Box camera with PAL and NTSC suggestions?

[iansmith 0]

I need an inexpensive video camera with an interchangeable lens and a large (1/3" or better) sensor. So a CCTV unit with a C mount seems to be the way to go.

 

Most cameras I am looking at have lots of features designed to help out when using it as a security camera, which is no suprise. I am not using this as a security camera, but to film video, so most sites focus on stuff I don't need. I was happy to find this forum.

 

So I am looking for...

 

Picture quality is a high priority.

Manual controll of the electronic iris is also very important.

Selectable NTSC / PAL output.

Standard C mount for lenses.

 

I found this one which looks like it does what I want, although I can't tell if you have manual control over the shutter speed. Is there something cheaper or better I am missing?

 

Samsung CCTV SDC-435 Zoom Security BOX Camera, $150

 

Thanks!

[iansmith 0]

Still looking, but I need to order something soon now.

 

The main thing I need is a box camera with manual exposure settings. The picture will be going from very bright to very dark and I do not want the shutter speed, gain or anything else to change when this happens.

 

And I need PAL support. Switchable to NTSC would be a plus but not a priority.

 

Most places that sell these systems seem to have generic boxes that have no information at all on them.

[Soundy 1]

A number of cameras have manual adjustment of the iris drive level, but it's usually achieved through a small adjustment pot on the back or side of the camera... and it won't stop the iris from changing with the lighting conditions, it just sets the "base level" that the auto iris works from; the iris will still adjust according to the light levels. I can't tell from your post if that's what you want or not... if you want it to NOT change on its own, then manual iris is the only way to go.

 

Most CCTV cameras these days that have user-controllable exposure settings do it through on-screen menus... if you're wanting to change settings DURING filming, that might not be desirable. Most of those also require you to do it from buttons ON the camera - that might not be convenient either. A few do have RS-485 serial connections that allow you to access the menus via Pelco D/P protocols, but again, those will display the menus on-screen.

 

The only camera that comes immediately to mind that will let you set shutter speed and exposure via hard switches is the National Electronics NLC-5700. It's an older model, probably not readily available anymore, but if you can find one, it should give you excellent picture.

 

I'm sure there are others that fit the criteria, but they won't be in the majority. The problem you're having finding anything is probably because you're shopping for cheap online sources, and the features you're after aren't normally those of cheap cameras.

 

The other option, if you're not hard-set on analog cameras, is to look at IP cameras. Most will let you adjust and lock exposure and almost all other settings through web-based configuration menus, without those menus being displayed on-screen. Most also don't support auto-iris, but from the sounds of it, you don't want auto-iris anyway. IP cameras also give you the ability to go to megapixel resolutions, handy if you're producing with an eye to HDTV content at the end. With IP, the video format - PAL or NTSC - also becomes irrelevant.

[rory 0]

Most Zoom cameras let you adjust the Shutter speed manually. Ive used Samsung Zoom cameras that let you do this, were testing slow shutter for low light before the awful DSS became built into cameras. However going by the PDF from Samsung Techwin the SDC-435 is not a zoom camera and has an electronic shutter. Looks like an interesting camera though, if you try it please post the results here

[iansmith 0]

Sadly the camera I mentioned is not on sale anywhere anymore.

 

On screen menus for locking down the shutter speed and exposure settings are fine.. I don't need to play with them during filming.

 

I looked at IP cameras but they all suffer from serious FPS slowdown. They tend to only manage 5 to 8 FPS on the higher resolutions.

 

Do you have any suggestions for particular models, or web sites I can look at that have the features I am looking for? You are right is all I can find are cheap CCTV sites that carry mostly web camera style setups.

[rory 0]

Right here, something like this it has Auto Shutter or Manual.

 

http://www.samsungcctv.com/prd/pro_view.asp?pro_uid=1470&cat_uid=15&cat_biz=CTV&cat_lev=AC

 

They have the manual for download too at the top right.

I havent used this model, it was a much older model, but as mentioned most zoom cameras have that Manual shutter.

[iansmith 0]

Ahh, it's like the world is conspiring against you sometimes.

 

The reason I want a CCTV box camera is I need to use a specific lens with it, so a normal camcorder or digital camera will not work. (Unless it's got a big sensor and is cheap so I can rip it apart without any guilt)

 

Zoom CCTV cameras have integrated lenses, which will not work for me.. but they seem to be the ones with the manual controls I need.

 

It's a conspiracy all right!

[rory 0]

you can set the focus and everything to manual also, but yeah cant take a lens.

 

check through some of these, i dont have the time right now but they might have something. http://www.cnbtec.com/en/html/product/product_list.php?maxx=1

 

happy hunting

[iansmith 0]

Thanks, I'll look through them.

 

Worst case if I can at least find something to lock the shutter speed, even if I can't pick what setting it locks it at I can adjust the lighting to fit it.

[Soundy 1]

Like I said, see if you can track down some used National NLC5700s. They have a rotary switch for selecting your shutter speed in the setup panel. AFAIK there's also a switch for disabling AGC, so the electronics won't be compensating for changing light either. Screw on a standard C-mount or CS-mount lens, and you're good to go.

[Soundy 1]

I looked at IP cameras but they all suffer from serious FPS slowdown. They tend to only manage 5 to 8 FPS on the higher resolutions.

 

Do you have any suggestions for particular models, or web sites I can look at that have the features I am looking for? You are right is all I can find are cheap CCTV sites that carry mostly web camera style setups.

 

Most "pro-quality" IP cams will do at least 15fps at 1MP, and some will give you a full 30fps at 2MP. For example:

 

IQeye700/750 Series Camera Features

 

* 1.3 Megapixels @ up to 30 fps

 

* 2.0 Megapixels @ up to 20 fps

 

* 3.1 Megapixels @ up to 12 fps

 

* 5.0 Megapixels @ up to 10 fps

 

So, you run at 1.3MP, get your full-motion 30fps, and you still have four times the resolution of analog camera.

[iansmith 0]

Like I said, see if you can track down some used National NLC5700s.

 

I found one, will have to wait until monday to call them about it.

 

The biggest problem I have found with CCTV quality is bad noise even in bright light, which is what I will be filming. Hopefully this one will do well, thanks!

[Soundy 1]

I guess the question is, then, is that noise inherent to the camera, or a result of the recording? Most DVRs use pretty heavy compression because storage time is an important factor; many allow you to adjust the compression/quality balance and even use different codecs, but pretty much all are still using some form of lossy compression.

 

The NLC5700 should give you pretty good output on its own... for a time there, our main fuel-services client was spec'ing NLC5500s for general store views and NLC5700s for the front-door ID shots and anywhere else a higher-quality picture was required or difficult lighting was encountered.

[rory 0]

noise in bright light doesnt sound right.

i dont think ive ever seen that.

[tomcctv 190]

Hi. iansmith.

 

i was asked a while back to install a camera to film a darts match. the customer wanted to display the match on a big screen. i used a cnb camera and a 5mm-50mm lens. worked fine.

 

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