Cat 5 hookup problem

[jisaac 0]

I got one for you guys to rack your brain on. We just installed 32 cameras with coax out from the cameras. We used video baluns bnc/to terminal. From their we obviously went cat 5 to the dvr location. From there another video balun (terminal back to bnc) and from their into the dvr. Ok so 30 cameras came up. So the 2 that where not working I disconnected from the dvr and hooked into my cable tester. It says "volts, and Pass ID# " which means that it is getting a video signal. Both said that. So i hooked back into my test monitor. Nothing! Tested voltage from the power supply and at the camera location. Both said the correct power needed. Went back to the recorder changed out the baluns with new ones and still no video. Cant figure it out. I even tested the cameras at the location with my test monitor and got video. But at the recorder, nothing!

Any ideas would be greatly appreciated.

isaac

[rory 0]

Check Cable, Cable Distance, and whether DVR Channels are enabled.

[jisaac 0]

cable has continuity remember the cable tester? It would say open if it had a break in it. It would say short if there was a short. But it says voltage and pass id. So the power is going up from the power supply to the camera and thru the cable to the last balun. So cable is good. Dvr channels are all enabled. Plus I hooked the video signal up to the test monitor and still got no signal. And the thing about this is that it is a extremely hard wire run and took alot of time getting it to this location. Its only about 95 feet. But their is so much crap between these two floors that it took 3 guys 4.5 hours to get a cable to that location. So just running a new run is absolutly my last resort.

[rory 0]

If its a balun with terminals, have you tried the other pairs?

[jisaac 0]

Ya i did. But the other pair was not used on that run. So it did not give me anything as I expected. The thing that boggles my mind is that my cable tester reads the video signal but i cant actually bring that into a visable video. Via test monitor or dvr to 42" plasma or straight to the plasma. I get nothing. The only thing i can think of is maybe the signal i am getting from the camera at the dvr location is somewhere below .8 volts. And maybe my monitors are actually looking for something above .8 volts. But my cable tester will show a pass ID# with a very low voltage. Maybe? Maybe not!

[Doug 0]

How long is the cable run. if its more than about 75% of the rated distance then you could try an active balun at the head end.

If its a very short run and you are using active baluns then you could try passive baluns.

Are the two cameras powered off the same power supply?, if so you could try powering just one of them.

If the two cameras are on the same cat 5 cable then a damaged cable or even a split pair could be the problem.

 

Doug

 

I got one for you guys to rack your brain on. We just installed 32 cameras with coax out from the cameras. We used video baluns bnc/to terminal. From their we obviously went cat 5 to the dvr location. From there another video balun (terminal back to bnc) and from their into the dvr. Ok so 30 cameras came up. So the 2 that where not working I disconnected from the dvr and hooked into my cable tester. It says "volts, and Pass ID# " which means that it is getting a video signal. Both said that. So i hooked back into my test monitor. Nothing! Tested voltage from the power supply and at the camera location. Both said the correct power needed. Went back to the recorder changed out the baluns with new ones and still no video. Cant figure it out. I even tested the cameras at the location with my test monitor and got video. But at the recorder, nothing!

Any ideas would be greatly appreciated.

isaac

[jisaac 0]

the run is only about 95 feet and I am using passive transcievers. Those particular cameras were the only cameras off those 2 cat 5's. And all 32 cameras are run off 2 12 volt dc 9 amp power supplys. These cameras only pull about 250ma each

[rory 0]

95' shoulnt be a problem.

 

can you run a new cable, but dont run it permanently, just run it loose along the ground and test it at that distance to the DVR and see what you get.

 

You said the other pair wasnt used? What type of ends do you have, and what type of cameras are these? Cat5 has 4 pairs, i take it you are using 1 for power, or 2 doubled up? Video only needs 1 pair.

 

Also make sure you are getting enough volts on the camera side, and check the video at the DVR side into a small TV or CCTV Monitor .. plasma should work though.

[Doug 0]

I have had problems in the past when using 12vdc cameras and baluns on DVRs when using a common power supply especially when some cameras are on short runs and others on longer runs, the problem hasn't been a complete loss of video though, mostly the picture tearing or what looks like a horizontal rolling line similar to a ground problem. I'm not really sure what causes the problem but its not that the power supply can't supply enough current, but using individual 12vdc power supplies has always resolved the problem in my case, so I would try using a separate power supply and see if that helps.

 

Doug

 

the run is only about 95 feet and I am using passive transcievers. Those particular cameras were the only cameras off those 2 cat 5's. And all 32 cameras are run off 2 12 volt dc 9 amp power supplys. These cameras only pull about 250ma each

[jisaac 0]

ya i can run a temp cable to see if it works. (this is a rich womens clothing store so i have to would have to do it fast or get a bunch of complaints about being in their way of their clientell) Anyways Ya I am using 1 pair for video and 1 pair for power. The other 2 pair are not being used. And you asked what type of ends do i have. Well it is terminal going into the baluns and bnc out of the baluns (male). And i did test the volts and video at by a multimeter and 5.6 test monitor at both ends. At the camera i got 12 volts and was able to get a video signal. But at the end of the cable run at the dvr I get a good signal from my cable tester but no video signal that can be seen.

I told you this was a brain racker. But definitly appreciate your past and future input

[rory 0]

complete loss of video sounds like something else though at that short distance. As for the lines etc, an amplified hub eq will sought that out, such as NVT. Doug what brand of power supply were you using?

 

Did you try the other 2 pairs just to test? Cant see if you replied to that part yet.. also should always use at least 2 pairs for power with cat5, and have to watch 12VDC as it doesnt got the distance that 24VAC does, but your distance is ok.

[jisaac 0]

ya i have not tried to hooking it up on a single power supply. I have a million power supply's at my store i will definiltly give that a try first thing monday morning. Hopefully that would help. I cant think of anything else to do. My absolute last resort is pull the camera and use the existing wire as a pull wire and run new wire and put a new camera and new baluns and then ask God for forgiveness for my future behavior if that does not work. Because I will be one mad Mother ******! We are already 2 days over schedule!

[DataAve 0]

I would never use a balun on a Professional install. Just my humble opinion. There is no such thing as a better mouse trap. Fiber or coax or combination. That is how it's done, period.

[jisaac 0]

yes i did test the other pairs. It was open on the cable tester and obviously no video on the monitor. And i normally do use 2 pairs for power but no run on this whole system was longer than 100 feet so i figured my voltage drop would be non existant. Am I right or wrong for figuring that?

Edited July 31, 2005 by Guest

[DataAve 0]

...and I wish I could help you.

[rory 0]

Hmmm... got me Dont know what Cable tester you are using though, i generally just use a meter and a toner myself. I feel your stress though ..

 

Data, NVT is a whole different ball game though, compared to baluns. Seen them in action and video is crystal clear over a mile. Course only use it if you cant run coax and cant afford fiber.

[rory 0]

yes i did test the other pairs. It was open on the cable tester and obviously no video on the monitor. And i normally do use 2 pairs for power but no run on this whole system was longer than 100 feet so i figured my voltage drop would be non existant. Am I right or wrong for figuring that?

 

You will always get voltage drop, especially with 12VDC and using 24AWG cable. Whats the exact voltage you are getting at the longest run? These Cameras dont pull much draw from what you posted though.

 

 

From one of my manufacturers on a similar subject:

"Even when using 2 pairs, you are essentially changing the wire gauge by 3, so in this case, 2 24AWG wires will be equivalent to a single 21AWG. Current capacities of wire will vary due to ambient temperatures, fill rates of conduits and runways, and the temperature rating of insulation."

Edited July 31, 2005 by Guest

[DataAve 0]

Ya, and look at the cost you lay out in labor trying to correct. You are going a mile, then you do fiber, or leave it to someone who has a lot of time on their hands.

[DataAve 0]

100 feet would give you minimal voltage drop, not even a factor.

[rory 0]

Most people cant afford Fiber, which is maybe $10,000+ more than using amplified Cat5/UTP.

[rory 0]

100 feet would give you minimal voltage drop, not even a factor.

 

Well, with 2 pairs of 24AWG with 12VDC, run approx 50', i got a voltage drop from 12.9 to 12.4, if you factor in the power supply, double the distance, and half the wire gauge, then yes it could mean the difference of the camera working or the power supply burning up. Always expect the worse then it will always work the first time.

Edited July 31, 2005 by Guest

[DataAve 0]

So, pay the labor costs out of your pocket, to figure out why it doesn't work?

[rory 0]

So, pay the labor costs out of your pocket, to figure out why it doesn't work?

 

??? If you use NVT gear it just works

[DataAve 0]

12.9 to 12.4, nothing.

[rory 0]

like i said, double the distance, half the wire gauge ... -2 volts can mean alot to a low end camera.

 

Personally i only use UTP multi pair if i have to, such as multiple buildings, and applications where fiber is not feasable. I dont use passive or baluns myself, just amplified hubs and txs, and power the cameras locally, in other words each building would have its own power supply box.