rory

I hold the same quals, not that paper quals mean anything at all, you are both right, less exploits with ME and it can be shelled very nicely, but it is not faster than XP not buy a long shot!

 

2000 is actually the fastest and 2000 server the most secure, that I have used anyhow. In my opinion ME was the worst OS ever written, but at least it doesnt get attacked every day!

 

Depends on the file system that you are using.. some DVr cards run OK on 98/ME but most will actually capture slower on those two OS.

Ive installed XP and ME, on a ton of PCs, and XP is still much slower, by more than double. NOW, if you are running it on a 1.7+ Ghz CPU, then ok, anything will run fast, but running on 900Mhz and less, way slower than ME. 2000, the slowest ive seen yet (appart from NT), they hog memory like its going out of style.

Ofcourse i use my computers as web servers for writing code and testing it, and win me running PWS is soo much faster than testing on IIS on Xp or 2000. And graphic editing proggies is also faster in ME. XP would never run on this 600Mhz, 128MB Ram, 2GB HD, laptop i am using ME on right now.

Id like to run 95, the fastest ever other than DOS and linux etc, if these darn manufacturers hardware would support it! )

reminds me of a local electronics company here, that sell some cheap cameras, i told them a price of one of my cameras, and they say they sell theirs for a 1/3rd of the price....but, there is a huge difference between the 2 cameras, mine work and give a great image, whereas they have not even tested theirs yet to see what kind of image it gives, they are only using it inside a shop lights on day and night, and outside the shop in full street lighting! Plus, they only sell 3 cameras, BW, Color, Color w/IR ... quads w/ monitors and VCRs!

I could also buy a camera from eclipse cctv for 1/2 the price of theirs also, but it isnt any good!

I can get em even cheaper but who would, you need a proper array if they are to work for more than 10 Mtrs and then they are so obvious, I am with Rory all the way Extreme make the best ones I have seen, however you can buy very lowlight cameras and cheap yard lights that would be much cheaper and less obvious.

yep, yard lights are better, for security also. I tell you one thing, doubt id ever sell the UF500 leds again, way to0 much over kill, they give out IR from 400 feet and more, you can feel the heat standing 15 feet in front of them, and can feel the light on your eyes anywhere within 20-30 feet, but thats the high end LED Bulb, not their 150' Leds which you dont feel anything from.

Ganz are about o release a day/night version of the dome

yeah, since this post, ive turned away from the ganz product, its probably real good, but a BW version for $450 US Wholesale (including outdoor ceiling mount), compared to $300 for the sanyo and kalatel versions, Id have to stick with the later. Heck they are all 1/4" anyway so i doubt the image will be much better than any other 1/4" ive seen. Actually the cheaper Provideo has 1/3" lens for like $180 BW outdoor Dome (fixed lens though).

ME still is the best OS since 95, for speed. Like all windows OS's, tweaking is a must. I still dont know why everyone doesnt like ME, gives me less problems than 98 ever did, and is faster than XP (and way faster than NT and 2000). I have XP running on a few machines also, tweaked but still cant top the speed of the ME. I guess some people like having to install 50 security patches to XP, not me! )

Windows me!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

 

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGG

 

 

See, I also have the luxury of holding a A+, MCSE, CCNET, and a Network + Certifications, so I I'm qualified to say..........

 

 

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGG

 

 

Man you need to move to Aussie land... less taxes.

I would not say that all standalones are more expensive, I can buy a complete standalone DVR for the price of a Geo card.

Just takes a long time to find a good supplier.

All are more expensive here in the US side of the world. The stand alone DVRs here are primarily designed for industrial applications while the PCcards are geared towards budgets and home users.

Damm, I get COLOR/BW 24IR bullet cameras for $69 each US>.

That is cheap, but either way, its not the type of Infrared you get with ExtremeCCTV products. Ive used the IR bullets from Provideo, a litle more expensive than $69, and they dont see very far, if any, outdoors in pitch dark. I would never use them again for Infared Applications.

As Rory has mentioned above, Extreme CCTV make some amazingly robust cameras, where are you located I am in Australia, it says you are from the land of Oz, does that mean Australia?

 

As for Extreme's range, they are great but not cheap, it would be more cost effective to just mount the camera in an environmental housing, you can mount them in a heated one if you are concerned about the snow, hell you can even get them with wipers on the front and they arent all that expensive either, If you use the right housing then you can have any camera in there you like.

 

Snow = Glare therefore a bullet camera wont cut it for you (No Auto Iris), In all seriousness, the word quality and robust does not go with the word cheap! Simply put: if you want it to last dont buy cheap gear, there are a lot of products claiming low light but most high res chips in Colour cant handle it unless you pay the money for a DSP Digital Wide Dynamic Camera (which mind you I would strongly suggest) I sell these for around $650 Australian and if you go for a varifocal lens then it wont matter too much where you put the camera.

 

One thing to note will be your white balance settings, if you have snow then there will be a lot of light reflection and a lot of scene whiting, you may get away with a Day/Night camera but If you can afford it go for a Wide Dynamic Cam.

 

I know I will draw some flack for this comment but: IR does not really work, unless you pay big bucks, it is hardly justified and will only work for B/W and small areas, you would be better off with the Day Night cam.

 

PC based systems are by far the best for networked operations and allow for easy upgrades and I highly recommend them, however if you cant use computers much or want more stability a standalone device will serve you well.

 

IP67 rated cameras can be hosed down without need of a housing and you can get some from Ganz that have low temperature ratings and Varifocal Built in Lenses.

 

You should be looking at around $550-$600AUS for a Day/ night option, fully kitted with lens and heated Housing and around $850-$900 for a Japanese wide Dynamic with the same options.

 

The best suggestion I can make is only buy Korean or Japanese, stick to sony chips and only use PCI cards if you know computers.

 

Geovision makes the best of the PCI cards that I have seen.

 

Hope this helped.

In the IR area, ive installed the extreme IR products, and they really do work But yes, they are expensive, and wear some shades when you install / test them at night! But only use IR if you really have to.

The IR bullet cameras, normally have 6-24 IRs, dont really work, at least outside. Tehy barely give you 15 feet of LED and its limited. With the Extreme LED products, you can see objects defined out to 100+ feet.

Not the best pic, as it was taken with Flash on from a digital camera, but it can give you an idea. Using IR lighting is nothing like using yard lights though as the yard lights will give you a much better image, no matter how much IR Light you have, as IR light can give off alot of glare on certain objects. Image shown below is actually 100' pool area in pitch dark, using Extreme CCTV's Ex82 ($1250) day night camera with LEDs. I also installed a day night sanyo camera in a regular housing, with 2 Extreme UF500 Infrared LEDs, amazing image in pitch dark (dont have a picure of that yet, none are online yet).

I tried to install your software, howver the first time it appeared to have a missing codec and I only got black pictures, then I tried the other one you recommended but it did not install cleanly and then it wrapped itself around my Sys32 files, which my system did not like at all. It crashed my computer and I had to do a system restore. I will admit though my system is a little different to most so it could just be me. Do they have simple webview yet?

hi, they dont. I made one but i took it off the web, wont br back on for a week or so.

Theyre software should work, im using it on a 600mhz windows me laptop with no issues. Ill let you know when the browser software is back up.

Just an idea. There really arent any good forums out there, google's forum is full of spam and no moderation, i think it would be a good thing to have and label it a sister site or something. Maybe get advertising from alarm resellers to pay for the site.

If you are interested i can help with ideas on forums. Id do it myself but i dont have the cash (or credit card) for the monthly fee. My current host only charges $10 pm for 150GB of storage by the way, mostly ASP hosting, maybe PHP also. (www.discountasp.net). I still have 2 sites on my old host a $22 per month but will switch soon enough.

Rory

happy holidays, dont drink to much (or at least not more than me!), and have fun

Lets see who has the best reputation?

Most Polular Per the internet stores:

Stand Alones:

Kalatel

Dedicated micros

Everfocus(arghh, heard not that good software, but cheap)

PC Based:

DigiVue

Most Polular Per this Forum Members:

Geovision (PC Based)

Vitek CCVT DVRs (stand alone)

Kalatel DVRs (Stand Alone)

Alnet DVRs (new submission - awaiting test info)

As far as reputation goes, id have to say looking at how long they have been around, reviews on the web etc, Kalatel, Dedicated Micros, and Geovision, probably have the best reputation.

BUT, that doesnt mean they ARE the best, or that you should go with them, there are others, AND other new DVRs coming out every day. Im just going by what is out there in reviews, sales, links etc, on the internet so far. Ive yet to test the Alnet, Phillps, Pelco, Sony, Vicon, Teleplex, Provideo, or even the lower priced Everfocus.

If ive left one out PLEASE let me know!

Rory

ALNET VDR-S RT

 

480FPS, both Recording, and Playback..

 

Only $1499.99

Hi Herminshs (whats your real name that you want us to address you by?

How many channels is it, can you post the link again also, thanks

The 480FPS has me interested, is it one of those i posted a link to to their demo that was almost real time Remote video??

Rory

I honestly like to use the PC based a little more than the other's they are better managed, and they sell better because they are cheaper, and more manageble.

The only advantages a PC based has over a stand alone embedded system is:

1-Lower Price

2-Higher Frames Per Second

In the new stand alone DVRs, they have all the featiures of the PC based, though like i Said, they cost much more. But for a business, quick and easy installation, no maintenance, and stabiliy, is priority over lower pricing, so I stick to the stand alones. I can build PCs and actually do, and service them, but Id never quote a DVR for one, as I dont want the stress ) But much respect to those guys who do and do it well, its a hard job!

Me, im tired of hard time comsuming jobs, so ill stick to the ready built ones with no maintenance.. )

However im willing to sell 1 PC based DVR in my new CCTV store, so ill be looking around in the next month or so. Will keep it geared towards home users.

Either way they are both expensive time as they land here in the Bahamas after high customs import tax and shipping costs. Yep, we are tax free, but thats because we pay tax on anything that comes in the country already! For example, we pay 50% duty on cars & 65% on eletronics, of the orginal US price. Cameras are actually only 15% duty, but they change it all the time and make up their own price at time of shipping.

Hi, guys- Glad I found this place!

I'm going to install a video system for protection of a home/shop complex, primarily for burglar security. Two intrusions is three months has got my attention. Our police aren't very interested in field investigation, so if I basically catch them on video (and of course ask for their address and phone) perhaps I can get them arrested.

 

Being new at CCTV, I'm finding lots of claims, a huge spread of prices, and not enough facts! I'm looking for bullet-proof operation and longevity. I'm also trying to do this on a reasonable budget. Here's the application-

 

No more than eight cameras needed. Probably 4 or 5 of these would be outside, and at least 2 of those be IR style. Various distances and angles of view are needed, so I know I need to select each camera for the particular location. I'm in the central plains. We do have some ice and snow to contend with, but all cameras would be under a roof overhang and thus have some protection.

 

Camera Questions- Which camera brands should I look for- which ones should I avoid? Recommendations on the best weather-proof cameras? Good sources where one might find a variety of lens options? Best pricing?

 

 

The real question is what kind of system to put in. I have an existing network installed and want to be able to tie in to view from both house and shop office locations. From what I have found so far, the performance is going to depend on the platform (PC or server type, I can build either one myself), the DVR card system used, and the soft ware that runs it.

 

So, I'm looking for your recommendations on those items- primarily, whose card is best, whose software best for my application?

 

Any other things that a newby needs to know appreicated too. I try to do my homework, and it helps to ask those who have gone before!

 

Thanks

 

Don

Fighting Crime in the Land of Oz

Hi, Welcome.

Best weatherproof, corosion resistant and Infrared Cameras I have found, made by ExtremeCCTV.com. They arent cheap, but they work. I had other Infrared 'so called' cameras before but they didnt do the job. I then installed some day night IR EX82 cameras, cost is expensive, but they work ($1250 wholesale) They see 100' in pitch dark outside (150' tops). They are color/BW, the BW version isnt much cheaper, though there are 75' BW versions (50' outside) that ARE cheaper. If you need more info on them, some clips, let me know ill send you a link. I have the EX82 on the ocean side here in the Bahamas, no corrosion what so ever, work perfectly. Previous bullet cameras rusted away!

As for recording, id recommend GE Interligix simple to install, maintenance free, stable, STORESAFE DVR. Its stand alone. Pricing isnt cheap like a PCI card though. Depdning on how long you want to recrord for, the price will change. Base price wholesale is approx $2000 for the 10 channel 40 GB. They go up to 250GB. 8 cameras on a 40GB at 2.5pps will give you approx with motion 7 days in a 24 hour enviroment such as a gas station, so youd get more in a home enviroment, 250GB will give you appox 2 months recording at 2.5pps. If you lower the record speed, you get longer. Check out this link: http://www.bahamassecurity.com/ms/dvr/default.asp. Note, cat is not updated recent yet so pricing is lower, plus those prices are retail listed here in the bahams, more than the US.

For non Infared I would get some good BW High Res Traditional Digital Cameras, in weatherproof housings, Kalatel has a line called Cam Plus, and housings to go with them. Get an Auto Iris DC CS 3-12mm Lens, Fujinon sells them, or Tamron. Then you can adjust the lens upon installation.

Id go with BW if you are primarily concerned with night time, if you have a couple extra dollars, you can get a Day Night (color switches to BW at night), normally about $100 more each camera. A low light color camera can work also, if there is some lighting, but you loose video quality in low light, though you will see colors of cars, shirts, etc, unlike with BW or Day Night. Standard color camera will not see much of anything in low light.

For indoor, a traditional high res Color digital camera will give you the best picture, but a mini dome will be more discreet and less need to clean the lens, only the dome cover rarely, i have had some domes in for over a year and they have no dust yet nor need cleaning, indoors. Kalatel also has some for this if you want, or any other high res is nice. To save money you could get a standard res for indoor, but outdoor id recommend high res.

Let us know if you need more info, ask some more questions, some others will reply with recommendations also. They are all good, take a lookaround and pick something that fits your budget.

Once again i have recommended the NON PC based system, much easier to set up and maintain. But thats up to you and your budget. These Kalatel DVRs can connect to the LAN (or phone) and you can watch live and recorded video remotely over the WAN or LAN, and you can use a router as i recently just did with a couple. I Have some images if you want to see them for review (PM me on that)

Ofcourse if your budget is really tight, you could always install BW Bullet cameras all around, add a couple IR LEDs where you want to see in the pitch dark (extreme CCTV or whizkid has some LEDs only that are not too expensive). The BW Bullets range from $90-150 Wholesale, each. IR LEds will depend but may be somewhere in the $300 each range. Then you could just use a PCI card which will also save on cost. I dont sell or install them butsomeone else here can help you if thats the way you want to go.

Good luck, and have fun, thats what it is all about to me. Coming over from computer work and alarm work for years, CCTV is actually fun, compared to the rest, especially when it is used remotely over the internet

Rory

You can get cheap PC units that will be much better than any standalone product but yes, operating systems if not set up correctly can cause problems and windows does have some issues, howver 90% of the bad image PC platforms have are from people who do not know how to use them!

 

What are people doing wrong in setting up the operating systems. Or are you just talking about certain cards not working right?

 

Any suggestions?

 

Brad

Its called WINDOWS, its just not a stable OS, even with win2k or NT. Stand Alone DVRs (non PC based) are machines, using embedded OS's, much more stable, they dont crash and require no maintenance.

However, what DVR australie is atalking about (was as this is an old topic) is that you can tweak a windows OS and it will be more than 3 times faster than it is by default. Most people just leave it like it is, or run other programs such as MSN, AOL, instanr messanger, or have 50 other programs on start up, ALONG with streaming video, which just crushes the windows kernel, he doesnt like all that stuff!

I was given this site from one of the news groups with high recomendations.

I have no idea what I need. Basically the more I read the more confused

I get. This is what I want, a 2 camera system for the front and back of my

house for security. Now I don't know what cameras to look at. I would like

to have it all linked to a dedicated PC. The cameras will be mounted outside.

Any suggestions or help??

 

TIA

What is your budget, that really helps in deciding what cameras and system to go with

There are so many variations of pricing depending on the product you choose.

2 cameras is sought of not a standard in CCTV, but can be done, but you will see 2 blank screens if using a quad view (4 way). they basically come in 1 way, 4 way, 7 way, 9/10 way, 13 way, 16 way, 32 way. (some others are available like 8 way etc depending on manufacturer and product selected).

Muxes/Quads/DVRs etc, come in 1 channel, 4 channel, 9/10 channel, or 16 channel, normally. If you want to record you will need to choose from one of those, If just for observation, that is entirely different.

let us know some more and we can help.

Is it outside and if so is there sufficient lighting?

Do you require vandal proof?

Do you need any annunciation inside your home upon motion on a camera?

Do you need to see in pitch dark?

How long do you want to record for, if you want recording?

Do you want a stand alone DVR system, easy to install & stable, or will you prefer to build your own dedicated PC? Price difference is that stand alone DVRs are normally alot more that PC based DVRs. The stand alone non PC DVRs are normally maintenance free and plug and play.

Cheapest way would be a couple BW bullet cameras with a BW quad (no a computer of DVR), and plug it into your RCA input on your TV, and record to your regular VCR using a 8-10 hour tape (needs changing every 8-10 hours, a time lapse would spread out the rocording over more hours or days, Kalatel has a VDR which is same price as Time Lapse VCR and is digital recording)

Let us know some more info, Rory

Does your camera support 500ma? Alot of smaller 12v DC cameras only require 200ma or 300ma.

is it run anywhere near lighting, i found that can cause interference, though Ghosting, dont know if it will cause that.

Whats a barral plug? (sorry just wondering) Is it a BNC-RCA adaptor?

Have you tested the RG59 to make sure you have good voltage and no interference?

Have you tested it direct into a monitor without going into the mux/quad/processor?

Like Alan said, sounds alot like a connection issue. Ive spliced some cameras before, Im not sure if what I had was ghosting, whatever it was it caused sideways lines. Turned out to be bad power boards on the micro lens cameras (in other words cheap power boards! in some expensive GBC ceiling mount cameras also!)

Ofcourse I have spliced many others without any issues at all (but i only splice when I have no other choice)

TO all installers and dealers, just answer me this:

 

Would you pay $45 for a dome camera, color, sharp CCD, .01 LUX, 420 TVline 3.6 lens, small, black case, 1 year warranty?

 

How about $75 for a 12 LED, same as above spec, but in a Bullet case?

 

Or maybe $199, for a Sony Chipset, 24 LED infra, the new 920mm LED's, 400TV Line, .001LUX, ARMOR DOME,(nice one too).

 

 

Just asking, I'm setting up my business as a small distributor, so please, help out, thanks!!

Yes, but you are too far for north for me )

I may want to buy from you anyway, in the near future, to check out those cameras you mention. Do you have them on your site?

Thanks

Rory

COLOR BABY!!!!!

 

MY website is currently under development, by the way, Thanks for making this forum

color, cool, what brand is it, indoor/outdoor? price of dome by itself?

thanks

Also, larry is the creator of this forum

Ok, thanks for the tip. Is that true even in my own home? If someone steals from my home and I have audio along with the video of them stealing, might I still be in trouble?

not in this country. I have a local retailer here recording audio. But our laws arent the same so you may need tocheck with your local laws. Actually video is not yet submissible in court here, its only useful that the police here know all the criminals by face and they are repeat criminals, so they can ID them from that, plus the retail owners can catch in house theft, even if not useful in court. One day they will 'eventually' change the laws here, but ..

This christmas, i havent seen a traffic cop yet, ive driven all over the island, back and forth, all day, and not in 2 weeks, 1 traffic cop! People in the past few days have been running red lights like its free. Plus there is no drinking and driving law, so 95% of drivers are drunk!!

I thought I was in the twighlight zone today! Still people running lights! (not me, i do 50mph when i see people running the light, i dont mind wrecking this POS car I have now, legitally so I can buy a new one ) PSS - Im not drinking and driving right now

Rory, how many audio channels can the StoreSafe record? Also what type of files are backed to the CD/RW and do they play back audio? I think the StoreSafe is a great idea, just wish someone would come out with the exact same thing at a reduced price.

Hi Alan

Only 1 channel in and out (i think, would have to check the specs, havent had to use that option on the StoreSafe yet). Yes, you can playback recorded audio on any medium it records to. It will only burn to the CDRW when you select to save a recorded section of video, they are in the WaveLet format specific to the Kalatel DVRs, extension is .RDB.

Yep, i wish someone would copy the product design and features, lower the price, AND add to the features, where video can be saved in Mpeg/AVI format for no need for the quickwave software, and it would have a removeable hard Drive also (hot swapping), and send messages like in the DVMRe's to email or cell or pager or PDA. Another good thing would be like what Sony has in their HVR which as a built in Tape Drive for archiving to the tape also, no need for extra hardware, but i guess that would cost too much anyway.

I guess in time. Ive been searching but there is nothing like it out there, yet. Ive seen some but they are the slim line style of the Old store safe.

Rory

PS. If you want to take a look at the WaveReader software (or my software ) working let me know ill send you the IP address. Email me if you want to. Unfortunately though all StoreSafes I installed are not yet online, one is an offshore bank, the other a home user. The others online are all DSR-2000e's with Triplex Multiplexers, which are online. I have another DSR2000e in a local alarm monitoting station that is on the router but not online, they are using the RSM-1600 Phone line device direct to their large screen TV. Another DSR2000 with a triplex mux is also not online, they are using the RSM-1600 to PC connection. Unfortunately I haven't installed as many DVRs as our Australian friend (yet!) But the new year should bring in new business with a new CCTV store I hope to open with new partners and ALOT of new advertising. Ofcourse Im not stuck on any one product or service no matter what you may have seen so far, if any manufacturer or dealer wants to start a type of CCTV business here with me, im ready and willing. This country has no CCTV store as yet, and CCTV is still in the beginning process here, so there is so much need for it, and so much business yet to aquire.

EDIT: i just read the specs and they do have email notification on alarm on all Store Safe products. Still both have single channel audio recording.

For full specs here is the link to the PDF file:

http://www.geindustrial.com/cwc/products/ge-interlogix?pnlid=9&famid=63&catid=1088&id=StoreSafe&typeId=4&lang=en_US

Rory

Actually, I can get you 4 COLOR DOMES, CCD 420TVlines, Sharp Chipsets cameras, .01LUX and a 4 Port, ALNET COMPUTER BASED 30FPS DVR System, with 80GIG hard Drive(Aprx. 14 days rec on Motion only, 640X400)with both regular monitor and spot TV monitor(use a regular TV with VIDEO input, cheaper) for $1400.00

 

Send me an E-Mail for more info.

 

That's about the best in a DVR complete with all the cameras that you are going to get, go to www.alnetsystems.com for more info on the DVR, and also, you get a 2 year warranty on all items.

Thats a good price

Do you mean a BW Dome though, just by the specs sounds like BW as most color domes dont have 0.01 lux and 420TVl, normally found in BW ??

Ill take a look around your site, looks interesting

ROry

Got it, thanks.

Sue, for price and features i would go for the GE Interlogix (Kalatel) StoreSafe, cheaper than the DM products, and unlike DM, Kalatel actually make other CCTV products. up to you though, but ive installed a few StoreSafes and they are soo simple to install, and small and compact, price is more than a PCI card DVR, but lower than the DM.

looking for a DVR similar in look or features to the Kalatel storesafe with CDRW etc. Im looking for something as a 'cheaper' alternative, and something I can buy out of the US, as long as im still here in the bahamas