Terrible picture quality on BNC Main Output on Dahua DVRs?

[eos 0]

Since I do a lot of High-end residential systems and some commercial systems, running new wire is not always an option when sending the output of the DVR to a unused input on a TV. With Ded Micros, Nuvico, Speco or Digital Watchdog I have never had an issue sending the composite Main ouptut to TV's around the house on an unused pair of Cat 5. Yes the quality is not as good as VGA or HDMI but the picture is decent.

 

Last year we started using ICrealtime DVR's and right away the quality was noticeable. I ripped out a 16 chan everfocus machine and put in the 32 channel ICR unit with a exisiting video feed thru RG-6 to a remote TV. The customer instantly complained, I was dumbfounded, also I could not use my ViteK 3.5" monitor to do basic setup on the DVR, too blurry. Workaround was putting in a dedicated PC running PSS to send to the TV.

 

Fast forward to yesterday, I decide to try a GEN IV DCX unit to replace a Ded Micros Ecosense DVR on an existing installation. Picture is horrible. The streaming and PSS work great. I call tech support and they seem to know about this issue but doesn't seem to faze them.

 

Has anyone here seen this issue or is it a non-issue? I'm trying to get some love from the Dahua brand of DVR's but may have to stick with Dig Watchdog. Also it seems I get ground loops with the Dahua brand more, I took out the Ded Micros and instantly the ground loop issue cropped up. Their 4 pin power supply must have some effect or some internal filtering to prevent this.

 

Once again, I cannot get VGA or HDMI to TV's on an existing installation, using VGA or HDMI baluns would work but the wiring usually is not there or cost prohibitive. It seems the video output board is low quality in the Dahua DVR or they just don't care.

[vin2install 0]

Or maybe it is soooo good that it is showing flaws in your cameras.

[eos 0]

Cameras are fine, this is a apples to apples comparison. Confirmed on multiple jobs, the only difference is the DVR. Streaming, HDMI and VGA are crystal clear.

[Soundy 1]

I guess the mighty Dahua really doesn't do it all... sorry, Rory

[SEANHAWG 1]

Yeah thats correct, BNC output is bad compared to VGA or HDMI. But the only real difference is shown on the menu screens. The Video feeds should look not quite as good, but almost as good as VGA or HDMI. Its the menu screens that look significantly different, main reason is because they are set for a higher resolution than 480p. But you cant really expect it to look as good as VGA or HDMI in the first place really.

 

To help, you will want to lower the resolution in the DVR to the lowest setting in order to get optimal picture for BNC out, if you havent done that already, that should help quite a bit. Also you need to go into advanced>TV Adjust and adjust the TV settings to get the best quality for BNC out. You can play with the margins and color settings and that should improve the picture.

 

That should help but definetely wont look as good as the VGA or BNC output and I agree you have a legitimate gripe, the Dahua's look great on HDMI or VGA but just dont look very good on BNC output. Thats why I only recommend using BNC output as a temporary option.

[Birdman Adam 0]

Hmm, the composite output on my Zeus 8 looks as good as it could for composite. Even on a 1080p 42" TV, the composite looks good. I think you are expecting too much for composite - it is limited by a pretty low standard!

[SEANHAWG 1]

Yeah, I dont think he has done the steps I described above yet which greatly helps the problem. Also, Whenever you go into the TV adjust section, be sure to hit the default button first and then adjust your TV as necessary. So:

 

#1) Go to main menu>Setting>Display>lower resolution to lowest setting possible

#2) Go to main menu> Advanced > TV adjust > Hit default > adjust as necessary

[rory 0]

It depends entirely on the monitor used, it is crystal clear on some, not so on others.

Either way it should be normal in single view, you should only be seeing this issue in Multiview.

 

Also if you are going any kind of distance you will need to amplify it.

Dont expect a $100 DVR to have the same amplifier built in that a $3000 one does.

[rory 0]

I guess the mighty Dahua really doesn't do it all... sorry, Rory

$100 vs $3000, i still have money left over to make it do it all

 

however thats pretty low non my list of cons.

The problem we had before for YEARs was that the VGA converters sucked and everyone wanted to use VGA .. now the DVRs have VGA that works good .. people complain about the composite out .

[eos 0]

So let me get this straight, I change my resolution to lowest and this will make it comparable to other brands. So this will not affect the other outputs: VGA and HDMI? It sure seems that it would. It seems odd to me, I have never had to deal with this issue before.

 

Well, on to other customer requests/issues. They keep wanting playback via IPad and Iphone similar to Digital Watchdog. Just today the customer asked me how to playback video on his Iphone. I said I'll look into it. Does anyone know if Dahua is working on this? It would be great to know.

 

The Digital Watchdog free VMAX app plays back video on the VMAX 480 units, the search function is very easy to use. You can download it and try the demo site they provide to test it. I'm just trying to use the Dahua brand, due to price points and the remote streaming seems to work better than Dig Watchdog.

[rory 0]

I think they are spending more time on Android now, which makes sense when one can pick up an $80 android device these days that has more options than a $500 iPad. But they claim there will be a new iOS app out this or next month, no word on playback though. Its probably best to just use a computer for that, netbooks with a full OS only cost a couple hundred dollars these days, and you get a real keyboard.

[SEANHAWG 1]

No playback on cell phones yet.

 

So let me get this straight, I change my resolution to lowest and this will make it comparable to other brands.

 

It will help out the resolution alot on the BNC output. The reason why your other brands look good on BNC is probably because they are shooting out 480p on all 3 outputs (BNC, HDMI, and VGA) while the Dahua's are actually shooting out HD output on all 3 outputs.

 

So this will not affect the other outputs: VGA and HDMI?

 

It definetely will not hurt it, but it will not be as HD when you lower the resolution. It will still look better than the BNC output no matter what the resolution. If your other DVR's look the same on BNC, VGA, and HDMI, then the VGA and HDMI configuration that they are using is not very good.

[lowpro 0]

Dont expect a $100 DVR to have the same amplifier built in that a $3000 one does.

 

To piggy back onto Rory's comment....

 

Recently I had to use an active hdmi extender in order to shoot the hdmi out of the dvr to my tv. I ran (2) 48ft CAT 5e cables and it looks great. However, I did need to spend a little more in order to get the active hdmi extender. The dvr just didn't have enough power (out of the hdmi output) to send it down the passive hdmi baluns.

[rory 0]

To piggy back onto Rory's comment....

 

Recently I had to use an active hdmi extender in order to shoot the hdmi out of the dvr to my tv. I ran (2) 48ft CAT 5e cables and it looks great. However, I did need to spend a little more in order to get the active hdmi extender. The dvr just didn't have enough power (out of the hdmi output) to send it down the passive hdmi baluns.

Also although Im not an expert on HDMI etc, I think that is only a DVI output using an HDMI slot?

Since it has no audio down the line? I dont know if that matters or not.

[rory 0]

Dont forget to adjust the TV Adjust section of the Menu, not just the resolution.

The TV Adjust section is what affects the composite output.

[SEANHAWG 1]

Actually the HDMI does carry audio

[eos 0]

I will give all these suggestions a try. I appreciate the help.

 

One more, I noticed on ICrealtime Dvrs they have a gain check box under "encode"--> "color" settings checked and a value of 50. However on that GEN IV DCX DVR the box wasn't checked. After I checked it and moved it to 100 for some GE eyeball cameras, the picture looked way better streaming. What does gain do? Is it amplifying the video signal or something else?

[SEANHAWG 1]

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Edited February 5, 2012 by Guest

[eos 0]

The flex and max units have the gain box checked. The price points on the ICR units are way more than other Dahua models. They also are very deep in depth. Most of the time I need a shallow DVR for residential closets.

 

The way this company has entered into the custom audio integrator community is impressive. Just recently a local supplier of audio and video gear has picked up the line. They make it sound like their product is leaps and bounds better than anyone else. I wonder how the chipset or hardware could be that much different than a Qvis, GenIV or other Dahua units?

[rory 0]

Dahua have various models and different sizes.

The different models can vary on the hardware and chips used, eg. some models such as those which support D1 real time every channel, and the newer 960H DVRs, will have a faster CPU.

 

Some will have their firmware customized, a different front face, and sometimes a different case color, but thats normally about it.

 

Gain is checked by default on all Dahua DVRs.

If its not, then someone either unchecked it or the firmware may be an old/custom version.

 

There ARE various custom firmware out there but the models typically stay the same and can be compared to the actual Dahua model.

 

Eg. Look at the specs on the right, which one is yours?

LE-AS/AN 4 - 1U 1HDD

LE-AS 8/16 - 1U 1HDD

LE-A 4/8/16 - 1U 1HDD

LE-SL 16 - 1.5U 2HDD

LE-L 4/8/16 - 1.5U 4HDD

LE-S 4/8/16 - 2U 4HDD

LE-U 4/8/16 - 2U 8HDD

LE-U 32 - 2U 8HDD

HE-S 4/8/16 - 1.5U 4HDD Full D1

HE-T 4/8/16 - 2U 8HDD Full D1

HE-AS/AN 4 - 1U 1HDD Full D1

HF-AL 4/8/16 - 1.5U 2HDD Full D1

HF-A 4/8/16 - 1U 2HDD Full D1

HF-L 4/8/16 - 1.5U 4HDD Full D1

HF-S 4/8/16 - 2U 8HDD Full D1

HF-S-E 4/8/16 - 2U 8HDD Full 960H

HD-S 4 - 2U 8HDD SDI 1080P

[SEANHAWG 1]

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Edited February 5, 2012 by Guest

[normicgander 0]

RS-170A interlaced composite video output from a DVR often looks bad on LCDs, which are designed to display a progressive scan signal. Some LCD monitors and LCD TV are better than others, i.e. scalers and converters etc. Some cheap LCDs appear to drop a field to avoid deinterlace processing.

[Patriot 0]

You guys are funny. First, IC Realtime is not the only source for Dahua's. They are about triple in price what you can buy them for elsewhere. Second, to add to the quality of the unit, I've replaced Speco, Everfocus, Ganz, and some others and the quality of the Dahua is amazing.

 

I have about 100 Dahua's in the field. I've never had an issue with quality. Our recent installation was four 16 channel hybrids, 16 channel analog and 16 channel virtual for a total of 32 channels each - grand total of 128 cameras. We have used the loop out on all four at a distance of over 120 feet and terminated them on baluns to RCA's. They are on fairly inexpensive 32 inch flat panels running 480i. No problem. We also have some cheap Everfocus quads that are looping four cameras each from various of the four DVR's to monitors 100 feet away. No problems.

 

Last, if you want to view your Dahua's on Iphone, Ipad, or Android without paying through the nose for IC Realtime's app, check out IPCAMVIEWER by Robert Chou. It is under $5.00. The biggest difference between the apps is that the ipcamviewer brings up all the cameras at once. The drawback is that you have to install each of them in the app. However, you only have to do that once. You can have hundreds of cameras come up at once if you want but I wouldn't recommend it - slows down big time.

 

Nite.

[rory 0]

I have about 100 Dahua's in the field. I've never had an issue with quality. Our recent installation was four 16 channel hybrids, 16 channel analog and 16 channel virtual for a total of 32 channels each - grand total of 128 cameras. We have used the loop out on all four at a distance of over 120 feet and terminated them on baluns to RCA's. They are on fairly inexpensive 32 inch flat panels running 480i. No problem. We also have some cheap Everfocus quads that are looping four cameras each from various of the four DVR's to monitors 100 feet away. No problems.

 

1-way video out with the composite video is fine, or loop out if the DVR model has that - it's when you do multiview it becomes a softer picture even at short distances, and thats where the VGA is much better quality. Also every LCD is different, some the video looks fine on, some it just sucks on, and if you have Cable TV connected to the LCD TV there can also be issues with rolling lines depending on the location. I use a CCTV CRT for example and the quality is fine, although its not a 40" TV. So for home uses it is generally best to use the VGA if you can to avoid any potential issues.

[eos 0]

.... it's when you do multiview it becomes a softer picture even at short distances, and thats where the VGA is much better quality. Also every LCD is different, some the video looks fine on, some it just sucks on, and if you have Cable TV connected to the LCD TV there can also be issues with rolling lines depending on the location. I use a CCTV CRT for example and the quality is fine, although its not a 40" TV. So for home uses it is generally best to use the VGA if you can to avoid any potential issues.

 

Basically that is what I've noticed. I usually just use a balun off of the Main Output for a couple of TV's and the multi-view is not great. I may try a vga to composite converter and just build it in to the bids if necessary. It just seems that the video output processor for composite is poor when it comes to multi-view on "Dahua".

 

Patriot: Some people like drinking the ICrealtime koolaid, I did my research so I won't have to buy their product anymore. I appreciate the tip on the app, GenIV does give a single view free app, which most customers find satisfactory, it does view ICrealtime units too. Now Dahua has to add playback to the app so I can quit selling Digital Watchdog