what is your method of installing

[jisaac 0]

I got a question that is probably going to be interesting to read the answers.

How do you run your wire for your cameras?

Do you start at your power supply and feed the wire out to the cameras?

Or do you start at the farthest camera loccation and feed it back to the recording location?

Also do you run ALL the wire first and after you are done do you hook all the cameras up at once?

Or do you do them one at a time, Hooking each up as you get each run connecting camera and recorder?

 

Tell me how you guys do it

Edited August 11, 2005 by Guest

[VST_Man 1]

start at the ps and work out............

[jisaac 0]

thats the way we generally do it but have been finding it much more efficiant to do it backwards. Especially when using cat 5 and running several cameras off one cable.

[rory 0]

either way, and run all wires then connect cameras. Generally i have someone else run the wire as anyone can do that, then I come along and do the camera install.

[Cooperman 0]

I agree with rory about whether to cable a particular way - each job is different, so whichever way suits the installation.

 

Personally, I always used to cable back from the camera positions, but maybe that's just a weird Brit. thing.

 

Also each camera should be tested (in isolation) as it's connected up, not that all should be tested togethor at the end. That helps to eliminate mid install problems which can take up a lot of time fault finding.

[rory 0]

also ... all cameras and system devices should be programmed, setup, and tested at the installers office prior to delivery and installation at the clients premises.

[bob the b 0]

I agree with rory about whether to cable a particular way - each job is different, so whichever way suits the installation.

 

Personally, I always used to cable back from the camera positions, but maybe that's just a weird Brit. thing.

 

Also each camera should be tested (in isolation) as it's connected up, not that all should be tested togethor at the end. That helps to eliminate mid install problems which can take up a lot of time fault finding.

 

Camera first, if you cut the cable short the connection is internal

[qman 0]

I usually put up the conduit first, then run all the cables from all the cameras to the DVR/PS. After that then I install the cameras and other equipment.

[rory 0]

leave slack at the camera end, if you ever need to move it, and "some" slack at the DVR end.

[rory 0]

I usually put up the conduit first, then run all the cables from all the cameras to the DVR/PS. After that then I install the cameras and other equipment.

 

homie you running conduit too ?

 

i tell the electrician i want a cable here, here, and here, etc, he pulls, runs conduit, etc. if i need gang boxes they mount those too, all to exact specs from myself..

 

mussee nice to have an electrician on staff though ..

 

Seriously though, anyone can run wire in most apps, then you need someone with proper tools and experience to run conduit, etc, and ofcourse a licenses electrician to install the electrical outlets etc, but being the trained professional CCTV technicians we/you guys are, you should be sticking to the technial side, it makes life easier Unless you "like" running wire?? I know I ran telco wire for 6 years in 100 degree heat year round, attic after attic, nail in the head after nail in the head, im done with that ... leave that to the young guys

[jisaac 0]

I dont actually run the wire. I let my the little short skinnys guys who can fit about anywhere go do that. But I do tell them everything to do from where to run the wire from, to where each camera will be mounted, and so on and so forth.

[DataAve 0]

It really does depend on the Client's needs. Most times, we just run the wires first (to location plus 10 feet). We then put in devices. The Client almost always changes his/her mind. Some want certain areas covered first, so we install in segments first-just to get them up and going. Most of the programming, I do in the office, but you can't possibly cover it all.

 

It's nice to have separate crews, one running wires, while the other sets up the head end (racks, servers, fiber, power, battery backup...etc.)

[jisaac 0]

Ya I like how you said you install in segments first. what we do to try to counter getting in a situation where you have all you cameras wired and working and the customer changes their mind, is we will bring our test monitors and have the customer see the shots before we drill the holes and run the wires. We will let them see each shot in that "zone" before we go ahead and drill the holes and run the wire. It helps does not 100% solve the problem. On one of our last jobs I had this woman who told us at the very end she wanted the monitor on the 2nd floor and not in the 1st floor on the other side of the store. So we run cable to the 2nd floor oppsoite side of the building and get it up their and she changes her mind! Back to the first floor! Then we set the monitor up and then she decided she does not even want a monitor!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! What the heck?!?!?!?!? Guess you cant prevent everything

isaac

[rory 0]

i show them the view on the viewfinder before we start the job.

[C7 in CA 0]

I guess CCTV is a little different then data networks. Mostly because there is usually a lot more cables for data. But I always run from the server room out. I pull the longest drops first. As I'm pulling the first drops I setup my Cablejoes where needed along the way. Then on the way back I install my Jhooks and remove the cables from the cablejoes and into the Jhooks.

 

The trick is to mapout your pathways carefully so you can keep the bulk of your cables bundled. Then just branch off from the large bundles when close to the actual location of the drop.

 

I rough-in all the cables first then set my guys loose on terminating the outlets while I work on the server room.

 

 

____________________________________________

[DataAve 0]

Haven't seen wood frame in ages.

[C7 in CA 0]

Yeah, not many steel mills around here. But lots of trees.

 

That was a great attic to work in. 12 feet at the peak and no tighter then about 3 feet at the low spot of the gable. Too bad the wood was so green. The glistening specs is sap.

[rory 0]

thats a huge attic man . .. we used to work in attics down here where either the ac insulation took up the full 2 feet of attic space ... night mare and plenty of scratching. .... or there were nails everywhere, non covered electrical boxes etc ... i got 2 holes in my head from the alarm days, jumping into an attic where nails were sticking out right there, in fact, my bold spot is from one of those scars!! and thats foe real ...

 

now, i stay out of attics ... cant take loosing any moe hair dude ...

[cctvman 0]

i show them the view on the viewfinder before we start the job.

 

Doesnt this get difficult depending on where the camera is going to be positioned? I can understand if its low and they just gotta hop up a couple rungs on the ladder, but are customers really willing to do this if they gotta go up 15 feet or more? how do you get around this?

[rory 0]

I dont install cameras 15' or higher .. on that rare occurance then they wont be able to see the view, unless they are willing to go that high. Most clients just want to get an idea of the view, as there is no way to show them the ultimate view until the camera is actually installed.

[cctvman 0]

This seems like an effective solution for minimizing or atleast being able to accomodate clients that change their mind about camera positioning, but doesn't this throw off your estimated installation time? How do you estimate for the cable installation? This seems like the most variable entity and I find it difficult to be accurate while also maintaining a competitive price.

 

CCTVMAN

 

 

It really does depend on the Client's needs. Most times, we just run the wires first (to location plus 10 feet). We then put in devices. The Client almost always changes his/her mind. Some want certain areas covered first, so we install in segments first-just to get them up and going. Most of the programming, I do in the office, but you can't possibly cover it all.

 

It's nice to have separate crews, one running wires, while the other sets up the head end (racks, servers, fiber, power, battery backup...etc.)

[cctvman 0]

I start from a variety of positions depending on the cabling technique that will be used to secure the cable in place. Sometime i start in the middle of a run even. I realize it must sound a little strange but I find that for instance if part of the cable run is fishing it above I-Beams then i will position the spool of cable before the I-Beams and start to fish the cable over in one direction over the I-Beams in the direction of the final camera installation. Once done that, if the other side of the cable run towards the DVR requires the cable to be tie wrapped along an I-Beam which because it isn't being run perpendicular to a number of I-Beams doesn't offer the option of fishing. So I then walk out the cable to the end of the I-Beam and hope on the ladder and start to tie wrap it to the top of the I-Beam. I find this avoids the accumulated friction of pulling the entire cable length, and with twists and turns it avoids many of the corners that force you to gather cable slack around the corner so that you can pull the next length of cable. (Some people install cable pulleys to avoid this friction) but the enevitable forces you to eventually return to this location in order to get the pulley back, unless your going to leave it there which would defeat the economical gains) This makes having 2 people pulling the same cable less necessary and it also increases productivity if you have 2 people installing because they can each focus on seperate tasks.

 

I also generally find that all things being equal I prefer to pull relatively speaking from the camera side. I find that the most common paths that cable legths share are generally closer to the DVR side, which makes sense because all cameras are terminated there. I have found that the alternative, pulling from the dvr side to the camera side can cause the common paths to become twisted and then difficult to branch in various directions, (accumulated friction) that results from the cables dragging on each other. Pulling from the camera side minimizes this I find.

 

CCTVMAN

 

 

 

I got a question that is probably going to be interesting to read the answers.

How do you run your wire for your cameras?

Do you start at your power supply and feed the wire out to the cameras?

Or do you start at the farthest camera loccation and feed it back to the recording location?

Also do you run ALL the wire first and after you are done do you hook all the cameras up at once?

Or do you do them one at a time, Hooking each up as you get each run connecting camera and recorder?

 

Tell me how you guys do it

[cctvman 0]

What is the general height of cameras you install outdoors? I figure a 6 foot person (tall kid) with a 2.5' reach, than can jump another 2 feet should be secure at about 11' to be safe at minimum from random acts of Michael Jordan hanging from the bracket vandalism. Is this just way too low?

 

I hate when clients say they want a bracket moved. Cause i gotta unscrew the bracket drill a new access hole possibly, re-run some of the cable, possibly put on new connections, and I dont like having to say to them that they're will be an added cost cause i start looking like a cheap skate. I purchase a viewfinder which i show customers. but i have also been looking at that CCTV VIDEO CAD software about the 3d positioning views. Any thoughts on that? It looks like it could be useful in terms of securing a final location and precluding customer indecision.

 

I guess the reason I feel guilty about charging them as well is because I, myself sometimes kinda agree that it should be moved. Its just difficult for any person, whether installer or not to tell how its gonna look.

 

CCTVMAN

 

 

I dont install cameras 15' or higher .. on that rare occurance then they wont be able to see the view, unless they are willing to go that high. Most clients just want to get an idea of the view, as there is no way to show them the ultimate view until the camera is actually installed.

[rory 0]

What is the general height of cameras you install outdoors? I figure a 6 foot person (tall kid) with a 2.5' reach, than can jump another 2 feet should be secure at about 11' to be safe at minimum from random acts of Michael Jordan hanging from the bracket vandalism. Is this just way too low?

 

I hate when clients say they want a bracket moved. Cause i gotta unscrew the bracket drill a new access hole possibly, re-run some of the cable, possibly put on new connections, and I dont like having to say to them that they're will be an added cost cause i start looking like a cheap skate. I purchase a viewfinder which i show customers. but i have also been looking at that CCTV VIDEO CAD software about the 3d positioning views. Any thoughts on that? It looks like it could be useful in terms of securing a final location and precluding customer indecision.

 

I guess the reason I feel guilty about charging them as well is because I, myself sometimes kinda agree that it should be moved. Its just difficult for any person, whether installer or not to tell how its gonna look.

 

CCTVMAN

 

looked at the CAD software and it didnt appeal to me.

Height will differ, but generally the reason for not mounting the camera too high is loss of FOV, Loss of Object Identification, and Maintenance and cleaning problems. In the case of Infrared Cameras, the lower the better, if they are mounted too high, dont expect any kind of IR distance.

 

Criminals come with ladders these days, ive seem some that literally climb walls, sides of buildings etc, 5+ storeys and more .. so height does not mean that the camera will not be disabled.

 

Obviously the application will determine the location of the camera, but if I cant reach it on a 6 foot ladder (and im 6'1) then its too high. Certain Restrictions apply, but those applications could also be done differently. If its a PTZ then thats a different story, but still some loss of FOV will exist when mounted too high.

[jeromephone 6]

Big differences on new const vs rework or add ons.

 

Leave slack at camera end for sure. Customer always seems to want something moved a couple of feet.

 

ID camera and cable and keep a chart as you go. tag the camera with date and we even use a single brady label to see what the camera number is without having to remove ceiling tiles or take the camera apart.

 

We usually embed all the wire then terminate both ends. We don't usually test coax but all cat5 is tested.

 

J hooks and velcro on final product.