CCTV Camera Life Span

[normicgander 0]

As an installing dealer who must service and support your installations, how long do you think the cameras should last in the field (life cycle)?

 

More than 3 to 5 years of contiguous service?

 

-Why do Sony, Panasonic and Sanyo (to name a few) last for years. I know of some Panasonic cameras that are still working which were installed the late 1990s.

 

The reason I ask is that I'm intersted in getting other dealer opinions.

 

I installed 7 WDR mini dome cameras back in Jan/Feb of 2006 of they have had failures since the first year of service. The outdoor Sanyo cameras haven't even blinked and are rock-solid.

 

Only 2 or 3 are now the original units and they are having problems as well. Some of them were replaced during the "2 year" warranty period. The OEM said they had problems with these dome cameras and are "trying" to get them replaced. I just got the run-around since ISC west last april and now they said they wouldn't do anything.

 

I realize the whole warranty thing, but what about OEMs that make and sell a BAD product (high failure rates) and the dealer or end user gets the stuck?

 

-Is this a cultural problem or disconnect? Are US dealer expectations too high? I could be wrong, but I think the Japanese would not sleep at night if they designed and sold such junk! Has anyone sued these OEM companies in Small Claims Court?

[survtech 0]

The longevity of cameras varies widely. There are so many variables that affect this that it is hard to make general statements.

 

Electronics that are subject to high temperatures will have a severely reduced lifespan. Cameras that are installed outdoors in hot climates will never last as long as cameras installed indoors in temperature-controlled environments.

 

Engineering and marketing decisions play a huge role. If a device is designed with a 10% voltage tolerance on capacitors, for instance, it will not last as long as one with a 50% tolerance. Of course, capacitors with higher voltage limits cost more than the lower ones. The same is true of nearly ever part in a device - camera or otherwise.

 

Although most companies tend to build products to specific price points, the best companies engineer those products with conservative designs that will last longer than a more agressively design product.

 

The best companies have management that cares enough about their company's "goodwill" that they give their engineers some latitude to build a well-designed product and the engineering staff that knows how to do so. Unfortunately, there are many who don't.

 

That said, I would expect a well made camera to last at least 5 years. We have Pelco and Sanyo cameras that have been in continuous service for over 9 years. I've also seen the same longevity in Ikegami and Elmo.

 

The size of a company doesn't necessarily equate with the reliability of its product, though. I've had bad experiences with both Sony and JVC cameras. Sony, in particular, is high on my short list of manufacturers to avoid!

[Tailbone215 0]

As an installing dealer who must service and support your installations, how long do you think the cameras should last in the field (life cycle)?

 

I think a lot of it has to do with environment and how well the system is installed. Of course cheap cameras don't factor well into the equation. Stick with known good name brand products from reputable dealers/suppliers.

 

On a side note, I have had a few cameras with hot/dead pixels right out of the box. These made for instant returns. How many installers have found this to be a problem?

[shoreviewsecurity 0]

This is a double-edged sword. In my experience most customers do not want to pay for quality (define quality). I have had pretty good luck with equipment I have installed BUT I have had failures and I can usually determine why. In one of our cities the electrical grid is horrible and have also found several properties not grounded or have lost the ground due to the salt air around here. May be a coincidence, but once the ground issues were repaired, all has been OK since. Dead pixels, occasionally but rare. As survtech points out, it all depends on the environment, surges, brown outs, etc, etc, etc

 

I used to keep track of the number of cams I have installed but not anymore. One of the biggest issues I have run into is water migration but have learned to tighten everything as opposed to installing right out of the box and I always bench test prior to installation. I figure spend the time here. I know it will not eliminate a long-term failure but saves embarrassment at the job site.

 

I do know what you mean though. You price a job only to have to go back which eats your profit. I warranty my local jobs for 6 months parts and labor but after that I will replace the component as per the manufacturer warranty but charge a reduced hourly rate. I have never had an issue as I clearly state that in my proposals. It's not so much the money as it is reputation. Although the customer will say, no problem, what is he or she saying to a friend who could be a potential customer but I think our prompt response and having replacement gear on hand makes all the difference.

[long520 0]

This is a double-edged sword. In my experience most customers do not want to pay for quality (define quality). I have had pretty good luck with equipment I have installed BUT I have had failures and I can usually determine why. In one of our cities the electrical grid is horrible and have also found several properties not grounded or have lost the ground due to the salt air around here. May be a coincidence, but once the ground issues were repaired, all has been OK since. Dead pixels, occasionally but rare. As survtech points out, it all depends on the environment, surges, brown outs, etc, etc, etc

 

I used to keep track of the number of cams I have installed but not anymore. One of the biggest issues I have run into is water migration but have learned to tighten everything as opposed to installing right out of the box and I always bench test prior to installation. I figure spend the time here. I know it will not eliminate a long-term failure but saves embarrassment at the job site.

 

I do know what you mean though. You price a job only to have to go back which eats your profit. I warranty my local jobs for 6 months parts and labor but after that I will replace the component as per the manufacturer warranty but charge a reduced hourly rate. I have never had an issue as I clearly state that in my proposals. It's not so much the money as it is reputation. Although the customer will say, no problem, what is he or she saying to a friend who could be a potential customer but I think our prompt response and having replacement gear on hand makes all the difference.

 

really agree with your said,you pay money,you get quality.most people is like save the money,of cause save the quality.

[Squiffy 0]

The commonest failures with CCTV cameras (and indeed most electrical equipment) tends to be the drying out of electrolytic capacitors. Most often this will be in the PSU/regulation section. 'Capacitor plague' is also a problem:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capacitor_plague

 

Obviously heat plays a major factor in reducing the life-span, some designs are clearly better than others in that respect. If used in an extremely hot environment, then some kind of additional heatsinking would be advisable.

[normicgander 0]

I agree with most of the comments made so far, especailly regarding cheap capacitors and poorly designed voltage regulator circuits. The cost of a cheap electrolytic vs. a tantalum etc.

 

Here is some of the my correspondence with this OEM to provide more insight:

 

To XXXX,

Trust that I realize the units are out of warranty. I have replaced the cameras at my cost, both during and out of the warranty period. Our reputation and doing the right thing is paramount. Our problems with these cameras started after a few months after the initial installation. My customer is aware of these high failure rates. How do/would we explain or justify cost to this customer that the CCTV cameras which I sold them that did not provide even five years of service? This agency has several CCTV systems using other brands (specifically Panasonic) at their administration building, with not even one failure in service for over 15 years. I could understand charging a customer for perhaps one camera which was out-of-warranty, but they would lose confidence and question us for if we charged for 5 or 6 out 7 units.

 

 

To XXXX,

I’m following up on the issues with premature failures of the XXXXXX domes cameras, as previously discussed. I'm really confused at this point, as you indicated an RMA was forthcoming.

 

Can you please inform me of the status of this situation so we can consider our next steps. I realize these cameras are now out-of-warranty, but the significant number of defective units (a few which were replaced during the two-year warranty) is too excessive, pointing to a electronic design problem as agreed in our previous conversations. What was the estimated MTF? Also keep in mind that the outdoor Sanyo cameras, powered from the same supply have been operating with no failures.

[Scruit 0]

I seem to burn through one camera a year in my dashcam. They wind up giving me darker and darker images until I finally notice the darkness and swap them out. I have tried brand-name cameras (Toshiba, Sanyo etc) and no-names. The brand names tend to be more stable, but the issue seems to just be the summer heat in the car reaching 140-145F cooking the cameras.

 

I buy my cameras used on ebay and tend to pay about $50-100 for each one, and that lasts me a year. I don't want to install anything really nice because I know it won't last any longer in the heat.

 

The cameras at my house? I've still got at least 2 no-name weather proof "Sharp CCD" cameras that are 8 years old, still in place working. I have some cameras in my basement storage that were up for 6mo before they started doing stupid stuff. Lesson learned - even if it's under an eave and is 3' away from the rain, you still need a weatherproof camera or housing!

[blackhole37 0]

I'd say 5 years continuous use on quality cameras

[Squiffy 0]

FWIW, this is what I consider to be good design of a CCTV camera. In terms of this thread I mean it's not going to have its longevity reduced by its own physical design. Obviously, being a typical box type, it's not compromised by having to be particularly small.

 

Note how all 4 boards are kept well apart, there are no boards on top of each other, which obviously would add heat to the the upper board. The PCBs all interlock with each other, so the connectors will never become loose.

 

As someone who's involved with electronics servicing, it's nice to see something these days that is so easy to take apart. You can also align it (well the video processing section at least) in situ, no need for any special 'alignment rig'.

 

 

http://yfrog.com/5jlilinboardsvideocomponej