zr1
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2-3 cameras "live streaming" thru SIM card to android ???
zr1 replied to Frenky's topic in System Design
There are some individual cameras that have a sim-card option, but they're typically direct-from-China-no-support (or instructions) kind of thing. Plus, if you're looking at 2-3 cams...then that means...2-3 sim cards? (plus 2-3 logins from your Android phone). For construction sites I do and other remote locations, I go with: * Regular ol'NVR (or DVR) camera system of however many cameras wired to the NVR or DVR. * NVR/DVR is plugged into a router with USB/4G (or 3G) input plug * USB internet dongle from Verizon (or whatever ISP) is plugged into the router Then I log into the NVR using the Android app for that particular NVR and I can see all the cams. While it's not a "sim card" specific solution, there might be routers that accept a sim card out there. It was just easier for me to grab a router with a USB/4G input, and not pricey either. As for trigger motion... Most current NVR/DVR systems will do it. The cams and NVR/DVR are still a basic computer. Motion recording is very good and I can sift through the motion-events real well to find things when I need to. I recommend motion recording for most situation. But as for relying on 2016 technology to accurately alert me when there's something real going on and not a tree branch during a storm or a moth that flies right up to the camera....at least for me, the 2016 motion technology isn't up to snuff for getting live alerts for an outdoor cam. For an indoor cam...possibly. But for an outdoor cam, the alerts happen way too often even when I turn down the sensitivity and "mask" areas I don't want to alert on. -
Power is power (as long as it's clean...uninterrupted...etc.) I've been happy using both Trendnet and TPlink stuff for years without any more issues than other brands.
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If the cable distance between the two buildings is less than 300 feet (practical max for a network connection without going to boosters/extenders/or having a switch in between), then you have options. For example: Building A: NVR Cams for Building A single Cat5 to conduit Building B: single Cat5 from conduit POE switch (Cat5 plugs into that) Cams for Building B plug into POE switch ....or a regular switch and power the cams however you want ...or Building A: NVR Cams for Building A Cat5 from router to conduit Building B: NVR Cams for Building B Switch (Cat5 from conduit goes to switch...as does NVR #2 ......or do the above with two TVI DVRs Downside... User logs into two different NVRs to see stuff. Not a huge deal, I have customers that do it and don't blink at it. Other customers make use of CMS software to manage the two NVR-views together (which'll cost) ...or Building A: DVR (TVI) Cams for Building A Coax cables for conduit for all the building B cams Building B coax cables from conduit coax cables go to TVI Building B cams (TVI cable runs can be really long) Downside... running all that coax limited upgradability does all that coax fit in the conduit?
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Number of cams I typically go with the goals of what is wanting to be recorded, then do a site inspection to walk around saying things like "hmmmm" a lot to get the sight lines, then let that dictate the number of cams as well as the lens types (wide angle, regular, telephoto, etc.) Church security in general There's several sources such as a couple of YouTube channels with a ton of info...some web sites dedicated to church security concepts...and even some well-respected defense firearms trainers that go on the road and do conferences focusing on church security questions. Cameras on one layer. PTZ +1 on the PTZ. They give a great "wow" factor when you're showing off the system, but in practice, they're only recording in the direction they're pointing. For places that have personnel manning the PTZ controls, fine...but otherwise it often makes sense to simply put 2-3 cams at that spot and record all the angles you want all the time. 2 NVR's vs 1 bigger NVR +1 there too. LTS's 16ch DVR/NVR's work fine...I did quite a few of those last year and have been very happy with them. Also...it's very common for a customer to come back a year or so later and want more cams...so if you have a couple extra channels open on your NVR, then upgrades are cheap to add on to that same NVR. TVI vs IP The high-def analogs work great over the coax cable and give up to around 2MP...kinda cool. But if it's a new install, I go with IP systems all the way. The exception is if I have some really loonnnng cable to run as IP gets interesting past 300 feet. If it's a place that has a bunch of existing coax...then I consider one of the high-def analogs (such as TVI, etc.)...but for new installs? Nah...I go IP. Cost TVI isn't much and those little 1422W's will look good (I prefer the 2722's for TVI turret cams over the 1422). You may consider the camera angles...using 2.8 lens for the wide angle shots, but perhaps some 4mm lens on other spots (parking lots, etc.). Google up a camera lens calculator. This one has pics for general representation: http://polarisusa.com/lens-calculator (I'm not affiliated with the site) Quote Uh...yeah....I'd look to get another local quote. A quote would depend heavily on a site survey...but I would think a TVI install for 9 cams (non-PTZ) might be around 4-5k in many locales. Going to a nice IP may be 6-7k. Doing up a church last year, they opted for cams that are pretty popular for local businesses. Here's the cams businesses chose most for me in 2015. Outdoor cams mounted 10' or higher: Large bullet cams such as: TVI - CHMR9422 IP - CMIP8332 Indoor cams (entrances, public areas, etc.) TVI - CMHT2722 IP - CMIP3032 Outdoor with reach of a person TVI - CMHT7422 IP - CMIP7432
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Junction Boxes to Incorporate RJ45 Camera Tails
zr1 replied to Justice's topic in Installation Help and Accessories
Some installs doing a bigger hole goes quick...but sometimes with a brick/cement wall...up on a ladder drilling away...just poking the tiny Cat5 cable through is preferable instead of dulling a big expensive drill bit (that's trying to push me over on the ladder...hehe). I've got to where the cameras I usually use have some junction boxes I can buy along with the cams for like $10-15...but these are made for the specific camera -
The Hik's are fine quality and run a good value these days. The cams/NVR you gave the model #'s for are 720P...or about 1.0 megapixel. This will be a fair step up from the 1930's-resolution of analog that you already have. If you're thinking HD as in 1080P (about Blu-Ray quality), that's the 2 megapixel range. Most of my customers are going with 3MP or 4MP this past year. Of course, cost goes up as we move up the resolution food chain...and you'd want an NVR matched to your cams too. But the Hik hardware and software will meet your criteria on recording, remote access, network connectivity, etc. I'm not familiar with that specific seller...so the sstandard of looking at their service and/or return policies as sometime you do get a bum device out of the box.
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You can plug the cams into any data point in the home...however: Internal Network speed capacity If: * your network is 10/100 * you have a bunch of cams * the cams are running a good resolution Then you may be bumping up against some network limits. However, a gigabit internal network for 5-20 cams should be fine (Google for a camera bandwidth calculator) Another solution is to run a single cable per camera all the way from the NVR to each camera. This way the cams regular data won't be on the rest of the network traffic. And if the NVR is POE, then bonus, your power is already a done deal too. Power Ya gotta power the cams somehow. Whether from a central location via power wire or POE, or if you have different cameras getting their power closer to their location. Whether you use a separate power line or have power put into the Cat5 cable to the camera to make use of POE. You can also have POE-injectors here and there to get power into the cam's Cat5 at some point. Power is power...the camera doesn't care. Doing POE from the NVR directly (if it does POE) or using a central POE switch or POE-injector does simplify wiring and installing for some installs. Hub We used to use hubs in the 90's, but going to a switch does better traffic management for the internal network. DVR/NVR Just naming...DVR is the term used for analog devices...but with IP cameras, we all try to sound cool and use NVR for those PTZ They're really cool. Kinda fun too. They also give a really good "wow" factor when you show off your system to somebody and control the camera from your phone or something. However, for a system that doesn't have a live person monitoring it all the time, it most always makes more sense to put 2-3 cameras in the PTZ location and just record all the angles all the time as the PTZ will only record in the direction it's pointing at the time. Plus 2-3 regular cams is sometimes cheaper than a single PTZ anyway. TV watching the security cams There's several different methods... Wire a video cable from the NVR to the TV of choice...a long HDMI (within HDMI limits) or such, then just tap the "source" or "input" button on your TV. That's view-only and no controlling. Another way is to get a little USB plug-in Android device to your TV such as the Amazon Fire TV. Sure, it does the Amazon stuff, but you can install Android apps it and get a security camera app. That'll give you view and control from your TV.
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For new installs when the cable runs are less than 100M I go with IP systems. I do mostly Hikvision built IP cameras...they work great in the Arizona heat, and I've had no issues with water during the summer monsoons here. For cold, it only gets down to about 30 degrees for a short time here, so I'll defer cold-weather inquiries. I was doing mostly 3 megapixel systems in 2015, but now I do more 4 megapixel stuff. But for the specifics of each camera of what you need, it may be different for the pool or the laundry room or the parking lot depending upon the site inspection.
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Are the 3 buildings on the same internal network? If not, it's a bit more straight forward to do 3 NVR's. If the 3 buildings are on the same internal network, then sure, you can put the NVR anywhere and just attach the cams to the network. But you can also do an NVR in each building (whether on the same network or not)...but then it means a person would either: * log into 3 different NVRs to see what's what * make use of a system or software to manage the 3 NVR's into a single view Another question can be network traffic. For example, if they're on a 10/100 network, adding 10 of the 4MP cams can mean a lot of data. In that example, one solution could be: * 3 NVRs, one per building * each NVR has POE connectivity straight to the NVR * run cable from each camera to the NVR That way the cams themselves aren't adding any network traffic to their internal network. The only time is when a user logs into an NVR to view what's going on. I've done it both ways depending on the layout and the goals of the customer.
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Two quick YouTube vids to see a comparison: Set your YouTube settings (gear icon in lower right) to the max resolution and make full screen on your PC or device I'm not affiliated with either video To get detail (and recognize a person) it means: * getting the camera close to them * optics/lens to zoom in * higher resolution * combination of the above Ye olde-timey analog from the 1930's won't cut it. The "high-def-analog" systems will give you a pretty nice image up to about 2 megapixel (similar to Blu-Ray players). IP systems will give you 3 megapixel...4 megapixel...5...8...and on up. The value-price sweet spot in 2016 is about the 3-4 megapixel range. For example, it's probably cheaper to field a few 4MP cams in a location than a single 12MP cam. Another issue for 500M of fence line is the question of running long cable lines. IP cameras are good for about 100M of cable before they need a boost (using different methods...a powered POE switch within 100M of the cam is ideal...things such as in-line "POE-extenders" are possible, but I've had mixed experiences with POE-extenders). Some of the high-def-analog technologies, such as TVI, can handle a long cable run like 500M. It does bring the video down to 2MP, but it means running more cams along the line. On the plus side, TVI is lesser money.
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Very very few of my clients go with 24/7 continuous recording. 95%+ go with motion recording to record activities only. * Extends storage space out...way out * Makes things tons easier when you want to locate a specific activity/situation on playback * Most DVRs/NVRs these days let you set a "pre" and "post" activity time frame...say 5 or 10 seconds so you won't miss any of the action. I usually go with 5 seconds before and 10-20 seconds after. However casino clients still go with 24/7 continuous. Nuclear power plants too I suppose. +1 on staying with D1 5-10fps is typically more than enough to capture what's happening, but 12-15fps is typically easier on the eyes when you're watching live. Most of my clients go with 15fps.
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Miami sounds kinda nice....just put me and the family up at a nice 4-star...business class is acceptable I suppose. For residential and small offices, doing FireTV dongles on a dedicated LCD monitor + an app to monitor the NVR is doable. For large offices with IT depts, they typically wouldn't like such semi-open clients around the network.
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Options are: * Remote * Hide * Harden You were saying remote isn't an option (unless you go cellular...pricey) Hiding depends on the site, but often doable. Hardening depends more on cost, but also doable. For the construction sites I do for solar-powered stuff, we harden (in layers), do lots of signage, and have cellular. Works well, but that's $25k setups. Hardening is doable on a smaller scale though probably for hundreds depending on the site...and somebody who can weld, or bolt some heavy stuff together.
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Goes to the goals...are they looking for employees swiping things out of pockets or something between the racks? Or overall safety? As mentioned above, the goal may be met by doing cameras for the entry points (going or coming), or outside the back door...the register, near the more valuable (or hazardous) equipment. If their goal is to see every nook and cranny...it is a possibility, but some businesses have that as their goal. I did a couple supermarkets and doing the long narrow views of the aisles simply meant more cameras to be used.
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1) Most cams do night vision with IR - the 4MP Hikvisions that came out in 2015 are head/shoulders above previous stuff in the price bracket 2) +1 to Boogie above...can't be doing IR night vision through a window, the cam will blind itself. Best to buy a $6 two-foot drill bit from the attic to under the eve of the roof (or whatever ya got) and mount the thing outside. 3) This will depend on the on-sight estimate and lines of sight you want. Walk around the property, do a lot of "oooh's" and "ah's" and "ah-HA!" to work that out. The above-mentioned 4MP Hik's can be $250-ish each. The 3MP Hik's are $200-ish these days. 2MP that Boogie mentioned are even less and still give Blu-Ray resolutions. 4) Some cams record to their own SD-cards, but yeah, recording to a central device (such as a PC or NVR) is the more robust practice today 5) Network cable is the way to go! Cat5e will do ya fine. If you go with the solid copper and not the CCA (copper-coated-aluminum), it is better quality. 6) If you're a certified PC geek like me, sure, go with a PC. An NVR will do all the same tricks, but the NVR is by far the set-up-and-forget device. No hassling with the operating system or drivers or having Windows 10 doing forced reboots in the middle of the night, etc. Get an NVR and toss in a little 'ol 2TB drive and you'll have weeks of recording (if you go with motion-recording). 4TB for even more. Many NVRs will do multiple drives if you want. 95% of my business customers don't want to worry about the camera system and they demand that it's up much more than 99.9% (99.9% is like 1 crash a week)...so the NVR is the overwhelming choice that I deal with. And I just do my PC geeking out at home (getting yet another Raspberry Pi!) 7) Both of those software titles do well.
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Setting up a system using Cat6 between multiple locations
zr1 replied to PBX8944's topic in System Design
For an IP system (whether applying to your situation or those Googling in from the "home game") It's way easy... Main Floor - NVR and whatever cams - can be plugged into the office network or directly to the NVR via POE 2nd Floor - The incoming CAT6 (or CAT5e for others Googling in) would run to a regular network switch (or POE switch if you want). Then plug any of the 2nd Floor cams into that 2nd Floor switch. For an analog system... Several ways to approach it. For the lowest install (and cost), I'd probably look at: * Main Floor - DVR + cams + coax cable to each of the Main Floor cams * Main Floor - DVR connects to office network via Ethernet Cat5e/6 * Main Floor - Cat6 that goes between floors, this end also connects to office network * 2nd Floor - DVR #2 + coax cable to 2nd Floor Cams * 2nd Floor - Cat6 plugs into network connection of DVR2 to connect it to the office network downstairs Login to either each DVR separately (I find this more common for smaller/midsize businesses), or use management software to tie the DVR imaging together. If the CAT6 is more than about 300 feet, then there's other solution add-ons to make it more interesting, but to still tie them together. You also don't have to have either solution above on the office network, you can simply run a 2nd network solely for your camera system with a $30 router. -
SDI (and the other HD over coax..TVI, AHD, etc) give a nice high-def-range image over the existing coax. And I think SDI is the prettiest (though TVI gives those long range capabilities). For the 3 monitors...yeah, it's either: a) existing coax a1) - stay with DVD-ish quality for the monitors (but the recordings are still in high-def, so you can zoom in on recordings, etc.) a2) - use one of the coax-adapters available..which cost money...per monitor (plus the cost of high-def monitors) b) Re-run the cable for the monitors to use HDMI (or another solution such as HDMI over Ethernet if it's a long range) to get high-def image for the instant viewing. This also means high-def monitors will need to be purchased if the existing monitors aren't high-def). And... c) hybrid ...did this one for an office that HQ's for taxi service with 3 monitors when we upgraded to TVI for them... * main monitor near the TVI-DVR - HDMI cable to a new 40" flat-screen high-def TV * 2 auxiliary monitors (both old-timey-crts) - still used the existing coax to them (using the existing powered-BNC-splitter) so they still had the same regular-definition monitors as before.
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Ethernet switch for performance improvement
zr1 replied to peterdewolf's topic in General Digital Discussion
Any LAN-traffic that passes only through the gigabit switches will be at the gigabit capacity. Assuming you have: * Router with 10/100 built-in switch * Gigabit switch (or 2, or 3) If any end-devices are wired directly to the router, then that LAN traffic will bottleneck at 10/100 speeds. Of course, each individual device will communicate at it's own given speed, but the gigabit switch wouldn't bog down. And if you go with 2 (or more switches)...if you plug both switches directly to the router, then when Switch #1 talks to Switch #2, the router would be the 10/100 bottleneck again. So if you have 2 or more switches, just use the router for the internet connection, and have the switches plugging to each other (with at least one switch plugged into the router for the internet) -
Install tip: Use a ladder or bucket truck for high spots
zr1 posted a topic in Installation Help and Accessories
The right tool for the job is a good practice...don't be this guy... -
Bullets can be a few minutes faster to install, but for a position close to where a person could reach it, I prefer domes or turrets. I do a lot more turrets these days such as the Hik DS-2CD2342WD-I, but for domes, a person can't always tell which way it's pointed until they get right up close to it. For a close-up location such as a doorstep, I typically choose a wide angle lens around 2.8mm. And if you're wanting more detail, 2-3MP would do well, but going to 4MP would do great.
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# of Cams + more later The NVR will handle only the number of cameras specified. For example, a 16 channel NVR will do your 10 cameras...and then you can add up to 6 later. But if you want a 17th camera, then it means adding a 2nd NVR or replacing the 16 channel NVR with one that handles more channels. Motion Detection Most all systems do this and do it rather well. Email/Text Ok...remember when I said systems do motion sensing well? They do...but typically they aren't smart enough to hook up texting you when they see motion. There are sensitivity settings, but in working with it, it tends to end up with too much texting (or emailing) until you're ignoring the texts. If you have an outside camera, a breeze blowing bushes will make for a motion event. A moth flying up to the camera at night will make a motion event. If you're reviewing camera footage, then sure, motion recording works great, but if you're having the system text you...in 2015, they tend to text too much. Case 1 I set one system at home to text me when it saw motion. It was an indoor camera, so I wasn't expecting anybody to walk through the room at all. I got about 8-10 texts a day set off by the shad of a tree outside the window that made for enough changes for my NVR to text me. Not bad, I figured I could deal with that. Case 2 (a couple weeks later) I set the system up to text me on motion again...after all...I install this stuff for a business, so I should be able to set it the way I want at home, right? So I blocked out the areas of the window/shade thing to see if that would work. Though I figured I might get a couple texts a day based on the general light in the room from day/night changes. Then I went camping in the mountains for a few days out of cell phone range. A few days later, when camping was done and we're driving back I got within cell range, I started getting repeated texts. There was a lot of them backed up...1500 of them! I couldn't hardly use my phone with the constant incoming texts. Upon getting home, I found that a monitor that I had left on (and in sleep mode) had malfunctioned and was just a flickering white screen...resulting in the camera in that room detecting motion all the time. Motion Detection #2 Some systems allow for an RS485 connection to an alarm system or to an alarm system type sensor. This could be a more general alarm motion sensor or a laser sensor. The idea is that when the sensor is tripped, then the NVR can take whatever step you preprogrammed. For example: Laser sensor crossed = * start recording * text you Budget Not including shipping or any customs fees...$1500-2000 should give you a nice setup. I'm not sure if Costco does overseas, but they have a few good packages.
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A IP-camera installation project for 24 cameras, help needed
zr1 replied to Matiw's topic in Installation Help and Accessories
IP Cameras are simply little networked computers using the TCP/IP protocol. They identify with the network (and the NVR) by IP address, subnet mask, MAC address, etc. So wire the data cables up very similarly to how you'd wire up networked PC workstations in those locations. The difference is on the final wire to the camera, you want power on that line too...so a POE switch (or POE injector) for that final cable to the camera. For bandwidth, you can specify per camera how much bandwidth. Google "camera bandwidth calculator" to see a number of simplistic estimates. If you're on a 100Mbps network, then you'll be looking to economize your bandwidth. If you're on gigabit...then you've got a whole lot more headroom. -
With IP cameras, there's options for wiring them up. a) Wire the cams directly to the NVR with dedicated cables b) Wire the cams just anywhere on your Local Area Network (LAN) and also connect your NVR to the LAN. Switches can be used to extend cameras out a real long ways...or switches can be used to reduce cabling in some situations. But with cameras on the same switches/router as your computers/smartphones, then just keeping in mind how much bandwidth usage on your network compared to the capacity of your network. c) Mix and match the two options above Bandwidth You can set each camera higher or lower on the badwidth...even to an exact number. The NVR will have a capacity to handle a set amount of bandwidth. If you get a really cheapo NVR...yes...it's possible that the cheapo NVR won't have enough horsepower to handle a lot of bandwidth...so in those cases, you'd lower the bandwidth settings on the cameras. But even a middle of the road NVR (we do mention Hikvision and Dahua a bunch on here) have more than enough capacity to handle the bandwidth. If your Router/switches on your LAN are running at 100Mbps speeds, then it is possible to add 16 cameras at full bandwidth settings to max out your LAN. But if you're running gigabit (1000Mbps) on your LAN, you're fine. TVI Most all my new installs this year are IP cameras. The only time I do TVI cameras is if: * The customer has reallllly long cable runs (over 328feet) * They already have a ton of coax cable installed (reusing the coax for TVI to save them $$ on the install) TVI gives a good picture. But IP gives a great picture.
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Thanks for the review - 20W is real good for doing those functions. A single-drive NAS can be 7-20W by itself. I do enjoy my kill-a-watt
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The Hik's do great and that cam will serve you well. A big +1 on buying from a reputable seller (including warranty, and one that isn't just putting rogue firmware on the camera....) Back to the camera, the dome does great, I use more domes where people can reach them, but up high like that I'm using more bullets (DS-2CD2232-I5) or turrets (DS-2CD2332-I). But for most of my customers, it's simply a matter of styling. A dome can give the appearance that the person may not know which way the dome is pointing. The 3MP image on those Hik's is very good. The 4MP image does give more resolution, but it's also better with it's night imaging. The PC recording does work as long as the PC's running of course (Windows 10's mandatory reboots kinda frustrate that kind of thing). Some of the Hik's also have an SD card and you can do limited recording straight to the camera and just log in remotely to the camera directly. For a single camera solution, that's not a bad way to go. The field of view is a discussion to have. Is the camera pointing straight down? That's not done much as it doesn't get the information most people want (tops of heads don't identify people real well). But if the cam is pointing off to the side, then it does better. For some installs, that may mean 2 cameras pointing from the sides to get the coverage you want.