BigLebowski 0 Posted January 8, 2009 Hi there greetings from the UK, newbie here. I'm wiring 16 hi-res day/night analogue cams across a farm into a GV-2008. Mains is available near each cam so supply isn't a problem. I'm considering coax or CAT5. How many cat 5 cables would I typically need to use for the final run to the pc assuming 16 600TVL cams? I take it there's a general move away from coax towards cat5??? Are the cheap baluns on ebay from China crap? (I assume so Can I use a 4-way balun per cat 5 cable and not lose quality? Many thanks Dude Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Soundy 1 Posted January 8, 2009 Welcome! Well, to answer your questions in order: 4, not really, probably, and yes. How's that? Take a look at the diagram here for an example: http://gemelec.com/index.php?page=shop.browse&category_id=7&option=com_virtuemart&Itemid=1 Also take a look at the offerings from www.nvt.com There are other manufacturers, but these are the two I've used. Actually, to expound on the second question, I haven't seen a general move from coax to Cat-5, but I know *in some instances* we've been going that way, mainly because it provides an easy upgrade path to IP. If we know there's a chance a particular site will want to go to IP in the future, we'll use UTP and baluns so the needed wiring is already in place. When you start getting multiple cameras over longer distances, the ability to send four feeds on one wire gets VERY cost-effective; however, the cost of the baluns themselves makes coax more cost-effective (for us at least) for shorter runs (like, up to a couple hundred feet). Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
3RDIGLBL 0 Posted January 16, 2009 Hi Soundy, I was wondering the same thing. Are people more or less moving to CAT5 in order to support future expansion or technology upgrades. You answered that part as I was thinking of doing the same moving forward for those customers who on the edge of spending that extra for IP or especially for those that want hybrid DVR's. Hybrid DRV's is what's driving us to consider moving the direction of CAT5 if the customer is receptive to future upgrades... When you are running your CAT5 I assumer you have to run a separate 18/2 with each CAT5 or for each camera attached to that CAT5? How are you handling power if you don't have the fortune of having power at each camera location? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Soundy 1 Posted January 16, 2009 Depends on the particular job, but usually I'll run one camera per Cat-5, using one pair for video and two pair for power. This is based on the standard practice of home-running all the power, though. Four cameras per wire is good in theory, but only really practical if you're not running power along with it... like you might in a really long run. One of the other big advantages to a single Cat-5 vs. coax-and-power, for me, is not having to pull two separate, different wires to each location - especially if you have to stage out a bunch of wire for multiple pulls, the different sizes and stiffnesses of coax vs. 18/2 or station wire can mean easy kinks and tangles, and layout of boxes for a number of simultaneous pulls can take up a lot of floor space, which is a problem if you're working, say, inside an active store. A single wire to each camera makes for less trouble and a cleaner job overall. GEM makes a balun that splits out an RJ45 jack to a BNC and a pair of power pigtails, and another that splits out a pigtail for data/serial as well, that makes this type of install very clean and straightforward. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
3RDIGLBL 0 Posted January 16, 2009 How far have you successfully gone with a CAT5 where you have power going over a double pair? I've done a really short run at the office where I put my own pigtails on the CAT5 for power but I only did like 30 feet or so. It worked but I imagine with the small guage of CAT5 conducors that running power over long distances would really create a massive voltage drop considering CAT5 at 24AWG. I'm speaking of using a standard 12VDC or 24VAC powersupply without having to make any power adjustments. I have to admit though that we have done an out of the ordinary install at a customers where other CCTV installers told them it was impossible. They have a 1500 foot driveway and the customer was getting there mailbox vadalized. We added a 12V heated enclosure and a box cam to a pole near the mailbox and ran power and video over the long service cable that was there. We are happy to report that the system has been running for over a year now trouble free and we have a happy customer. Power was achieved with a 24VAC power supply at the source end and we stepped it down to 12V at the camera end. It allowed for voltage drop along the way and anything in excess of 12 volts was stepped down to 12V. We do not do this practice all the time as we can see potential problems with this and the customer was well aware of that but surprisingly everything has been running without issue. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Soundy 1 Posted January 17, 2009 How far have you successfully gone with a CAT5 where you have power going over a double pair? Just off the top of my head, probably 150'? Not a problem if you're using 24V to a camera that's designed for "12VDC/24VAC", as it handles any drop just fine. Actually, since we normally use station wire (22/4) for power runs, and just double that up, I have had occaision, where a client wanted another camera added to a remote location (actually, to a gas-pump canopy, where all the conduits are sealed before the station goes online) to "borrow" a pair off the station wire to run video with baluns, and then used the other pair to power BOTH cameras... WITH heated enclosures. It was a bit ghetto... but it worked (and is still working, over two years later). Distance there was probably 90-100'. I have to admit though that we have done an out of the ordinary install at a customers where other CCTV installers told them it was impossible. They have a 1500 foot driveway and the customer was getting there mailbox vadalized. We added a 12V heated enclosure and a box cam to a pole near the mailbox and ran power and video over the long service cable that was there. We are happy to report that the system has been running for over a year now trouble free and we have a happy customer. Power was achieved with a 24VAC power supply at the source end and we stepped it down to 12V at the camera end. It allowed for voltage drop along the way and anything in excess of 12 volts was stepped down to 12V. We do not do this practice all the time as we can see potential problems with this and the customer was well aware of that but surprisingly everything has been running without issue. I've done something similar... 500' total run from a server room to a camera tower, with a couple splice points along the way, I added a 10/100 switch at the splice point nearest halfway (which is also by a gate where network-based access controls are planned to be added at a future date), to act as a network repeater (since ethernet maxes out at about 300' per run). To give the switch its required 5VDC, I added a run of 18/2 from the camera power supply beside the tower, back to the switch, and then threw a small board regulator in the splice box, and dialed it down to a nice even 5.04V Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
