What's the point of an NVR over a computer based solution?

[jasauders 0]

While I'm sort of new in the CCTV arena, I've got some IT experience. Being a Linux fan, I've grown to enjoy ZoneMinder, as I can dump it directly on top of my file/print/web/backup server and have it utilize empty hard drive space and store feeds right there. For me, it was a no brainer. Now, I understand most people may not look at a computer/ZoneMinder setup and think it's the most logical way to go, however a desktop computer can be made very beefy with a lot of hard disk space for considerably less than some NVRs I've found online.

 

So I ask this question not so much on the premise of challenging one solution or another, but more along the lines of simply, why? What is it about an NVR that gives you the advantage over a software based computer solution? Do NVRs typically have more features than what we commonly see on some CCTV computer software, ZoneMinder included? Is the setup or management easier in any way?

[buellwinkle 0]

It's packaging for integrators that can easily sell and deploy an NVR to a customer. It's different when you are a home user and have time to select hardware and deploy the software.

[Soundy 1]

Really, the same distinctions apply to standalone vs. PC-based DVR as well. Initial simplicity of setup of a standalone, especially for smaller jobs, is attractive to many people - just unbox it and hook it up.

 

Cost tends to be a factor - a standalone is usually cheaper than the PC itself, let alone the software (and additional hardware, for a DVR), particularly for smaller installations.

 

Keep in mind that Linux isn't second nature for most people, so putting together a freeware system like ZoneMinder isn't an option for them. Most will be more familiar with Windows, which means either a very limited low-cost system, or a more expensive software package. Or a standalone.

 

As buell points out, selecting the hardware and software and putting it all together can be daunting for a beginner, and time-consuming for an installer.

 

Of course, PC-based systems do have their own advantages, especially in the way of expandability, upgradeablility, and especially options to add additional/external storage.

[jasauders 0]

Oh I understand. ZoneMinder doesn't exactly scream #1 in popularity to the average user. Granted it's well known in the open source community, but I definitely understand - the average joe looking at CCTV systems may not notice ZoneMinder on their radar instantly.

 

I was looking at it like this... go to BestBuy, pick up a tower with some beefy hard disk space, Windows would already be installed, grab some additional software for the CCTV, bingo bango done. I'm not advocating really Linux/ZM in this scenario. I'm moreso advocating a Best Buy Windows 7 enabled desktop + whatever software out there is Windows based that works half decently + some IP cameras versus a regular NVR. I mean sure, the NVR will be a LITTLE less to set up since you wouldn't have to install the software like you would on a BestBuy/Windows desktop, but still... I was curious enough to at least ask.

[buellwinkle 0]

To me, the #1 advantage of a software solution is it separates the hardware investment. So later you can buy faster, newer hardware and maintain your software license investment or the opposite, if you find better NVR software, reuse the hardware. Also allows a home or small office with a spare computer to get started for lower cost.

 

I haven't tried Zoneminder but i will. Ideally, if they had a downloadable VM that someone can run on Windows with the free VMWare Player, that may get greater acceptability.

[jasauders 0]

To me, the #1 advantage of a software solution is it separates the hardware investment. So later you can buy faster, newer hardware and maintain your software license investment or the opposite, if you find better NVR software, reuse the hardware. Also allows a home or small office with a spare computer to get started for lower cost.

 

Very true. More cameras require more processing power... so at least you can upgrade it accordingly.

 

I haven't tried Zoneminder but i will. Ideally, if they had a downloadable VM that someone can run on Windows with the free VMWare Player, that may get greater acceptability.

 

I hear ya. That said, I haven't ran Windows on my systems in quite a few years, so ZM's nature by default interests me before I even had a chance to fire it up and see what it was about.

[Soundy 1]

Of course, there's also a Linux version of Exacq server... you do have several options to run on Linux. But again, you get into licensing costs that way.

[thewireguys 3]

More cameras require more processing power...

 

 

This is not true for all VMS platforms

[jasauders 0]

Of course, there's also a Linux version of Exacq server... you do have several options to run on Linux. But again, you get into licensing costs that way.

 

While I might be some sort of an open source hippy, I'm not an idiot... I'll still use what works. Good to hear there's other alternatives. Have you used the Exacq software? I wonder what kind of costs come with it...

 

More cameras require more processing power...

 

This is not true for all VMS platforms

 

Is that to say on some VMS, 2 camera provides the same "server" load as 30? I would think to some degree the processing load would have to scale up.

 

Also, is it true that with IP/network cameras, you need a far less powerful server than you'd traditionally need? I read on some sources that the work load these days is done at the camera, and the network based server box is basically a glorified middle man just organizing all of the feeds coming in on the disks.

[buellwinkle 0]

Is that to say on some VMS, 2 camera provides the same "server" load as 30? I would think to some degree the processing load would have to scale up.

 

Some NVR software like BlueIris depends on the CPU to analyze every single frame from every single camera for motion detection. So clearly, 30 cameras would take 15x more CPU cycles than 2 cameras. But some software relies on the camera's abilities and the server only accepts requests to record or view live video. Also take the stream directly from the camera and doesn't process it internally. So yes, it's possible to have the same workload with 2 vs. 30 cameras but that depends on if you are viewing 2 cameras or 30 at a time remotely, are you getting 15x as many motion events or the same. But consider that some NVR hardware uses Atom procesors to support 15-30 cameras. Also, seperating the server from the client helps termendously. BlueIris displays all cameras at a time, it acts as the client and server, but other software has server software and clients are run remotely.

 

As for operating system. an OS written specifically to handle server type functionaly like Linux is going to win over Windows which was written primarily as a desktop OS that is riddled with safeguards for a wide variety of consumer workloads. I've done benchmarks over the years (and have been using Linux since version 0.9 the early 90's) and for a workload that's primarily write and I/O bound like capturing video would be, Linux is significantly faster than Windows, maybe 30-50% faster. So if you can run the NVR server workload on Linux, I would say that's a wiser choice. Linux these days is not that hard. A free Ubuntu or CentOS install is no more complex than a Windows install and the desktop GUI is no harder to navigate than Windows or OS X.

 

If you were to buy an Atom processor nettop as the server for a home environment, running Linux as an NVR server for 2 or 30 cameras is feasible with the right software.

[jasauders 0]

Ahh I see. Good info there. I hadn't been aware that the camera can have its own internal processing capabilities to essentially remove the bulk of the server load. Is there a name for cameras that do their own processing? I was doing some research on speaker/audio systems this weekend... sounds a lot like active vs passive speakers... active is internally amplified (self powered speaker) and passive relies on the receiver's amplifier.

 

Not to get off topic, but I hear you with the Ubuntu/CentOS/whatever comment. We're phasing out our fleet of Mac systems at work (K-12 district) in favor of Ubuntu powered Lenovos. To say it's been a success is an understatement.

[buellwinkle 0]

I setup Ubuntu on my kid's Netbook and she loves it, better than Windows, better than the OS X hackintosh that I put on there. Maybe it's the tribal music it plays when it comes up.

 

Pretty much all IP cameras have video motion detect features and many have external alarm inputs say for a PIR motion detector. That's sort of what seperates old cctv analog cameras which just had video out cables to IP cameras that are basically a computer inside the camera running some embedded version of Linux like TinyLinux that has a webserver. Mostly you setup the network configurations, tweak some video settings and setup motion detect zones or external alarm and setup email alerts if you want. They can operated 100% on their own. The purpose of the NVR software is to bring mutiple cameras together on one screen, manage the recordings, provide remote access.