Holy Geovision High Definition Inquisition!

[rory 0]

It's not quite the same. Next Tag doesn't have reviews you could trust from others who use the product(s) as frequently as the members of this forum.

a review of a store would just be free advertising for that store so then we would loose advertisers and this forum would no longer exist. Review the product and post the link to the manufacturer, thats what happens now, people source their own store/distributor for the reviewed product and one typically closer to their location. None of these stores make the products, they simply sell the product. Members can PM suggestions to each other also, and its allowed in the dealer section as well as the spiders dont hit those areas.

[Soundy 1]

How do the rules on this privately-run forum have ANYTHING to do with the price of GeoVision cards???

.

 

Well, If someone was looking for a Geovision card, they might ask on the forum where they should order their card from. Then, someone would give them a link to go check out, and that person might go to the link, order the card, and then they would be paying a lower price than if they just started searching the net randomly.

 

But since we can't post those links, we can't help people get better deals on Geovision cards.

 

For the most part, LEGITIMATE GV cards run around the same price anywhere you look. Most of the "better deals" you'll find on the 'net are counterfeit/gray-market cards. And since those are illegal and a professional forum has to be seen to NOT condone illegal activity, any posts about those are immediately deleted.

 

You can make all the hypothetical arguments you want; fact is, the rules are set and have been for a long time, and have served this place well since long before you came along. You can live within them, or go elsewhere. Or, as rory says, try to convince the owner to change them... but arguing about it here won't change anything. The mods are here simply to enforce the rules, not to debate them.

[tomcctv 190]

Let's say Amazon decided they were getting so many Geovision card returns that they decided to drop Geovision items from thier catalog and sold their remaining stock at a huge volume discount. If that happened, I don't think we could post the Amazon link here either. Not 100% certain on that though. Maybe they are fair game?

 

 

 

so if amazon had lots of returns would you go and buy them. i think you would find many people on here would recommend NOT buying (no support)

But since we can't post those links, we can't help people get better deals on Geovision cards.

 

We should be able to have a top 10 Geovision purchase thread or something. You know, like a PriceWatch \ PriceGrabber for Geovision cards. And it could have reseller ratings and everything. That might be helpful to some people.

 

 

who would be making the money ???

 

 

 

 

for geo cards they do have a list of suppliers to go to. all are around the same price.

 

go with a un listed supplier (cheap cards) and your just buying problems no support.

[what2be 0]

to answer the OP's original question.. because I think he misunderstood the answer... you can get 1080p all you want with a IP cam and a capture card together, the options for the resolution in the geovision software only apply to the ANALOG cameras connected to the card. The IP camera gets its own window and shows whatever resolution the IP camera is set to. (at least I think this is how it works, I don't have any IP cameras installed)

[fa chris 0]

You can private message links all you want, so getting the information around to people interested instead of to google bots isn't an issue.

 

 

You currently use analog cameras, analog signal, analog capture cards. Max resolution is D1, accept it, live with it, or go digital.

 

To get to 1080p and beyond you need to switch to digital cameras, digital signal, which require an ethernet connection (as opposed to a capture card). These are commonly referred to as IP cameras, megapixel cameras, etc. You just need a DVR connected to the same network as the camera, and with software that supports the camera... instead of special new hardware. I could turn my dell laptop into an NVR to record all my network cameras, simply by adding the correct software. Nothing else needed.

 

Geovision just needs new software and an ethernet connection to support 1080p (and other digital) cameras, not new hardware.

[LittleScoobyMaster 0]

You can private message links all you want, so getting the information around to people interested instead of to google bots isn't an issue.

 

 

You currently use analog cameras, analog signal, analog capture cards. Max resolution is D1, accept it, live with it, or go digital.

 

To get to 1080p and beyond you need to switch to digital cameras, digital signal, which require an ethernet connection (as opposed to a capture card). These are commonly referred to as IP cameras, megapixel cameras, etc. You just need a DVR connected to the same network as the camera, and with software that supports the camera... instead of special new hardware. I could turn my dell laptop into an NVR to record all my network cameras, simply by adding the correct software. Nothing else needed.

 

Geovision just needs new software and an ethernet connection to support 1080p (and other digital) cameras, not new hardware.

 

 

Thanks.

 

I have used IP cameras many times before...I started with the old d-link ip camera's when they were one of the first low cost solutions you could purchase. However, when I used them way back then, I only used the proprietary software that came with them, not Geovision.

 

That said. I'm trying to understand some of the Geovision options in this space.

 

So if I take an old GV-600, hook up a newer ip camera to my home network, how can the new ip camera gets it's signal into the Geovision software? Or would I require a different Geovision card? One of the NVR cards? I have to catch up on all this. I'm considering (and I really don't know why with all the Geovision hell I have put myself through) upgrading my Geovision card, if for any reason at all, Windows 7 compatibility and higher framerates.

 

I have the GV600 with 6 cams attached and the frames are very slow. Would be nice if they were 3 times quicker at least. But, if I'm going to have to upgrade, I might as well look at the high def camera's as well. They seem so much more detailed. 720x640 compared to 1920x1080 and higher is quite a difference in quality that's for certain.

Edited October 14, 2011 by Guest

[rory 0]

New Geo software will ask to install NVR only or DVR software.

The NVR is free with Geo IP cameras, but costs per channel for other IP camera brands.

[rory 0]

GeoVision Hardware Software Compatibility Chart

http://www.mediafire.com/?qle1n9v8fa7ek2p

[Harrar 0]

The card you have is irrelevent to adding an IP camera to your system. What matters is the Geo version software you're running and if your IP cam is supported by it.

 

If you are combining analog and IP, you have a hybrid system and can keep your six analogs and add up to 26 IP cams. If your board can handle 8.5, they can be all Geovision and no licensing is needed. Versions prior to 8.5 allowed you to add up to 8 Geo IP's without license. Third party cams require a license for the number of cams used irregardless of version.

[LittleScoobyMaster 0]

The card you have is irrelevent to adding an IP camera to your system. What matters is the Geo version software you're running and if your IP cam is supported by it.

 

If you are combining analog and IP, you have a hybrid system and can keep your six analogs and add up to 26 IP cams. If your board can handle 8.5, they can be all Geovision and no licensing is needed. Versions prior to 8.5 allowed you to add up to 8 Geo IP's without license. Third party cams require a license for the number of cams used irregardless of version.

 

This seems goofy.

 

Why do we need a license just to use ip cams? What's with that? With the analog models you could just by the gv card, hook up the cameras up to as many hardware ports that you have and be done with it.

 

My GV600 v3 only supports Geovision software version 6040 or 6050.

[Harrar 0]

Guess you're out of luck with the IP cams on your current Geo system if you can only go to 6.04/5. Don't think they started supporting IP until 8.01 or so.

[Soundy 1]

 

This seems goofy.

 

Why do we need a license just to use ip cams? What's with that? With the analog models you could just by the gv card...

You just answered your own question: with IP cameras, you don't need the hardware card.

 

Look at it the other way: with the analog system, the card costs the same whether you're using one input or all of them. If an 8-channel card, for the sake of argument, costs $400, and you only put one camera on it, then you're paying $400 "per camera" to be able to record that camera. With an IP licensing setup, each camera costs the same whether you have one or 30.

[LittleScoobyMaster 0]

Guess you're out of luck with the IP cams on your current Geo system if you can only go to 6.04/5. Don't think they started supporting IP until 8.01 or so.

 

Did the IP support start to exist with the addition of extra hardware to the new GV600 models, or just extra code added to the Geo software? (6.x versus 8.x)

[LittleScoobyMaster 0]

 

This seems goofy.

 

Why do we need a license just to use ip cams? What's with that? With the analog models you could just by the gv card...

You just answered your own question: with IP cameras, you don't need the hardware card.

 

Are you saying that I could purchase, for instance, 4 Geo IP camera's only, and then provide a server and a network switch and that is all I need?

 

I don't need a Geovision card to be able to run the latest version of the Geo software on a new server?

[rory 0]

 

Are you saying that I could purchase, for instance, 4 Geo IP camera's only, and then provide a server and a network switch and that is all I need?

 

I don't need a Geovision card to be able to run the latest version of the Geo software on a new server?

correct

you select NVR instead of DVR when installing.

[LittleScoobyMaster 0]

 

Are you saying that I could purchase, for instance, 4 Geo IP camera's only, and then provide a server and a network switch and that is all I need?

 

I don't need a Geovision card to be able to run the latest version of the Geo software on a new server?

correct

you select NVR instead of DVR when installing.

 

ahh. Light just clicked.

 

ok, so, that makes sense. Now I see the need for the license model.

 

So, if I purchase those 4 high def Geovision IP camera's, do they come with the needed license to run Geovision 8.x on the new server?

 

Or, where is the license pricing available?

[rory 0]

I havent used them or done anything with the software like that, but when you search for IP cameras to be added, I reckon it recognizes the Geo's and then they can be used without adding the license, or if they arent Geo cameras then they request a license.

[bpzle 0]

Yea, the cards are limited to 720x480 D1 resolution (NTSC system). But you can certainly go buy an IP camera (megapixel if wanted), that will put out resolutions at 1080p and beyond!

 

Holy moly. You mean the user manual was correct?

 

That's lame as a cucumber in the sun.

 

Anyone have any ideas when the Geovision cards will be able to handle the resolutions that the camera's are putting out?

 

I still notice that Geovision only lists a 1024x768 window mode. Is that seriously still in place, meaning, if I have a widescreen monitor, the Geovision app only runs in 1024x768 after all this time?

 

Holy Moly.

 

IP cameras have nothing to do with analog capture cards. only that IP camera recording software (nvr) is sometimes bundled with software that comes with capture cards, like avermedia's cards

[Harrar 0]

 

ahh. Light just clicked.

 

ok, so, that makes sense. Now I see the need for the license model.

 

So, if I purchase those 4 high def Geovision IP camera's, do they come with the needed license to run Geovision 8.x on the new server?

 

Or, where is the license pricing available?

 

Geo IP cams can be used without license. Up to 8 free before Ver 8.5 and 32 cams with 8.5. When you run IP Camera Install, and click Search, it'll auto detect all Geo IP cams on the network then you just assign screen positions. You can also use the IP Utility to configure the cams into your network.

 

Third party cams are added using Add Camera after a license dongle is installed with the driver. Dongles come in 1, 2, 4, 8, , , 32 cam configurations. You can also upgrade them at a cost or add additional dongles depending on how many open USB slots you have. Check with any Geo distributor in your area for the pricing of third party IP dongles. Should be about $100.00 for 1 cam license and cheaper as you buy larger number of cams.

Edited October 15, 2011 by Guest

[rory 0]

I still notice that Geovision only lists a 1024x768 window mode. Is that seriously still in place, meaning, if I have a widescreen monitor, the Geovision app only runs in 1024x768 after all this time?

1280x1024 has been standard with it since at least 8.0

8.3+ have wide screen sizes also.

[what2be 0]

 

This seems goofy.

 

Why do we need a license just to use ip cams? What's with that? With the analog models you could just by the gv card...

You just answered your own question: with IP cameras, you don't need the hardware card.

 

Are you saying that I could purchase, for instance, 4 Geo IP camera's only, and then provide a server and a network switch and that is all I need?

 

I don't need a Geovision card to be able to run the latest version of the Geo software on a new server?

 

 

Just to try to clarify a bit, with IP cams you don't need geovision at all, there is plenty of 3rd party software that will support IP cameras. If you like the geovision software, then by all means use it, just make sure that your ip cams are compatible with the geovision software (they provide a list of supported 3rd party IP cams). If you buy Geovision IP cameras, you don't need any additional licensing. If you buy 3rd party IP cams and want to use the Geovision NVR or DVR software, you need to buy a license.

 

Lastly, you don't need a server at all, but a good stand alone pc with fast hard drives and a good processor is crucial with IP cameras, and if possible run it on its own network to keep traffic down on the LAN.

Also remember you will need to power those cameras, so you might as well buy a POE (power over ethernet) switch so you only need to have one cat 5 run to each IP cam (assuming they are POE compatible, which all the good ones are). Or you could do it the hard way and run power to each IP camera separately if you don't want to buy a POE switch (a good 10 port POE switch is around $400, cisco makes a nice one, as does d-link.)

 

You will also see that most IP cameras dual stream, meaning what you see on your screen is a lower resolution than what it records to the hard drive at. The reason for this is that it only takes 3 or 4 IP cameras (even at 1.3 mp) and your network will be near capacity. Ive never tried it, but I am pretty sure trying to stream 8 or more IP cameras at 1920x1080 is going to bring your network down to its knees. In the future I'm assuming we will see many more IP cams that are gigabit compatible (most are 10/100 right now) I know the cisco switch is a gigabit switch, so maybe with a gigabit full duplex connection between the PC and the switch and then 100mb connections from the switch to each camera would be sufficient but like I said earlier, I highly doubt it will stream 8 IP cams at 1920x1080. Hell, apple tv is only 720P and it can barely do that wirelessly and its only one stream.

 

And if you do have a widescreen , etc, like Rory said, you have options in the 8.x Geovision software to not only go to higher resolutions, but also to adjust picture to the screen format (16:9, 16:10, 4x3, etc)

[thewireguys 3]

 

You will also see that most IP cameras dual stream, meaning what you see on your screen is a lower resolution than what it records to the hard drive at. The reason for this is that it only takes 3 or 4 IP cameras (even at 1.3 mp) and your network will be near capacity. Ive never tried it, but I am pretty sure trying to stream 8 or more IP cameras at 1920x1080 is going to bring your network down to its knees. In the future I'm assuming we will see many more IP cams that are gigabit compatible (most are 10/100 right now) I know the cisco switch is a gigabit switch, so maybe with a gigabit full duplex connection between the PC and the switch and then 100mb connections from the switch to each camera would be sufficient but like I said earlier, I highly doubt it will stream 8 IP cams at 1920x1080. Hell, apple tv is only 720P and it can barely do that wirelessly and its only one stream.

 

I think your a little confused. I have customers with 200 cameras on a network with about 50 of them Megapixel and bandwidth is about 350Mbps which is not a problem for a gigabit network.

 

If your cameras stream at 5Mbps you could have well over 100 cameras on your network without any issues and there are ways to add even more capacity to a 1Gb network if you team connections. Also 10Gb networks are here and the price is dropping everyday.

 

My point is if you know how to design a network bandwidth isn't a problem.

 

As for your Apple TV that comes down to your wireless network and there is a lot more to go wrong with them. If you have a G router you only have 25Mbps of usable bandwidth that you share with your other devices. There are better wireless APs that can do 300Mps using 2.4/5Mhz and can handle multiple HD streams if designed properly.

[Soundy 1]

 

You will also see that most IP cameras dual stream, meaning what you see on your screen is a lower resolution than what it records to the hard drive at. The reason for this is that it only takes 3 or 4 IP cameras (even at 1.3 mp) and your network will be near capacity. Ive never tried it, but I am pretty sure trying to stream 8 or more IP cameras at 1920x1080 is going to bring your network down to its knees. In the future I'm assuming we will see many more IP cams that are gigabit compatible (most are 10/100 right now) I know the cisco switch is a gigabit switch, so maybe with a gigabit full duplex connection between the PC and the switch and then 100mb connections from the switch to each camera would be sufficient but like I said earlier, I highly doubt it will stream 8 IP cams at 1920x1080. Hell, apple tv is only 720P and it can barely do that wirelessly and its only one stream.

 

I think your a little confused. I have customers with 200 cameras on a network with about 50 of them Megapixel and bandwidth is about 350Mbps which is not a problem for a gigabit network.

 

If your cameras stream at 5Mbps you could have well over 100 cameras on your network without any issues and there are ways to add even more capacity to a 1Gb network if you team connections. Also 10Gb networks are here and the price is dropping everyday.

 

My point is if you know how to design a network bandwidth isn't a problem.

 

As for your Apple TV that comes down to your wireless network and there is a lot more to go wrong with them. If you have a G router you only have 25Mbps of usable bandwidth that you share with your other devices. There are better wireless APs that can do 300Mps using 2.4/5Mhz and can handle multiple HD streams if designed properly.

Second all of this - even 5Mbps is pretty ambitious for the bulk of CCTV cameras. The 2MP Hikvision cameras we use default to 2Mbps CBR, and also allow you to select VBR and define a maximum bitrate, which makes planning network capacity a lot easier. Heck, I've even had three 1.3MP IQEye cameras working over 10Mbit (previous installer botched the network cable between the switch and the DVR, so the DVR was only connected at 10Mbit). It was brutal to try to access the cameras via their web interface, but it recorded flawlessly with no dropouts.

[what2be 0]

 

You will also see that most IP cameras dual stream, meaning what you see on your screen is a lower resolution than what it records to the hard drive at. The reason for this is that it only takes 3 or 4 IP cameras (even at 1.3 mp) and your network will be near capacity. Ive never tried it, but I am pretty sure trying to stream 8 or more IP cameras at 1920x1080 is going to bring your network down to its knees. In the future I'm assuming we will see many more IP cams that are gigabit compatible (most are 10/100 right now) I know the cisco switch is a gigabit switch, so maybe with a gigabit full duplex connection between the PC and the switch and then 100mb connections from the switch to each camera would be sufficient but like I said earlier, I highly doubt it will stream 8 IP cams at 1920x1080. Hell, apple tv is only 720P and it can barely do that wirelessly and its only one stream.

 

I think your a little confused. I have customers with 200 cameras on a network with about 50 of them Megapixel and bandwidth is about 350Mbps which is not a problem for a gigabit network.

 

If your cameras stream at 5Mbps you could have well over 100 cameras on your network without any issues and there are ways to add even more capacity to a 1Gb network if you team connections. Also 10Gb networks are here and the price is dropping everyday.

 

My point is if you know how to design a network bandwidth isn't a problem.

 

As for your Apple TV that comes down to your wireless network and there is a lot more to go wrong with them. If you have a G router you only have 25Mbps of usable bandwidth that you share with your other devices. There are better wireless APs that can do 300Mps using 2.4/5Mhz and can handle multiple HD streams if designed properly.

 

Hmmm.. whats the bit depth of these IP cameras? ANd when your referring to watching 50 IP cameras at once, your talking about in the secondary stream, which is probably about 704x480 or so correct?

I guess the quality of the IP cams isn't what I thought it was, but I just ordered a few 3mp so I guess ill see for myself.

[thewireguys 3]

Hmmm.. whats the bit depth of these IP cameras?

Do you mean bandwidth of these cameras? I have used cameras and seen 200K up to 80Mps per camera

 

 

ANd when your referring to watching 50 IP cameras at once, your talking about in the secondary stream, which is probably about 704x480 or so correct?

 

Well that system I was talking about has 200 IP streams which are from encoders, 720P/1080P and 5 Megapixel cameras. The H.264 cameras we use have a secondary stream but the 5 Megapixel cameras do not (but they don't need to have one anyway).

 

Some solutions have a secondary stream (Most enterprise solutions) but most do not. Most Megapixel cameras can do multiple streams but most VMS software don't take advantage of them. So unless you plan on getting enterprise level software you will not have a second stream.

 

 

 

 

I guess the quality of the IP cams isn't what I thought it was, but I just ordered a few 3mp so I guess ill see for myself.

 

What cameras did you order and what VMS are you planing on using?