Need help choosing an 8 channel DVR

[AMPD 0]

Hello all, I'm new to this forum and CCTV. I just recently got a job offer for installing a camera system in a nursing home. Since then i've been reading up on video surveillance systems.

 

So here's what they need.

-8 camera's, (6 in-door, 2 out) -one of the camera's needs to be covert. they have a clock that shows a good view of the room, so thinking of replacing it with a clock camera.

 

-ability to monitor online

 

-they would like about 30 days worth of video memory

(I know there are many details that go into measuring amount of memory needed, so just a ballpark number would be appreciated.-8 cameras dont know there specs yet because i dont know what i'm gunna go with.

 

-i think i want to go w/ an H.264 so that should help w/ memory.

-and built in dvd burner would be a plus too.

 

I have installed a 16 camera setup for a church, but they already had all the components picked out. i just put everything together, so any info is very much appreciated.

I heard to try n stay away from the package deals, is that true or are there a few good ones out there?

 

-Budget, I haven't priced the install for them yet so I'm open to any and all suggestions. I'm thinking of giving them about 3 different price options in the end. with lower end to higher end equipment.

 

So based on the provided info, does anyone have a few recommendations for a DVR, cameras, or system package?

 

Thanks,

Myles

[vin2install 0]

-ability to monitor online

Almost all DVR's Nowadays can monitor online

 

-they would like about 30 days worth of video memory

For 8 channel at 30fps is about 1TB, 15fps is about 500gb. If it's motion record you can get away with 250gb.

 

I heard to try n stay away from the package deals, is that true or are there a few good ones out there?

Depends on what is in the package. If you buy in a package the priced gets reduced by a lot.

[AMPD 0]

thanks vin2install for the fast reply.

 

i'll probably want to go with 30fps, most likely with motion detection. any downsides to going motion detection that i should know about? maybe a few of the cameras on 24/7?

 

I would like it to be a good setup since it is a referal customer and friend of the families business. but at the same time, the less i spend on product will most likely mean more profit on my end. so a system package could be do-able.

any package suggestions? or dvr suggestions?

[AMPD 0]

does anyone have any experience with this DVR? JS-8XLA-1TB... looks like a great price considering its functions and memory. anyone see anything wrong with the specs that i might be overlooking?

 

think that could go well for what i need??

 

thanks,

Myles

[AMPD 0]

nevermind, i did some more research on my own and looks like it would work well with what i want to accomplish.

 

one question though.... what is the difference between the JS XLA and the JS RTA series?? from what i could gather on there spec sheets they have different recording frame rates. could someone please explain to me if there will be a noticeable difference between the two?? and any other differences you might know of.

 

I need to make a decision between the two by monday, so a prompt reply will be greatly appreciated. THANKS!!

[shoreviewsecurity 0]

Hi Myles,

 

As you pointed out, the main difference is the recording frame rates...

 

Each DVR has the ability to record in 4CIF / D1 704 x 480. The difference between each grade level is the frame rate each DVR can record at D1.

 

The Business Economy Class RT4 will record at D1 all channels at 7.5fps or up to 30fps each channel in CIF.

 

The Corporate Class XLA will record at D1 all channels at 7.5fps or up to 30fps each channel in CIF.

 

The Enterprise Class RTA will record at D1 all channels at 15fps or up to 30fps each channel in CIF or 2CIF.

 

The Advanced Enterprise Class RTA D1 will record D1 all channels at 30fps or up to 30fps each channel in CIF or 2CIF.

 

Additionally, the RTA will hold more storage and has a few more alarm inputs.

 

It will serve your needs very well. Really is a stable unit. With my local installs I favor this DVR or the Hikvision DVR. I have never had any issues with either. In the environment you are going to be installing this DVR and you are trying to decide between the XLA and the RTA, I would recommend the RTA simply because you can get 15fps at D1. Or, if 30fps at 2CIF resolution is OK, than go with the XLA.

 

Thanks

 

Mike

[protecvideo 0]

You might also want to check these out. Installed about 50 of them now with only a few having issues (hardive issues from shipping) very nice live viewing and playback.

 

http://cctv.sjglobalservice.com/Product/ProductDetail.aspx?Item=64

 

These are also good for the price but aren't as fancy.

[AMPD 0]

thanks for the find protec. looks pretty good, think i want to set them up with a H.264 system... I really like the JS-8XLA unit but after reading up more on it i'm afraid that not being able to watch video in reverse could become a deciding factor.

Anyone have other suggestions for a DVR that has all the same features as the JS-XLA series but with the video in reverse funtion????

appreciate the help!

[Soundy 1]

i'll probably want to go with 30fps, most likely with motion detection. any downsides to going motion detection that i should know about? maybe a few of the cameras on 24/7?

 

The only real drawback to motion detection is if the movement is too subtle to trigger recording when it needs to, and you end up missing things. You can work around that by increasing the sensitivity, but then you get all sorts of things setting off recordings, which makes it harder to search for incidents. Depending on the circumstances, it can take a fair bit of fine-tuning. Sometimes it's a big deal, sometimes not.

 

As for 30fps, don't even bother. Most cases, you'd be hard pressed to even tell the difference from 15fps, and even 7.5-10fps will give you pretty smooth motion. Remember that you're not making a movie here; you're recording video that may need to be viewed at some later time to see what happened... for most incidents, realtime video is extreme overkill. We do systems for two major oil companies in Canada, and for both of them, the corporate spec is a whopping 1fps.

[AMPD 0]

thats a good point, thanks soundy.. i'm pullin a late nighter. hopefully i can throw together a good system and get an estimate out to them before the days end.

 

any DVR suggestions soundy? what are your thoughts on the lack of being able to play the video back in reverse, should this be a good reason to throw out the JS XLA? or should i just leave it to them to decide and make that unit part of one of my cheaper options?

[Soundy 1]

I really don't deal with standalone systems, so I can't help you there... the only time we've used them is for extreme-low-budget, just-gotta-have-something-in-there situations so they've tended to be really low-end junk. Aside from the Digital Watchdog, I wouldn't recommend any of them to my worst enemy

 

We mostly deal with Vigil PC-based DVRs from Camacc/3xlogic, and yes, they do reverse playback very well You can also do masked motion searches on the already-recorded video, so you can go with a more sensitive trigger and refine the search later when you need to find something. 30 days' recording is a snap - the benefit with a PC-based system is that it's really easy to add storage later, even just in the form of an external USB, firewire, or NAS drive.

 

They have systems that will do anything from 60fps total across 16 cameras, to 30fps *each* on 32 cameras (960fps total). Those would fall into your "top-end" category though; their machines *start* at somewhere around $3k (I don't do the purchasing, so I can't tell you exactly).

[Daedalus51 0]

The only real drawback to motion detection is if the movement is too subtle to trigger recording when it needs to, and you end up missing things. You can work around that by increasing the sensitivity, but then you get all sorts of things setting off recordings, which makes it harder to search for incidents. Depending on the circumstances, it can take a fair bit of fine-tuning. Sometimes it's a big deal, sometimes not.

 

As for 30fps, don't even bother. Most cases, you'd be hard pressed to even tell the difference from 15fps, and even 7.5-10fps will give you pretty smooth motion. Remember that you're not making a movie here; you're recording video that may need to be viewed at some later time to see what happened... for most incidents, realtime video is extreme overkill. We do systems for two major oil companies in Canada, and for both of them, the corporate spec is a whopping 1fps.

 

Agreed. Something to consider is that the better recorders have a "pre-record" memory, which records a limited amount of video from what happened before the motion trigger. I assume it's kind of like a small memory cache that is constantly overwritten, and which gets copied to the hard drive when a motion event occurs. Of course this only works if the trigger is eventually reached, and fairly quickly; if not then it's also useless. For my cheapy DVR, though, this feature would come in handy quite a bit.

 

Regarding the fps discussion, would 30 fps make a difference in trying to get a screen grab of a license plate or face that is moving? Are the frames in 15 fps the same as the frames in 30 fps, just spaced farther apart? Or are they more blury?

[Squiffy 0]

> Regarding the fps discussion, would 30 fps make a difference in trying to get a screen grab of a license plate or face that is moving?

 

It would help in instances where the target object is moving fast, the higher the frame rate the better the chances of capturing a useable frame in cases of borderline recognition.

 

> Are the frames in 15 fps the same as the frames in 30 fps, just spaced farther apart?

 

Yes.

[Soundy 1]

^That is correct.

 

The main thing to prevent blur is a faster shutter speed on the camera - it has nothing to do with the recording device. Unfortunately, 'ye canna change the laws o' physics', and a faster shutter means less light reaching sensor, and thus a darker image. Thus, it's important to either have "faster" lens (one with a larger aperture), and/or good lighting on the situation - that's why red-light cameras have flashes with them