white out of people in night vision ?

[jeffm0927 0]

I have Speco cameras, 4 HT7815DNV and 4 HT7915DNV cameras with a TH series DVR.

when someone stands in front of camera at night I cant see them they are completely white. Any Ideas ?

[Soundy 1]

Get rid of the crappy built-in-IR camera, get a proper low-lux day/night camera, and add some outboard illumination if necessary.

 

Be aware that "night vision" (a very misleading term) in these cameras is simply a series of infrared emitters and basically just works like shining a small flashlight on your subject: the closer you are to the light, the brighter it is.

[Nimrod 0]

“when someone stands in front of camera at night I cant see them they are completely white”

 

When i read this i though just another cheap junk camera. But i was a little curious and decided to look it up. It turns out these are fairly good cameras.

 

http://www.specotech.com/softwarereference/HT7815DNV_AEspecs.pdf

 

http://www.specotech.com/softwarereference/HT7915DNV_AEspecs.pdf

 

The difference between them is the amount of zoom, 4 to 9mm, and 5 to 50mm.

 

525 lines or better

external control of zoom

DC iris

auto gain

BLC

color 0.03 lux, F1.2, 40 IRE, AGC on, 75% reflectance

 

The big problem with these cameras is they have built in IR lighting. There are only a few latest generation cameras that have IR intensity control to counteract the white brightness for close objects you are seeing.

 

I do not see anything in the specs to turn the leds off, but if you disassemble the camera you may be able to unplug them. As these cameras are in the $400 to 500 dollar range I would think the mfgr would answer a email or 2 about them asking how to disable the ir leds.

 

Also, make sure you have the DC iris set to auto, and try different combinations of auto white balance and automatic gain.

 

But in the end the best solution is to disable the ir leds and use even external lighting, several feet away from your camera.

[rory 0]

Internal or External IR will always do that, but they have new "Smart IR" which helps.

I say helps, because although now when a person walks right up to the camera you will see their face, the rest of the image is dark.

 

Solution, tell the person dont walk so close to the camera

Also in some cases can turn down the power of the IR .. but not on most bullets.

I would say add visible light but I imagine you are using IR for a reason?

 

With alot of new IR Bullets, if you disable the IR the camera stays in BW.

TND IR bullets have gone backwards IMO.

[Nimrod 0]

“Internal or External IR will always do that”

 

Rory, do you have any idea why the DC iris does not compensate for the bright ir leds.

[rory 0]

“Internal or External IR will always do thatâ€

 

Rory, do you have any idea why the DC iris does not compensate for the bright ir leds.

its not the IR that it has the problem with, its the object which is already whited out from the IR reflection, its just seeing a big blob of white. The IR is hitting the persons face or object with more light as it gets closer (further away there is less light), only way I guess is to decrease the IR power as something gets closer to the camera, like Smart IR - for example if you have a camera, say a really cheap 1/4" sharp color IR, placed in a car park the car park could look pitch black at night with no visible lighting as its IR is so weak, but if someone walks within 10 feet of the camera you could see their face and body, while everything else is still black.

[jeffm0927 0]

The cameras I have, has a led dial for brightness. If I turn down them will it help.

[Nimrod 0]

“The cameras I have, has a led dial for brightness. If I turn down them will it help.”

 

Yes it will help assuming you have enough light to see as far as you want, otherwise turn it all the way down and use an external light source away from the camera for long distance. Also do not forget white light is the best, you will not get the bright white ghost image.

[rory 0]

If by brightness he means the IRIS level then it will just make the whole image darker.

 

White visible LED light is actually not as good as Infrared or regular visible light.

Ive used Raytec White LEDs and would never again, total waste of money.

Raytec does mention though that their White LEDs will not give the light distance of their IR.

[Numb-nuts 1]

What's wrong with using ordinary 'cheap-as-chips' security spot lights controlled by PIR?

Cheap, good light, colour image and barely any white-out! No single camera can cover all bases

out-of-the-box. I have used difusser film over the IR with some small degree of success,

remembering of course to make a cut out for the lens

 

[Nimrod 0]

“The cameras I have, has a led dial for brightness. If I turn down them will it help.”

 

The more research i do on this camera the more impressed i am with it.

 

http://www.specotech.com/cart/products/downloads/appcharts/HT-7815DNVman.pdf

 

This camera does have a LED light level control. As well as the following features i missed the first time.

True day night with adjustable mechanical ir cutout filter.

24vac or 12vdc operation

UTP function built-in for use with twisted pair wiring in addition to standard coax

 

I would say you should adjust your camera as follows.

First turn ELC off for your DC iris to work.

Second adjust your LED level control to get a picture as far out as you want it.

Third use the DC lens level to adjust your picture for close objects.

Then go back to second and third to make compromising settings for both conditions.

 

Let us know if this works.

[rory 0]

What's wrong with using ordinary 'cheap-as-chips' security spot lights controlled by PIR?

Cheap, good light, colour image and barely any white-out! No single camera can cover all bases

out-of-the-box. I have used difusser film over the IR with some small degree of success,

remembering of course to make a cut out for the lens

 

 

Sure, even better a dusk to dawn, though many clients that dont have light now, dont want to add it. Regular garden lights do very little BTW. I have a client that has PIR lights, but still IR cameras, as the PIR doesnt work all the time.

 

My yard, 1 dusk to dawn, only 1 IR camera (cam3) where the landlord doesnt want me to add a light and too dark without it.

[Soundy 1]

What's wrong with using ordinary 'cheap-as-chips' security spot lights controlled by PIR?

Cheap, good light, colour image and barely any white-out!

I recommend this idea as well - it has the added benefit that a bright light snapping on will entice an automatic reaction in most people, particularly prowlers, to look around at the source of the light... which if the light is fairly near the camera, then gives you a nice, straight-on, well-lit, full-color view of their face.

[Numb-nuts 1]

I recommend this idea as well - it has the added benefit that a bright light snapping on will entice an automatic reaction in most people, particularly prowlers, to look around at the source of the light... which if the light is fairly near the camera, then gives you a nice, straight-on, well-lit, full-color view of their face.

 

You should see the look of surprise on their faces when they realize they're finished here.

Also I have been advised to install separate IR as there are two distinct advantages

1. If it's seperate to the camera, you can avoid spiders webs reflecting IR back into the lens

2. You can direct the IR from a different angle giving a softer light on the subject and thus avoiding white-out of your subject.

I am hoping to experiment with diffusers to soften iR flood-lighting.

 

There is nothing to stop you turning the camera IR to it's minimum or even off altogether.

[jeffm0927 0]

so I am looking at the specs form the camera and it says Mechanical day/night IR cut filter? what is that ? can that help at all ?

[Numb-nuts 1]

As I sit here, watching a spider crawling across my IR camera on the monitor,

I have to admit, I have an idea that it's a switch or could be on screen menu option.