Bouci

Hi, I just purchased the Mobotix devkit below: http://www.ebay.ie/itm/Kamera-Mobotix-Zubehor-M12-DevKit-Modul-Metall-Nachtsensor-ohne-Objektiv-/330997695257?ssPageName=ADME:L:COSI:IE:1123 If I understand correctly, I will need to also buy a PoE-injector for power, a SD card for storage and a compatible lens. I'd like to install the lens/sensor unit concealed near an entrance door so this means I also need to get the Mobotix MxLink - DevKit Extension Set (see http://www.mobotix.com/eng_GB/Products/Cameras/M12-DevKit?tab=37543#tab). Am i doing this right? This unit has a dual sensor & dual lens capability so if I wish to take advantage of that, I'll need another lens/sensor unit plus one more Mxlink Extension Set. I have never installed one of these so I'd like to know how difficult is it to later add that second lens/sensor combo? Another thing that concerns me is connecting the Mobotix to my WLAN in the house. Is that difficult and what is required for it? Are there wireless units that can be attached to the PoE unit for example, or how should I go about this? Thanks for any help!

Hi, I am trying to find a reasonably priced, yet trustworthy outdoor PTZ that can operate 24/7 and act on it's own upon motion detection. It should have automatic tracking and capturing (i.e. imaging, not physical capturing of subjects. There is no operator who can react to any motion detection events so the camera has to be able to react and track on its own. The conditions are quite demanding: premises can be entered from all directions (forest all around the house & yard) and light can be sparse during the Finnish winter. I am going to fix the lighting problem by installing several Steinel PIR detectors that control five 30W LED floodlights on all sides of the building. So there should be plenty of light regardless of ambient light, and light direction & angles should be optimal (i.e. the faces of potential intruders will be lit). I am looking to install two PTZs in diagonally opposite corners of the house, under the eaves. That way I should get near 360 degree coverage. I looked at some Axis top models but the ones with tracking were too expensive. I am a bit at loss right now. I was also considering installing up to 5-6 dome cameras (that have 5mp resolution and about 90 degree viewing angles) around the house but upon testing identification resolutions (pixels per face) using on cctv lens simulation software, I quickly realized that I won't get id on people more that 10 meters away. That's not going to cut it, as the primary threat here is a disturbed person carrying a grudge and a shotgun. So, I would need to get images that will enable id from 25-30 meters. Help would be much appreciated Best regards, Bouci

As an alternative to the PTZ-based configuration that has it's own thread here, I am also considering another setup based on 5mp outdoor domes. Less than 5 megapixels won't cut it at all, because pixels per face width drop drastically with distance. Lighting will not be a problem as there will be many LED-floodlights (250W halogen equivalents) lighting the area. I was looking at ACti domes and calculated that a setup of eight domes would be needed, four E73s and four varifocal E83s. I am assuming that these can't be controlled by external PIR detectors? If they can't be activated by PIR, it means I would have to rely on video monition detection and maybe run some of them continuously (prepared to have up to 3 TB storage so should be good enough for about three days of 24h footage from all 8 cameras at 15 fps, max mp). Another question mark is cold tolerance because they are listed only as low as -20 C. If anybody has experience of them working in lower temp than that, I'd like to hear. Are there other alternatives in the same quality/price environment? Mobotix would be great but are too expensive as so many would be required. Edit: the Vivotek FD8372 seems to fit the bill pretty well. It is more expensive, though. Dahua does not seem to have anything in this range - their domes are rated only to -10 C which absolutely will not do.

This is crucial information for me, thanks! I like being able to trust the cameras fully, even in this sub-arctic climate (the arctic circle is very close to this place).

No experience on Ganz, anybody? Buellwinkle mentioned somewhere that the tracking feature of Axis PTZ cams wasn't really very good. Have they improved on that or is it still suspect? I'd hate to shell out big bucks on their products, only to find out that they are not doing the job very well.

Well, I got two of them, both quattros of course. A 2.5 litre TDI Avant A6 and a 4.2 litre gasoline A8 They're both real old but I like them.

Does anybody have experience on Ganz (CBC group) outdoor PTZ domes? They seem to have at least the same level of built-in video analytics as the RIVA domes. They don't seem to be very cheap but I have no idea about their quality and reliability.

Thanks again for the info. By intensive googling, I was able to find prices for some of the other additional licences but not for VCAtrackIP.

Where you are from? Finland. Edit: I found better prices, in the 1700 euro neighborhood and even around 1500. Not completely sure whether that includes all the necessary software licenses both for in-camera shape recognition and for PTZ auto-tracking. There is also another outdoor PTZ model the RC5510 which is very interesting and seems to go for 1100-1200 euros. Supports the same software but only has 10x zoom. The zoom might be enough for my purposes but I have to check. This one also has slightly slower pan and tilt speeds but I am not sure how significant that will be in real world situations. I will see if there are other differences.

Thanks Shropna. By the way, the only price I was able to find for the Riva PTZ was well over 2000 euros which seems a bit high. Especially as it likely needs a Poe unit too.

I don't have any software yet, I'm in the planning phase Starting to look like that Rivatech PTZ plus several PIR sensors might be the way to go. Depending on the camera price, of course. Regarding the area, I'll try to make a map/diagram for and post it here. I have an aerial image of the yard somewhere, so if I can find it, I'll use that as base.

Thanks. Looks like a real interesting option. Couldn't find a price for it though. I'll try to find a review for VCAfollowIP software.

Alright, this is getting challenging How about using an external PIR for triggering cameras? Here is a link to a GJD product, the MX35, that seems suitable: http://www.gjd.co.uk/products/wired-detectors/mx35/ GJD makes models that have both PIR and microwave detection as a double guard against false positives. I am now trying to find out which camera makes support GJD products. By the way, pretty much the only quality outdoor cam to have built-in PIR-based motion detection that I found, is the Mobotix M12. Looks very good but the price is prohibitive in my case, because I would need so many of them to cover the premises to any degree.

In the camera control software, aren't there zones that can blocked from motion detection? Obviously these would include tree tops above, say, two meters. Also, I've understood that motion detection sensitivity levels can be adjusted so that small moving objects won't trigger anything. Are these methods any good? Another solution might be external, third party PIRs to do the motion detection instead of video based MD but I don't know which PIRs are good and would also communicate with a KCM-8211. There would likely be just one object to track at a time as this place is really in the backwoods, so that should be good. I'd love an Axis setup, as we have very good experiences of an Q6035-E PTZ when used as a high-end scenic landscape camera. Had no problems last winter when it got down to -30 C. However, I don't think I can afford two Axis PTZs and a motion trigger cam (or two, as I suspect I'd need one on each side of the house). I am limited to a max budget of around 4000 euros, maybe 5000. Not sure what other gadgets would need to go into the system as well (being fairly new at this). Keep in mind ANY movement will trigger the PTZ to move/track. Including trees, blowing leaves, shadows, cats, dogs, deer.........

Ok, I'll definitely look it up. Both the KCM-8211 and the KCM-5611 sound very good. Still keeping one eye open for Axis too, though. Stuff like Dahua I'll stay away from, based on what I read about them here, I have zero trust in the cameras in these sub-arctic conditions.

There would likely be just one object to track at a time as this place is really in the backwoods, so that should be good. I'd love an Axis setup, as we have very good experiences of an Q6035-E PTZ when used as a high-end scenic landscape camera. Had no problems last winter when it got down to -30 C. However, I don't think I can afford two Axis PTZs and a motion trigger cam (or two, as I suspect I'd need one on each side of the house). I am limited to a max budget of around 4000 euros, maybe 5000. Not sure what other gadgets would need to go into the system as well (being fairly new at this).

Hi everybody, I am from Finland and interested in IP surveillance cameras, motion detection and surveillance of outdoor areas under variable and often harsh environmental conditions. The interest comes partly from my work but also from the need to secure my own property. Looking forward to tapping into the wealth of information and knowledge here! Best regards, Bouci

Thanks for the input. It's definitely unnerving that not even a high-end Axis cam can do the tracking properly. Perhaps my quest for a PTZ with automatic tracking is a dead end? The ACTi solution sounds interesting. Which model was the fisheye cam? Does anyone have actual experience of the ACTi outdoor PTZs in extremely cold conditions? Here temps very often go below -20 C for extended periods and below -30 is not that uncommon. By the way, the domes I was initially considering were actually ACTi 5mp models. I like your laser solution..perhaps an Aimpoint laser sight could be rigged into a PT housing

Hi, Does this model have a auto tracking function? I am in need a of a reasonably priced outdoor PTZ that can automatically track subjects upon motion detection, capture images of the subject and store them in a NAS or similar.