rory

Can you get me a price on this? http://www.marchnetworks.com/products/3108dvr.asp It is a wall mounted panel type, what ive been looking for, for homes etc. Thanks Rory

if the price is right, then its good, but Ive tried before with no luck to get any pricing from march networks, and noone is really selling them online yet, So i guess they have a way to go yet, at least in marketing.

i woulnt mind getting my hands on one of those kodicom 4 ch DVRs with the built in LCD hey allan, I just quoted McDonalds Bahamas on CCTV (using the storesafe), will wait to see what happens )

Dont know about the questions regarding the PC cards, but: "Do you forsee a time when GeoVision, for example, will stop making DVR cards for PCs? If we put together a PC-based system now, will it be obsolete in two years? Will the manufacturers still offer support" More than likely alot of todays DVRs, stand alone or PC will ne next to obselete in 2 years, or if they are not, will require some kind of software update, be it a bin file for Eprom on a stand alone, or a windows software update on the PC. Hardware will also be different as it has changed already considerably over the past couple years. Technology changes, thats just how it is. Your windows computer and its software will be 'old' in 2 years, in fact I replace mine every 6 months-1 year max. Same can be said with alot of electronics today, they will more than likely still work fine, and if its a big name brand, still carry support, so updating it will be up to you. "I would prefer the stability of a standalone system, but the fps rates seem woefully inadequate compared to the rates available with the DVR cards, especially considering how much more the standalone systems cost. When are the fps recording rates of standalone systems going to catch up with that of the PC DVR cards? " I have no problem with the pps on the stand alones i use, 30pps being the norm, it is the standard in most stand alones today, and works well for me, high quality playback. But yes, I would like to have faster recording, of course ) Hopefully the embedded software will catch up in that area, no doubt it eventually will. It is definately not inadequate, it is still what is being used in most high end installations world wide, banks, retail, etc, even casinos use time lapse on most fixed cameras, and still use tape!... But its up to you, if you want the ease and stability and low/no maintenance of a stand alone (rememeber stand alones come in windows, linux and embedded OS, embedded being the best for stability, but cost more, and a few less features), its up to you how much work you want to do over the next 2 years, and if they can afford it and the stand alone has all the features they need, then go for it. If their budget doesnt call for it, or its just like a home system, then PC card all the way. Ive had 2 Kalatel embedded systems going almost 2 years now, with only 1 EPROM update, and no maintenance, and they are still going strong. 3 others going a year with no return to service them. The only issues I have had is with my local Cable ISP's bandwidth/uptime and thats not DVR related (we are in the 3rd world here!) DVR australia has tried the ones I have and plus alot of PC cards, so he may be able to help some more on this. And AVCONSULTING has had years and years in the industry, plus has used all of them also, so these guys would be better at answering most of your questions. Just my 2cents from a stand alone point:-)) Rory

a PC is never stable, no matter what you do to it. Linux may be different, never used it. Anything electronic can freeze up, its up to you.

The ones Im talking about have LAN and Remote Video

no, but its more a webcam than cctv, but interesting.

I have 2 places online using a seperate mux and DVR, and they work great. But make sure the DVR supports the brand of mux that you have, Kalatel's DVR only supports the big name brands. Actually the Kalatel single channel is 60pps recording, while the all in one is 30pps. But then I have noticed that 2.5pps on the all in one looks equivalent to 5pps on the singel channel DVR.

havent tried it nor sell it, i use their other cameras which are very good.

yep, that was the one i meant, great products

quality is generally better on a stand alone, but you will get longer recordings and faster on a PC, but stand alones will normally be alot more stable, as its a machine, not a PC. Most stand alones use SCSI hard drives, and do not allow you to switch drives yourself.

ok, windows based versus a machine based, doesnt take much to figure out which one is more stable. High quality embedded DVRs cost alot more than PC cards, for alot of reasons.

price budget depends where you are buying from. what type of cameras and where are you buying from? Also, how fast a recrding are you looking for, like 5pps being the most common for retail stores on a multiplexe/DVR. That being spread out among all 16 cameras, but it is still good recording. The stand alone is simple to install and requires no maintenance, and is almost as stable as a coffee machine If you are buying a standalone like a Kalatel StoreSafe, with 16 cameras you will need a 160Gb to do 7 days on 5pps in a 24/7 retail store with motion detection programmed, but you can get away with 2.5pps as it is all in one, then you would only need the 80GB. Price is much higher though than a PC based system.

if you want stability, and reliability, you should use a standalone with an embedded os. How long do you want to record for?

ok sounds good. i still wanna try your stand alone when you are able to release more info, i know i can take your word for it that its good Something I can sell here, as 90% of this island is poor or cant afford the higher priced Kalatel units. Alot of the standard retail/homes dont need all the features. Rory

dont get me wrong, jackie rules! ))) Id like to beable to write my own gui though as I stil dont like the look of theirs, i mean the colors and icons, the program itself is ok. Does Geo do a stand alone, just wondering?? Rory

'You have to be kidding me... I mean agree the main screen looks pretty tacky, they wont change it, because they think it is their industry recognition, but the remote software looks heaps better than Kalatel C'mon you can not be serious.' I dont need anything that looks flashy, thats why i moved away from DM, I like basic to the point software that works fast and easy I havent seen any asian stuff that looks normal, its all too pink, green, different colors, too much, kind of like what you see on Jackie Chan movies! )))

the one you sell sounds interesting, but you wont tell me what it is! Maybe we can sell it over here, import direct from australia? Rory

1-Most corner shops do not have a lan, infact most would not have one! A-then they can buy a video printer I havent seen any other embedded DVR with a print button either way. 2-I have one that does and yes that is a downfall of embedded systems. A-Havent seen and non linux and non PC embedded systems. 3- I have one that does A-No high quality ones do that. 4-Geovision sends a video stream, or a picture or an email or a text and on its own motion detection. there is no control room softwer, video streams are instant where emails aren't and snapshots are no where near as accurate as a real automatic stream. A-Sends streaming video to your email?? Also, if it sent clips to your email on motion, youd be getting a ton of email. 5-Hate to burst your bubble but all those components in the box are actually all asian, it is an Asian DVR as I can see, just rebadged for GE. Bloody best embedded software I have seen though for the price. A-maybe, but its still not an Asian DVR 6-As mentioned, mine does 100Fps. A-Linux? 7-To make this statement you have not tried Geovision! It is worth writing home about. Sadly! A-it has awful tacky looking software though, from what I have seen on the browser based version. 8-I will wait for a price I know dealers buy at $2,200 US I will wait to find out what our buy price is.. bet it costs more in the US as it is easier to drop ship from Asia! A-its built in the US, unless they are manufacturing them in Australia also. When i order them, they make them directly at GE in the US, to order.

yes but what embedded software does yours have, linux right??

Quote:Recording of audio is only available if you wish to record at 1Fps this is very lame and infact it will not even record the audio if your using motion detection and it does not detect any video motion. Actually, it means you have to have at least one video channel set to 1pps or higher, which means you cant record audio if all video channels are recording less than 1pps, so you can record audio at 10, 20 or 30 pps settings, etc.

oh yeah, it was originally designed only as a 4 channel DVR,and eventually grew to a 16 channel, I imagine they will eventually update the recording speeds. Oh yeah, the print server only costs like $100 last time I checked, or like all CCTV systems (non PC) you can add any video printer, or use the LAN and included software.

1-The system is SOOOOOO easy to use, the manual makes perfect sense. A-YEP, thats why I like it, no going back! 2-The system is SOOOO easy to back up, the best I have seen yet! The system records a very large resolution and quite high quality The system can calculate your storage so that when you make changes to the system it will calculate your storage days for you. A-yes, there are many options for back up and/or archiving. 3-There is no need for a mouse or keyboard and to be honest it is very smart in how it uses the front panel buttons. A-the DVMRe's and DSR have actual labels for what button is what, but you can quickly get use to which one is what which is ok. 4-I will post more info after preliminary tests, I must say it is an excellent unit, but I am still waiting on the price of it, I am thinking it wont be cheap. A-probably at least twice the price of an asian DVR. 5-I imagine my standalone is about half the price but only has 3/4 of the features, I would say this is one of the best featured standalone units I have seen, however it is pretty darn slow at 25fps, even the rep told me he was dissapointed about this, however they do have plans for a new faster one. A-must be a limit in the embedded OS they use, most brand name embedded DVRs only use this speed. I have only seen linux and PC systems with faster than 30fps (its 25fps in PAL, 30 in NTSC) 6-Overall it looks pretty solid, but as mentioned remote features have not been tested yet and that is where PC's usually are better. I was very dissapointed with the speed as this is a major downfall. A- let me know, i have demo alot of PC software but havent seen any extra features worth writing home about ) Though you can view multiple sites in one window with up to 64 cameras at once, in WaveReader, which is pretty cool.

-------------------------- 1-From opening the box I noticed it is an ugly grey colour but not that this is important, The biggest downfall of the unit is that it only records at a very slow 25FPS, this is a bit slow for 16 cameras in my opinion, mind you I do tend to overkill a little. A-Yep, but thats how all embedded systems are, also, it does allow you to program each camera at different record speeds for activity, alarm and time lapse. I like the dark grey color, but the CD-RW is a different color which could have been made to be the same color! 2-The system will not automatically frame buffer like Geovision, however it will event buffer to what you set it to. There are only two levels of password so you can not turn of each feature for several users, therefore it is not as flexible in this regard. The system will not allow you to print pictures without a printserver, which is pretty lame but I Imagine all standalones have this problem. A-Not directly, but using the included software it will allow multiple passwords, groups etc. By connecting it to the LAN, you can also print from your PC just like in a PC based, or save/burn to your DVD-RW or CD-RW. 3-The maximum number of relays and outputs is 16 and as far as I can see they can not be stacked for say 30 or so individual relays. A-Havent used those features yet, so you may be right. 4-One of the big downfalls is that it will not play in standard windows media players as it is not recorded as a straight AVI file. A-Nope, most embedded will not, for security reasons, however, it comes with a software program (quickwave) that will run without installation, very small, and will play the video saved to your PC, so you just copy that to the CD. You can also do what I do and use something like cam studio to capture it as an AVI file. But yes, that feature would be nice to have built in as an admin add on. 5-There is no multiplexed option on the second monitor and it must be used as a switching monitor only. A-No, only on the DVMRe models, they cost more and are the higher end units, but they are not as compact as the StoreSafe. Most muxes/embedded DVRs on the market (big name brands) only have 1 multiplxed monitor A and a Spot monitor B, I guess its an the embedded software issue. 6-The system will only zoom 2x as this is the limit. There is no automatic control room where camera video streams can be sent by an event automatically. A- you can have alarm inputs set to send an email or message. Therefore you will need something like an alarm system, motion or beam. 7-I could not get 1 camera to record at 25fps at high resolution, however I guess at lower resolutions you might be able to. A-Havent tried that with the StoreSafe, will take a look. I know the DSR-2000 will do 60pps (but then it is only a 1 channel DVR) 8-Recording of audio is only available if you wish to record at 1Fps this is very lame and infact it will not even record the audio if your using motion detection and it does not detect any video motion. A-yep, only if it is recording, in other words, will not record audio if there is no video being recorded. As for speed, ill have to check, i only have used the DSR-2000 with audio so far, which will record audio at 10pps or more. 9-I assume the major disadvantages will come when I test the remote capability, but these are the ones I have found by playing with the unit. A-let me know, I like the software more than any PC based ive used yet, it just feels more powerful. -------------------------------- Remember, the StoreSafe is the economical model of the Kalatel DVRs, the DVMRe's may differ some, as well in price though! I still prefer it though over the DVMRe's for its small compact size, you can fit it into any DVR/VCR lockbox, which is a neccessity these days, at least around here.

so how about 60pps for 16 cameras from a professional embedded DVR ) and even more expensive, but it is more professional, more stable, and maintenance free