Tom12345 0 Posted October 19, 2011 just put in an altronix power supply and see what happens....12 volt 1 amp per can is all you need...hopefully you did not mess the cable up pulling it...check for a short on power..sometime that won't even help....i had same situation just replace cable then...use the old cable as a pull string...good luck Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
vmgtlexi 0 Posted October 19, 2011 Rory -- It occurs regardless of the switch from IR to B&W. I noted 9 times on 10/11/11 where the camera lost and regained power from about 8 AM to 8 PM throughout the day (all 9 of those occurrences were during daylight hours; no need for IR switching). The video on YouTube just happened to be one time when it was dark. Tom12345 -- The cable idea is good, but I suspect the cable is fine. It was AOK before install and it did not get damaged during install. It is just so odd that this problem happened 9 times on 10/11, then was perfect for a week. It recurred today for an hour. One would think if there was a power supply problem that the symptoms would be more regular and consistent. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rory 0 Posted October 19, 2011 Well the basic test is to try a separate power supply, still a problem then its a bad camera. Bad cameras these days seem like a dime a dozen regardless of brand - recently had a $2000 Bosch camera go dead on me after only a few days, and it was on a good APC Voltage Regulator. Oh yeah, make sure you are not using the same channel on the DVR, switch it to one of the ones where the cameras work. I had a bad DVR card last summer, some channels were just bad, not a connector problem either, it was like the 4th of each one, eg. 4, 8, 12, etc, no matter which camera was placed on it. EDIT, sorry forgot about the camera re initializing, forget this test then Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rory 0 Posted October 19, 2011 I almost forgot .. another story. I had a camera that would get video loss occasionally, sometimes a few times a day, sometimes not at all. It only started a few months after it was installed - prior to that the previous camera was fine. Thought maybe it was the camera, so switched that for a spare one we had - same problem. It would stay off for hours sometimes. Anyway, so they ordered a completely different camera just because, same problem - moved the connection on the power supply to another output - same thing. What did fix the problem was this - ran new wire. Problem solved. Visually the existing cable looked fine tracing it back as much as possible, power at the camera end was always fine when tested, but either way we replaced it and had no more issues since. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tom12345 0 Posted October 19, 2011 Bad cameras these days seem like a dime a dozen regardless of brand i hear that Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
vmgtlexi 0 Posted October 20, 2011 I took my handy digital multi tester and tested the line. At the camera, the power measures 11.55 VDC (at the power source, it was 12.00 VDC exactly). The current at the camera is 540mA with the camera running in IR mode. Yesterday, I placed the SCO-2080R on a different power output in my power supply unit (thinking that perhaps I had one power output gone bad. Today, the camera had 2 more failures during daylight hours (ie, no IR switchover sucking down the power). I don't believe this is a power source problem. I don't have an outlet near the camera, so I can't hook up a plugged-in adapter at the camera. Anyway, I still believe this is a camera problem. If not, why is the other IDENTICAL camera NOT having these issues? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
shockwave199 0 Posted October 20, 2011 Well then it's the camera! No sense kicking a dead problem solve. Is it still under warranty? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rory 0 Posted October 20, 2011 I don't have an outlet near the camera, so I can't hook up a plugged-in adapter at the camera. use an extension cord, or take the camera down to test it - if you are sending it back to be replaced, you have to take it down anyway. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
vmgtlexi 0 Posted October 20, 2011 I'm done with it. Sending it to Samsung; they can play with it all they want. On a positive note, I managed to get my DVR to send email alerts after a week of fiddling with that. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
shockwave199 0 Posted October 20, 2011 I can't imagine the sheer number of emails I'd get doing that. All my cams are outside- even the best of MD setup still detects a bunch. I'd only do that with indoor cams. My dvr has this, but I haven't set it up at all. Good for you though. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
vmgtlexi 0 Posted October 20, 2011 You're right about that. Apparently, while I was testing email alerts over the past few days, the DVR had a backlog of motion alerts it was trying (but failed) to send. Once I got it working tonight, it sent out over 100 emails....OUCH! I certainly don't want to get an email every time my cat decides to change sleeping positions in the garage Now that it works, I only use email alerts for 1 "isolated" outdoor cam that does not get much motion action but is an important location. I also use it for video loss events (as in the case of the camera that started this thread; it's good to know when there's video loss so I can investigate why). Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
shockwave199 0 Posted October 20, 2011 Yeah, for certain instances it's a good thing. But generally speaking, I'm always amazed at how sought after the email feature is, but how cumbersome it actually is. I'll stop short of saying it's a gimmick because for instances like you mention, or especially indoor cams, it could be a very important feature. The most useful thing I would get out of the feature is some indoor cams ready to fire off emails while the house is empty and false triggers are extremely low. Other than that, 100's of false trigger emails will get old very quickly. Hope it works for your situation. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tomcctv 190 Posted October 20, 2011 The power supply is a no-name. It is a 9-output model with a 5A total output. I am only using 5 of the 9 outputs. At the camera, the power measures 11.55 VDC (at the power source, it was 12.00 VDC exactly). The current at the camera is 540mA with the camera running in IR mode. so 5 cameras on power unit 5 amp total. 2 of which are samsung winner 5 IR cameras just for the samsung to kick in IR will need 1-2 amp which you dont have with 5 cameras connected to a 12v 5 amp power unit. you have 90 posts on how bad your samsung camera is. it cant work at its full level if under powered. you say your getting 0.5 amp at the camera PAGE 8 on your install manual tells you the power you need and its not 0.5 amp. your 5 amp power unit does not take into account your full cable run on every camera (in total) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
vmgtlexi 0 Posted October 20, 2011 Tomcctv- Why does the other SCO-2080R on the same PSU work perfectly 100% of time? Logic would dictate that if there is a PSU issue, the other exact model would display the same symptoms; but it does not. Why do the other cameras all work perfectly too? Why does this never occur when the IR is switching on or off? In my emails to Samsung, they have not suggested anything about the camera being under-powered, and they know everything about my PSU specs, my total camera loads, etc.. The manual notwithstanding, the camera, even under its heaviest draw, is NOT pulling even 1 amp. For this camera (and this camera alone on the same PSU as my other cams) to exhibit totally random power off/on problems (none of which occur during IR switchover or when there is any unusual power draw) does not seem to point to a PSU problem. With underpowering, one would expect symptoms across more than 1 camera; at least on both identical models; or for the failures to come under heavy loads such as IR switchover, etc.; but, it NEVER happens that way. It just shuts down randomly with no rhyme or reason, which the other SCO-2080R on them same PSU works 100% of the time. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
vmgtlexi 0 Posted October 20, 2011 A review of the Altronix web site shows a 12VDC PSU for 16 cameras with a total 10A output; that 's the most powerful 12VDC PSU they have. So, if one were to put 16 SCO-2080R's on that power supply, by the logic of "underpowered", it still would not work. The point being - according to the "underpowered" point of view, there are no apparent 12VDC PSU's that can handle these cameras. Why would the camera be designed for 12VDC operation if there are no 12VDC PSU's that can handle them? Something does not add up. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rory 0 Posted October 20, 2011 A review of the Altronix web site shows a 12VDC PSU for 16 cameras with a total 10A output; that 's the most powerful 12VDC PSU they have. So, if one were to put 16 SCO-2080R's on that power supply, by the logic of "underpowered", it still would not work. The point being - according to the "underpowered" point of view, there are no apparent 12VDC PSU's that can handle these cameras. Why would the camera be designed for 12VDC operation if there are no 12VDC PSU's that can handle them? Something does not add up. And yet I have several $2000 extreme much higher powered IR cameras on an Altronix PSU. Then again they are all being powered at 24VAC, always use that if you can instead of 12VDC. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
vmgtlexi 0 Posted October 20, 2011 Here are my power draws: 3 Nuvicos draw 1A each max (per the manual) = 3 A draw total 2 SCO-2080R's draw 6.8W (per the manual). And, 6.8W/12VDC = .57A each. For 2 cams, that's 1.1A. So, 3A + .57A + .57A = 4.1A total draw My power supply is a 5A power supply. So, I am not exceeding my PSU capability. This video reinforces my calculations: To Tom's point, the SCO manual states a recommend 12vdc/4A "ADAPTOR"; this is not referring to the use of a PSU; it refers to someone who is plugging each camera individually into a wall outlet. It's written in bad English, but that's how I read it anyway. I can take the heat. If you think my calcs are wrong, lay it on me! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
vmgtlexi 0 Posted October 20, 2011 Rory - 24VAC scares me. 12VDC sounds so much "friendlier" if something goes wrong (shocks, shorts, etc.). I just prefer working with low-voltage. But, if I am proven wrong about the power needs of these cameras, I will upgrade to 24VAC PSU without hesitation. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rory 0 Posted October 20, 2011 Thats the way I see it, though they may mean 6.8watts at 24VAC, they dont say so its hard to tell. Ive never seen an IR bullet with those basic components that will draw 2amp let alone 4amp. Its just a basic TDN IR bullet camera, nothing special. Ive used TONS of them and even in the old days they would not draw more than 1A, now adays things draw even less current. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rory 0 Posted October 20, 2011 Rory - 24VAC scares me. 12VDC sounds so much "friendlier" if something goes wrong (shocks, shorts, etc.). I just prefer working with low-voltage. But, if I am proven wrong about the power needs of these cameras, I will upgrade to 24VAC PSU without hesitation. 24VAC is still low voltage. Yes sometimes we can get a buz off it but not enough to worry about, that only happens to me when Im pooring with sweat and on a metal ladder. If the distances are short and most of the other cameras are 12VDC then I just use that, otherwise I would normally use 24VAC. When using powerful IR cameras then 24VAC is preferred anyway as it can be a big difference from 24VAC to 12VDC, but this is not even that. Eg. http://stna.resource.bosch.com/documents/VEI-30DinionInf_DataSheet_enUS_T7655416203.pdf 1.5A @ 24VAC 2.9A @ 12VDC And you cant power these with cat5 cable BTW. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tomcctv 190 Posted October 20, 2011 Nuvicos are 1 amp each total 3 amp you say samsung is only 0.5 amp (much powerful camera than Nuvicos) how can it run on less ??? manual says samsung 4 amp ..... its this high because of power drew of IR kick in so lets do your sums again. 3x 1 amp (Nuvicos) 1 x (working samsung ) using the last 2 amp that you have left. but under powered as all your 90 post surgests. so thats 5 amp just on 4 cameras (under powered) and you want to add another HOW you have no power left. you need at least 10 amp for what you have. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
vmgtlexi 0 Posted October 20, 2011 Correction - My PSU is made by "Atrix"; it is not a "no name". Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
vmgtlexi 0 Posted October 20, 2011 Nuvicos manual says samsung 4 amp ..... its this high because of power drew of IR kick in No - The Samsung manual says max draw of 6.8 watts fo this camera. On 12VDC, that's 0.57A. And, .57A is almost identical to the reading I took with my multitester. The 4A you keep referring to clearly states it applies to using an "adapter"; presumably a plug-in adapter. Nowhere in the specs of the camera does it say the camera ever comes close to drawing 4A. I will clarify with Samsung and let you know what they say. If I'm wrong, so be it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rory 0 Posted October 20, 2011 are 1 amp each total 3 amp you say samsung is only 0.5 amp (much powerful camera than Nuvicos) how can it run on less ??? How do you get that its much more powerful than the Nuvicos? This samsung camera is just a 2.8-10mm TDN IR bullet camera. Max. 6.8W (LED On) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tomcctv 190 Posted October 20, 2011 are 1 amp each total 3 amp you say samsung is only 0.5 amp (much powerful camera than Nuvicos) how can it run on less ??? How do you get that its much more powerful than the Nuvicos? This samsung camera is just a 2.8-10mm TDN IR bullet camera. Max. 6.8W (LED On) ops manual the manual i have here website spec sheet all say 4 amp max 12v The 4A you keep referring to clearly states it applies to using an "adapter"; presumably a plug-in adapter. Nowhere in the specs of the camera does it say the camera ever comes close to drawing 4A. ok lets forget the what the manual says. but 0.5 amp for a winner 5 36 IR camera is not right. far to low. so lets just say all your cameras are 1 amp thats your full 5 amp used nothing for IR switch on or filter move. you are still under powered Rory even calculators cant be that expensive to buy out there Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
