cctv_down_under

LOL but then there would only be upgrade price.. and that would not make poor mr Gates more money!

Oh dont I know it Wait til you do a 42 terrabyte option...No I Havent yet but I knwo someone that has

What makes you think that they dont?

I finnaly got a new standalone product sample today that I like very much, maybe I can finnaly give Geo the flick. Its pretty good and has all the features, the networking rocks, and its cheaper than geo, has a flash memory card for backup but it comes with two readers for USB it sure is a cool little box, has two monitor outputs and supports two drives. Best part is, large resolution and really cheap, cheaper than building a Geo Machine (The way I do it anyhow). I am so happy, finally Geo may kiss my but with their screwy marketing, mind you they say they are working on a Standalone option as well. Only problem is I might be left with a wharehouse full of old Geo Stock

I agree.. we have a promise controller in every machine and IDE Raid can be Hot Swapable (I am pretty sure) so the advantages of SCSI are much more limited these days but they tend to be much more reliable drives, we can fit up to 1.5 Terrabytes in a single DVR but we prefer not to as it is easier for heat issues to creep in, even with adequate cooling, we often quote rack mounted ethernet storage box's that have their own back up softwrae and have built in multi level raid.. nothing is more impressive to a customer than showing up after a HDD has failed and the data is gone, then you insert a drive (brand new) and watch the datya come back.. they can not get their heads around it...

YMMV? It seems pretty much the same, if price did not dictate it I would surely use the Pro version, but as I am in wholesale and not Retail I have to be tight on prices.

Hell yeh.. shame there is no such thing as server grade HDD's

Totally incorrect!!!!!!! I was in Taiwan and went to see Geovision, I met the programming team and the development team and helped to integrate some features.. you are very wrong.. not denying that they buy the boards, even if they order so many that they are indeed manufactured for them with their own stamps on them and their security dongle on the card. The difference between standalone and PC are many and is a much longer discussion... May I ask a pertinant question? NEVERENDING are you CCTVEXPERT? Secondly do you work for Vendoma? Lastly, it has been pointed out many times now that it is very unlikely that Vendoma has the source code and if you have been a programmer for 25 years it would be stranget hat you would not realise that there are many changes that can be made without the source code not just basic ones, it is up to whomever wrote the source code in the first place.. I find it strange that Vendoma would use the same screen shots as Chance-I when they could make their own. This from AVCONSULTING I do nto think that Vendoma makes any boards at all.. they told me they make them all.. they told someone else they make a few and they told me they write for Chance-I but it seems the other way around.. maybe I am wrong... I will ask Chance-I!!

Ligos Indio Codec.. it was present in some versions of XP and 2k but later was removed... As mentioned before most people here use PSTN to connect so advanced networking options like domain support are not needed here so it is worth saving the extra dollars, but for the US ..yep I would not use anything else.. you guys have DSL and Cable everywhere man! I had to move house just to get it

this is what I got.....They will be here in Australia, next month along with Geo, will look forward to seeing them when they arrive.

Technical Specification (Industrial Class Board) Board Model No MPG120 MPG240 MPG480 1 Camera Input 4 channel 8 channel 16 channel 2 Audio In No. supporting channel 4 channel 8 channel 16 channel Audio Card Intergrated on Mainboard (On-board audio card) 3 Sensor Input 4 channel 8 channel 16 channel 4 Relay Out 4 channel 4 channel 8 channel 5 Composite Out 1 channel (Switching, but selectable) 6 Compression Codec MPEG4 Hardware Codec 7 Available channel No. for each resolution NTSC 352 x 240 4 ch. 8 ch. 16 ch. 704 x 240 4 ch. 8 ch. 16 ch. 704 x 480 4 ch. 8 ch. 16 ch. PAL 352 x 288 4 ch. 8 ch. 16 ch. 704 x 288 4 ch. 8 ch. 16 ch. 704 x 576 4 ch. 8 ch. 16 ch. 8 Display Frame Rate NTSC (352x240) Real Time Live PAL (352x288) Real Time Live 9 Frame Rate at Recording Mode NTSC 352 x 240 30 fps/ch 30 fps/ch 30 fps/ch 704 x 240 7.5 fps/ch 7.5 fps/ch 7.5 fps/ch 704 x 480 7.5fps/ch 7.5fps/ch 7.5fps/ch PAL 352 x 288 25 fps/ch 25 fps/ch 25 fps/ch 704 x 288 6.25 fps/ch 6.25 fps/ch 6.25 fps/ch 704 x 576 6.25 fps/ch 6.25 fps/ch 6.25 fps/ch 10 File Size (KB/frame) NTSC 352 x 240 0.5 - 4 KB/frame 704 x 240 2 - 16 KB/fame 704 x 480 2 - 16 KB/fame PAL 352 x 288 0.7 - 5 KB/frame 704 x 288 2.5 - 20 KB/fame 704 x 576 2.5 - 20 KB/fame 11 Image format YUV 12 Recording Mode Mode Watch, Normal, Motion Detection, Sensor, Event Main DVR Image and Audio Network PC Local image recording while watching remote views 13 Searching Main DVR Local Searching (Image and audio) Remote PC Remote and Local Searching (Image) 14 Back-Up Media DAT, CD, DVD, Network Drive Saving (moving image) AVI (Special viewer) from search, backup viewer Saving (static image) JPEG from search, backup viewer 15 Remote Connections Modem PSTN, ISDN TCP/IP Cable Modem, DSL, Ethernet 16 PTZ Interface RS232/RS422/RS485 Supporting Protocol More than 45 camera 17 Other features Image Security WaterMark Application software POS , Access control , etc Protect System Hardware Watchdog Backup Viewer Viewer of Backup Data stored other place Quick Viewer Emergency Data Recovery IP SERVER Remote viewing by Dynamic IP user DB Tool Generating Index for Removed HDD to other machine 18 Compatible system CPU Equivalent. or more than Pentium IV- 2.0GHz Main Board Intel, ASUS, GigaByte Main board equipped with Intel 845PE, 865 Chipset RAM 512 MB VGA Later than ATI 7500

I disagree with you Never Ending, I think this was one of the best posts on the board, we ascertained quite a few points which are more than interesting and also ascertained the level of confusion in the market place and the need for buyers to beware, One of the best points however is that it matters not a ZOT so long as the product does work. These are the points we learned and therefore this has been the best thread so far. 1/ Vendoma does not make the boards, they import them, they may have stated they do, but they do not, I would suggest that this is because they do Government work and the misconception is that you must be the manufactorer. 2/ It is looking like there are major changes done by Vendoma to the software, this is eveident because the lack of features I posted came directly from Chance-I, so if Vendoma has options available that Chance-I does not then I would suggest that either Vendoma has an advanced Beta that Chance-I does not want to mention yet or that Vendoma makes sofware changes and this is Vital to Know, especially as an importer. I am pretty confident Vendoma do not have the source code but they must have a SDK and a good programer, the fact that they use Comart as well suggests that they often get SDK kits and develop their own software. Chance-I said they do not have PDA but Vendoma says they have so this is why I suspect this. 3/ Vendoma's high price is truley justified if they are doing development, this is invaluable to know! 4/ Vendoma stated they make the boards and write the source... this is incorrect so Vendoma should be watched carefully but who cares if their products work. 5/ We found out Technovision has these boards as well..valuable info and that Chance-I are aware of Magic Radar. I think these are all valuable points to find out and very usefull tools, also I feel that most Manufactorers possibly already read this forum but do not post. This has been the best thread by far and interesting that none of the above information has come out without a fired up set of posts, without these posts we would never have gained this info, therefore I consider it not a Catfight but an awesome look into what is happening in the market. After all Geo has had the lions share of the market because they are the fastest developer of new features, now that SDK's are being released the Manufactorer sells more boards that can run on many software options and increase the development staff without having to pay a cent, this is I HOPE how they will beat Geo.. because Geo does not like to share Regards, GC

Ok here is the early news on the Vendoma/Chance-I options. They state that they record true frame rates and to some extent they speak the truth, as many of you are already aware, hardware compression allows this to some extent, but these boards are not cheap, they drop frames like every other DVR if hardware compression boards are not used and when used this is the statement from the manufactorer: And I assume that is per chip so you would muliply that by four for a 16 camera system, They can not state they do true frames as there are limits at present.. nice that Chance-I did not say it could. They do not use their own compression on the new boards and all the text here will be on the new boards, they purchase Mpeg4 standard hardware compression chips. The hardware architecture that they use is rather old, you can still run it on 98/SE... hay that will make Rory happy. They do not have control room software however they can make one DVR pop up cameras on another remote PC on movement. They do not have Gain control on the cards! There are only 3 levels of user password and they are defined. They can not de activate a camera from the main screens video sequencing therefore they can not hide it if it is there. 16Ch at 400 Fps requires 2 cards, this would be expensive with hardware compression. A major downfall is that remotely you can not look at previous recordings that is pretty lame mind you I would imagine this is only on web client I mean who would not have this feature? They have no PDA support They also do not have object search You can not adjust the bandwidth for outgoing packets for remote view.. that is a major let down and leads to network congestion. They can not play back their Video files in windows media player, in fact you need their viewer to view them and it may not work on all platforms...Major design floor! They do not have licence plate recognition. Please keep in mind this is not the boards everyone is talking about with cheap prices, I have one of those and will post my results as soon as possible but this is information on the high end compression boards. I hope this helped, GC

yeh i think it was ATI.. not sure ...will ask next time I speak to my techs!

That is a veryt true comment but XP has accelerated use of some applications and allows for more codecs than a standard 2k install, It also works witht the later drivers, but yes agree on the bloatware of XP, I should have made my point clearer we use XP Home and XP Pro Oem as we are system integrators as well, just we sell more with Home as most people in Australia do not have Cable or DSL... just horse and cart P.S. It pays when using other cards than Geo to use CPU Throttling and back it off a bit, sure you loose frames but the machine will not work as hard and therefore is more stable anyway, I have yet to have this problem with Geo, but many other cards really work quite stable when this is done but when you don't they fall over faster than me after 20 Coronas

I think there was one more...cant remember the name it was supposed ot run cooler than all the others but it must not have made it far in the market, because for the life of me the chip escapes me! Playing Far Cry right now, just bought new speakes.. game scares the willies out of me but is a hoot, one day I will grow up ...wont be today!!

Spot on Hermin.. you can use XP Home Oem if you are a systems integrator but you need a licence and have to order very large amounts..we do this.. we also use an embedded (not really embedded) shelled XP version. Pro gives domain support and remote control, but that can be achieved with VNC, mind you for some reason I have seen less Pro systems have issues than Home so it is worth the few extra bucks, you may have problesm with running Geo as a service on Server but it can be done! I hope this helps

Thanks for the laugh Loop.. interesting about Aver though.. seems weird they would buy from korea when they manufacture everything else.. TV Tuner cards and Video cards, Thats about what they told me too..cept they said they make all the boards even for Chance-I.. think thats what the said anyhow, formatted my machine since then.. I think they are waking up now as a few others have asked about Chance-I and they have stopped chatting straight away... I really do not believe that they write for Chance-I, I just think they have a SDK and are really good at marketing, strange thing is that Geo never slagged off any other products when we mentioned the other products to them... have to respect that. Their product will do true frames, that is true.. so will Geo but only at 320x240, there is no product that can do full frame recordings past the high end speeds on windows, well not unless Vendoma actually is a motherboard manufactorer aswell and designed a new PCI bus as this is the limitation and is why hardware onboard compression is wanted so badly.. Tomorrow I will get the latest software from Chance-I and try and ask Vendoma.. chance has it (pardon the pun) that I still have that Chance-I card and when contacting them about the latest software I will ask them if Vendoma writes for them or visa versa, I will also compare the two cards feature by feature... I am betting I wont get time but I will try to get it done soon, not to be rude to CCTV just to make buyers aware, I really do not think they manufacture boards, they just import them and probably pay for the software, maybe source and all but I bet that its a SDK or advanced Beta. Obviously if this lady speaks the truth then they are part of a voice over I.P mob that joined a CCTV wholesale mob and then I would understand that they speak the truth about being software developers, but anyone that develops DVR software should be aware of the PCI bus limitation and the way that 32 Bit limits the ablity to count full frames at stated speeds at larger resolutions, so I am surprised they are not aware of it.

Thanks Hermin.. true poiont....Handhake.. kiss and make up and on with it.. your right.. sorry Larry

Good point.. wopuld be cheaper.. mind you netwroking options would be limited

We got a Huper DVR here, seemd a little buggy but otherwise an awesome buy for the price.. they are making good headway!

LOL.. forgot about that one ..Thanks Hermin!

Spot on Loop man!!! keep in mind to check that you have not insatlled say PAL version when you should be using NTSC as this can have that affect, also check that the cameras do not have power up the coax.

Spot on again Hermin!!! I would advise you to use two machines... keep in mind that Geo always brings out new stuff so the higher the spec of the machine the more updates you will get later.

For #1......... I have no reason to lie, maybe it was the janitor or one of the other 299 staff that they have.. everyone knows here that I am not a liar so I do not appreciate you calling me one and I would not do it again. That is what was typed to me on the other end of the chat..oh how I wish I had taken screen shots for real I would have love to have posted them here to show you. As for your lists of Geo faults . having to reboot the system on a regular basis I have not come accross this fault except for 1 problem in 1 version where they could not find keypro.. yes it was a problem but was fixed very quickly. . recorded images being poor Thats Crap, there is very little difference between the two systems in this regard and in my opnion it is better looking on the Geo . cameras losing signal Maybe you should check your cables Mr CCTV expert as I have not seen this issue yet in all the systems that we have sold. . object tracking doesnt function right To be honest never used this feature as it is already built into most of the PTZ devices that we sell so we do not use it... I have seen a demo of it working and seemed to be ok, but it is a new feature so maybe you are correct, however I do doubt it. Does Chance-I have this feature? . no version control Not sure what you mean, if you mean that you need to use the same remote software for each version, then yes you are correct but if that is the best you can come up with then I think you are really clutching at straws.. I will now download the latest Chance-I software and pick it to crap as well. . zero customer support Customer support is by the bucket load, you arent supposed to get it from Geo anyway dealers should know their stuff . the list goes on and on Bring the list on.. pretty short list mate.. wait to you see the one on Chance-I As for me being a cheerleader for them.. I hate them with a passion, I hate the way they market the product and that is well documented in these forums, however they are the best DVR card for price on the market and they **** all over Chance-I/Vendoma.. I wish they didn't but they do.. more users in this forum use them compared to any other product..why do you think that is huh? I never said that the program had not been changed ...only said that they didnt do it...would you like me to email our supplier of Chance-I to verify this?? My guess is that they have a Beta that no one else has? Once again way off the mark.... Geovision writes its own software which is more than I can say for Vendoma It does not matter how they list and you too bashed a company.. namely Geovision. The problem of blurry pictures that you speak of is issues with Video Interlacing and on some DVR units this has not been done by a software interlace, therefore larger fast moving images have a tearing affect Geovision actually adjusts theres through software interlacing and by applying rendering to the image.. Not all DVR's are created with this feature.. However I agree Mpeg4 has a long way to go yet and Geovision has released its own version which works even better but such is the nature of Mpeg4 capture on all products at this satge that the Tearing still occurs but can be viewed and sampled after video de interlacing and rendering. I agree that hardware on board chips will fix this problem especially now that the new PCI bus is about to be released later this month but yes they are not stable at fast speeds. I do not agree with this statement, however it is true to say that Government agencies actually do prefer to deal with manufactorers of products for better support but to say that they will only deal with manufactorers is not accurate or have I not being doing business already with many Government agencies.. Why would Geovision be in your CIA headquarters (according to Geo) and several Government airports if this was the case. Besides Vendoma does not write the software, Chance-I do so go figure. Once again I dissagree, as posted below arguments are good for forums, however I went a bit too far.. It seems someone who posted earlier has the same opinion that it is good for a forum, as for this forum not flourishing, I have seen a load of new registrations every day and there were only about 8 of us at the start so once again I believe you are wrong.. I am not a know it all I just know a lot about DVR and having tested both systems I think I can safely make an educted statement about both products. Point taken and a valid one... however nothing was intentionally done to make you leave.. your still here aren't you... Yes I went too far and if you look through the posts on here, you will see that I have helped many people and encouraged many to join the forum, I do not rule this forum, each post is intended to educate.. but Vendoma calimed to me to make the cards and write the software and I feel it important to point out the obvious truth. I have no ill feeling toward you and I apologise for the way I replied to your postt, i do however think that you are wrong about Vendoma and I stand by what I said therefore I have spoken my mind...allbeit a bit too harshly once again for that I am sorry. Geovision is heads above most DVR products, their marketing sucks and they release goods far too soon before testing (well they used to) the do more releases than any other company and I believe they are the biggest selling card world wide.. I do not like them very much but intil I find a better product we are stuck with them..Oh Yes by the way their GUI sucks..