JIUx8SSJt8 And here's the same camera with an external IR source; YuMN8szkhDA The bottom line is that integrated IR, in the products out there today is nothing but a crutch for installations where external IR is not possible... there's no magic bullet here, although the new Axis cameras that are supposed to have built in IR that has an adjustable beam pattern is probably a step in the right direction.

That's partly what irks me too. Most people here are residential users, but want to spend a little more. But reading bits and pieces here and there, "$3,000 per camera is a good budget....Oh yeah, don't forget license and server costs" Really? "Honey, can I spend $20,000 on cameras for the house?" I'm glad to know that I'm not wasting my advertising time on here preaching to the little guys. UPDATE: Talked to my wife and I did get approval for the $20k! She just said that I'll have to receive it over a 20 yr span. Well, for someone with a million dollar home and over $200,000 in personal property that kind of investment might not be unexpected.... it also comes down to what your goals are. In my case I live in a very safe and secure neighborhood but we do have a lot of people who come and go, as well as various people with access to the property (house keepers, dog walkers, contractors, etc)... so, for me, the security system is a little less about being able to get photo ID of "perpetrators" and simply keeping an eye on the place when I'm not around as well as being a general theft deterrent. Now having said that I probably could "get by" with something like the tacky Dahua cams with NVR for $800 that's available at my favorite big box retailer... however, I crave something a bit "better" and want better night time performance so instead I have spent about $1800+ on cameras and licenses.... so, spending another $200-$350 on better NVR software is not out of the question.

You are going to get burned using integrated IR unless you have a very narrow area that you want to cover. In my opinion you are better off going with external IR illuminators. My own personal experience with Vivotek FD series fixed domes with IR is that the low light quality was not particularly good and the integrated IR was pretty awful (tiny spot beam and terrible IR bleed). I am using some Samsung SNV-5080R cameras now and the spot beams aren't bad for monitoring a small area like a doorway or patio. I have an Axis P3364-VE with an Axton IR illuminator and that provides pretty good performance. Axton makes some illuminators that can have their gain adjusted/controlled by compatible cameras (Axis, etc).

Do they offer a demo? My biggest problem with these guys is the annual license fee. //edit. I see they don't support the two Samsung cameras I just paid $575 a piece for, so no sale.

Razer, Do they have a mobile application for iOS and Android?

I just want to comment that Alex was really helpful. I have an idea of what the pricing is and can make my determinations from there on if I want to demo the solution.

My issue with Avigilon's business strategy is that I'm not comfortable dealing with individuals I don't know and paying them whatever they think I can afford. That is how I interpret unpublished pricing. That's fine when dealing solely with large business and/or government-only products that are sold exclusively by sealed bid but, IMHO, isn't suitable for the average guy who wants to shop around because there isn't an Avigilon corner store near him to see things in person. Avigilon's reps would therefore have to be EXTREMELY professional and trustworthy for me to be able to judge whether or not I wanted to do business with them. I'm sure that there are others on here that feel the way I do and whose need and budget fits with a system that isn't sold in a dollar store. Again to my point this forum is not Avigilon's target customers. Now can we please go back to Q-See / Dahua products. The problem with that statement is that I started this thread asking for residential options for NVR software if I wanted to get something that was in some ways "better" than the Synology NVR that I am currently using, and as a point of comparison I mention that I tried to configure Milestone which has a 4-channel small business system license, including mobile server for about $199... and that's when the discussion of Avigilon as an alternative came up. I understand things are all secret with you guys, but if $199 is not in the ballpark then you are correct, it's not worth my time or that of some of the others here. If $199 however IS in the ballpark then I think you are wrong, there are many residential users who would consider paying a bit more for what would hopefully be "superior" software to the real budget offerings that are out there. For what it's worth, a 4 camera license pack on my Synology was about $125 which also puts it in the "ballpark" for home security enthusiasts like myself. So I'm very interested in what else is on the market that is in the $150-$250 type price range.

Those would normally be ports that you want to allow the camera to be accessed to from the internet. You would need to forward those ports on your router. Look at it this way.... I have DynDNS domain of "mycctv.webhop.org". That domain will be resolved to my current IP address on the internet. The camera has a port available for access, say that this port is 8080. So, the way I would access my camera from the internet is by typing http://mycctv.webhop.org:8080 into a web browser from the outside internet. HOWEVER - the router at home also needs to know what to do with this traffic because normally if it sees traffic come in on a port it will simply drop it. So, you need a rule in the router that forwards port 8080 to the IP address of the camera. To make sure that this is "always good" you probably want to use a static IP address with the camera, OR you need to set up a DHCP reservation for the camera so that it always gets the same dynamically assigned IP address from the router. As to specifics of your cameras setup, I can't help you... I don't know anything about that make/model camera and a google search does not provide a manual. You've gotten your .05 of free help for today (from me). Good luck.

I just got one of these 3364-VE cameras and installed it last night. I just want to append to the comments of the previous review, this is a VERY good camera. The quality, and the lens quality in particular at 2.5mm wide angle is good... I really appreciate the noticeably wider FOV when using this camera in a corner residential location as it lets me keep tabs on a larger area of my property. Night performance is head and shoulders above that of my Vivotek, and with my Axton IR illuminator it is quite impressive. The camera offers backlight compensation and also offers WDR. I'm still playing around with the settings to get the best image setting but already a big improvement over the Vivotek, which I will be selling soon. The Vivotek is the last camera I will own that requires manipulating little arms to set the focus and lens angle, I am spoiled by the one touch focus/zoom setting capabilities on the Axis and Samsung cams.

If the camera does not have built in DynDNS support then you will have to configure your home router for DynDNS and then use port forwarding to forward the necessary ports from the internet to the camera.

Well, he reviews quite a few mid-level cameras that people deploy in a small business or residential setting. So, with this in mind, I'm wasting my time looking at giving Avigilon a try? Check your PM I will try to call you tomorrow depending on my schedule. Sorry for the delays, super busy here for the past week or so.

Well, he reviews quite a few mid-level cameras that people deploy in a small business or residential setting. So, with this in mind, I'm wasting my time looking at giving Avigilon a try?

I would love to see a review as it saves me the time and trouble of trying something out that may or may not be a good fit.

Yep, no problem with the "wash out" effect on colors. But my questions remains, if i remove the filter, leaving NO filter in the lens, will it see IR ? Thanks Probably not. Generally the lens/board/sensor would be IR capable and then there is a mechanical filter that moves up and out of the way to allow the camera to see the IR spectrum in the evening. While most cameras probably have some visibility in this spectrum I am skeptical that any camera will provide a usable image if you simply replace the lens with one that has a mechanical IR cut filter.

Axis doesn't make a 2MP version that I am aware of. If you want to ID at 150' you might have to go all the way up to the 5MP version of the P33. They also make a 3MP version that you could try. Obviously cost goes up as the MP of the camera goes up and as Buellwinkle has repeatedly indicated the higher the MP of the sensor the worse the low light performance although in general Axis is supposed to be particularly good in this area. I have the P3364-VE on order and it will be here tomorrow (I will be using it in conjunction with an Axton IR for front monitoring of my home). I have a similar requirement to yours for monitoring of my residence, but in my particular case I don't need facial recognition, I just use the cameras for 'keeping an eye on things' when I'm not around. I do have 1MP 720P cams at the doors so that I can ID someone who is there. If I like how the P3364 works out I will get another 1-2 to monitor other home entry points like the sides of the home where there is better lighting at night.

I am already planning on replacing the Vivotek with an Axis P3364-VE 6mm. What does the core license cost? Also, do they provide their own mobile app? Cost of a 4-channel license for Milestone is about $199 and supports connections from 5 simultaneous viewers. Each additional camera is $50 and it can go up to 26 cameras. Their mobile app is really really good and the mobile application is actually a pretty easy setup. I gave up on the install because I was having some problems getting a couple of their applications working on my network, but I might take another whack at it later today.

I ended up uninstalling Milestone for the moment, although I am tempted to get an inexpensive box to run it on and see what I can do with it. I was having some issues with using their access client on machines other than the host. I suspect some kind of buggy problem with using non-standard ports for this (my box was already using port 80 for something else). I might try to install it again if I can scrape up some more hardware... the mobile client is pretty neat. It did seem sketchy about access to the Samsung cams though, I did not dig into things enough to find out how big of an issue it really is.