Few basic questions D1 related

[Brent1971 0]

Hi All, I have a 4 chan Hard drive DVR that has served me well for several years. But the camera resolution is just so-so even with good cameras with high line counts (540/600). I believe that the unit only "sees" less than that many lines and there is the key to the limit on clarity. (Right/Wrong?)

 

My neighbor mentioned a "Full D1" level is much clearer.

 

What is the deal and will a D1 DVR record better video off my better cameras which have 540 or 600 lines?

 

Can anyone recommend a 8 or 16ch D1 DVR that wont break the bank? Any suggestion son small bullet cameras that can get the MAXIMUM D1 quality effect?

 

Just looking to get the basics understood here and possibly a camera and dvr recommend or two.

 

Thanks this is my first post here!

[vector18 1]

Which dvr do you currently have so we can make a comparison? And how are you viewing the cameras? If it's

on a large screen, than D1 will be much better than say a qcif,cif, or less. If if you want to playback video

and zoom in on something, the higher resolution recorded means the less pixelated the image will be.

 

[survtech 0]

D1 will make a huge difference in resolution (sharpness) if your cameras are higher lines but less if you have "330-line" cameras. A lot also depends on your compression settings. Even running 4CIF/D1 resolution on the DVR, the picture will look bad if you run very low bitrates.

 

NOTE: D1 and 4CIF are quite close, D1 being 720x480, while 4CIF is 640x480. That compares to CIF, which is 320x240. Those are NTSC resolutions. PAL is somewhat different.

[Brent1971 0]

OK Thanks. the youtube comparison is very helpful. Here is another one which shows 4CIF (640x480) VS 3 Megapixel digital if you select 1080p HD youtube viewing it really shaows a difference.

 

 

The 3MP is much sharper still.

 

There are so very many DVR's on amazon/ebay for example,but many have poor reviews.

 

Can anyone recommend a affordable D1 DVR that actually works properly?

 

Are there cameras specifically that can take full use of D1 resolution?

[vector18 1]

If you want even higher than D1 but don't want to spend the money for megapixel, you also have the choice

for a 960H Dvr and 700tvl cameras just FYI. For just a tad bit more, I'd rather go with megapixel cameras

and an NVR with multiple hard drives. Even streaming over the net is a higher resolution on NVR's as long

as your bandwidth can handle it.

[survtech 0]

If you want even higher than D1 but don't want to spend the money for megapixel, you also have the choice for a 960H Dvr and 700tvl cameras just FYI.

In our camera tests over the years, we've found little apparent difference between "standard-chip" CCTV cameras with rated resolutions of 470-lines, 500-lines, 540-lines, 600(+) lines, and even cameras that use the Effio 960H chip. Perceived resolution remains approximately the same.

 

We assumed that something else in our chain was the limiting factor: distribution amps? signal transport (coax and/or baluns)? our matrix? monitors? something else?

 

We had resigned ourselves to the perceived limitations of our system until a little-unknown manufacturer brought us a demo of a new camera. The inMotion in11S3N2D uses a ⅓” Sony SuperHAD II CCD - considered to be a lower-grade sensor than the Effio. Still, we noticed a substantial improvement in both resolution and the ability to distinguish color differences.

 

Are they the equivalent of megapixel? Hardly. Still, the difference to any other analog camera are substantial.

Edited July 23, 2012 by Guest

[ak357 0]

If you want even higher than D1 but don't want to spend the money for megapixel, you also have the choice for a 960H Dvr and 700tvl cameras just FYI.

In our camera tests over the years, we've found little apparent difference between "standard-chip" CCTV cameras with rated resolutions of 470-lines, 500-lines, 540-lines, 600(+) lines, and even cameras that use the Effio 960H chip. Perceived resolution remains approximately the same.

 

We assumed that something else in our chain was the limiting factor: distribution amps? signal transport (coax and/or baluns)? our matrix? monitors? something else?

 

We had resigned ourselves to the perceived limitations of our system until a little-unknown manufacturer brought us a demo of a new camera. The inMotion in11S3N2D uses a ⅓” Sony SuperHAD II CCD - considered to be a lower-grade sensor than the Effio. Still, we noticed a substantial improvement in both resolution and the ability to distinguish color differences.

 

Those increased capabilities were thought to require at least XGA or 720p cameras. We are pleased to be proven wrong.

 

Carl, can you plz sent me PM about pricing for "Craig" camera which u like

Thx

[vector18 1]

When viewing a 700tvl camera on a 960h dvr next to a 520tvl camera on a D1 dvr on the same monitor, you are not going to see a difference. But zoom into something and you will see a difference. As far as chips go, I agree, some are better than others when it comes to colors and noise reduction at night.

[survtech 0]

Not too many 960H DVRs on the market that integrate with a 1,000+ camera system.

 

I could count them on the fingers of one amputated hand....

[vector18 1]

What does that have to do with what we're talking about?

[survtech 0]

What does that have to do with what we're talking about?

Darned if I know. Do you?

[rkninc 0]

We like talking about casino surveillance. Even though the topic was about 4ch system.

 

Thank you cctvforum for your entertainment value.

 

EDIT: I see the Topic was about D1 and the questions were concerning 960H... So I guess the comment was relevant. My fault.

 

What does that have to do with what we're talking about?

Darned if I know. Do you?

[vector18 1]

What does that have to do with what we're talking about?

Darned if I know. Do you?

 

I'm not the one that started talking about 1000+ camera systems.......

[Brent1971 0]

Hi, is this with a standard DVR like mine, or with a "Full D1" recorder?

 

 

If you want even higher than D1 but don't want to spend the money for megapixel, you also have the choice for a 960H Dvr and 700tvl cameras just FYI.

In our camera tests over the years, we've found little apparent difference between "standard-chip" CCTV cameras with rated resolutions of 470-lines, 500-lines, 540-lines, 600(+) lines, and even cameras that use the Effio 960H chip. Perceived resolution remains approximately the same.

 

We assumed that something else in our chain was the limiting factor: distribution amps? signal transport (coax and/or baluns)? our matrix? monitors? something else?

 

We had resigned ourselves to the perceived limitations of our system until a little-unknown manufacturer brought us a demo of a new camera. The inMotion in11S3N2D uses a ⅓” Sony SuperHAD II CCD - considered to be a lower-grade sensor than the Effio. Still, we noticed a substantial improvement in both resolution and the ability to distinguish color differences.

 

Are they the equivalent of megapixel? Hardly. Still, the difference to any other analog camera are substantial.

[vector18 1]

We still don't even know which dvr you have?

[Brent1971 0]

It is a plain vanilla hdd 4 channel analog hard drive unit. H264 compression I believe.

[vector18 1]

That's like you asking me which car do I drive and I tell you it's a white car with 4 wheels and it runs on gasoline.......

[ak357 0]

That's like you asking me which car do I drive and I tell you it's a white car with 4 wheels and it runs on gasoline.......

 

Vector 18

in his first post he is asking for recommendations

 

"Can anyone recommend a 8 or 16ch D1 DVR that wont break the bank?"

 

Who cares what He has now ?

[vector18 1]

I guess your one of those that do not read the entire post? He JUST asked a question if his current dvr does something so I told him that he never told us what he currently has. Than he told us that's it's a vanilla hdd with h264 compression. So please read every post before you make any ____ comments!

[ak357 0]

I guess your one of those that do not read the entire post? He JUST asked a question if his current dvr does something so I told him that he never told us what he currently has. Than he told us that's it's a vanilla hdd with h264 compression. So please read every post before you make any ____ comments!

 

Hmm, I guess u have ADD

then is not worth my time to "argue" with you

[Brent1971 0]

This was a VERY helpfully informative post. I need to restate my question now.

 

Were these camera tests done with the cameras connected directly to a monitor? Or was there a DVR compressing and then displaying the images? I will also ask a general question by itself. Thanks!

 

 

 

 

If you want even higher than D1 but don't want to spend the money for megapixel, you also have the choice for a 960H Dvr and 700tvl cameras just FYI.

In our camera tests over the years, we've found little apparent difference between "standard-chip" CCTV cameras with rated resolutions of 470-lines, 500-lines, 540-lines, 600(+) lines, and even cameras that use the Effio 960H chip. Perceived resolution remains approximately the same.

 

We assumed that something else in our chain was the limiting factor: distribution amps? signal transport (coax and/or baluns)? our matrix? monitors? something else?

 

We had resigned ourselves to the perceived limitations of our system until a little-unknown manufacturer brought us a demo of a new camera. The inMotion in11S3N2D uses a ⅓” Sony SuperHAD II CCD - considered to be a lower-grade sensor than the Effio. Still, we noticed a substantial improvement in both resolution and the ability to distinguish color differences.

 

Are they the equivalent of megapixel? Hardly. Still, the difference to any other analog camera are substantial.

[Brent1971 0]

OK my ORIGINAL post's goal was to find a reasonably affordable security DVR and camera system that would deliver higher resolution than my old style analog sytem that is NOT D1 or 4CIF.

 

Also looking to raise my knowlege about the various technologies.

 

Broadly, it looks from reading the posts that there are three general categories of DVR rising in picture quality:

 

Analog CIF (old school)

D1 and 4CIF - ballpark similar

Megapixel Digital (various levels)

 

I dont think I can afford IP/Digital Megapixel type technology, so my next step looks like D1/4CIF

 

My cameras are mostly all more than 330 lines, I dont have the specs in front of me but one is 540 and one is 600 day night very small bullet cameras.

 

I WAS under the assumption that plugging these into a "Full D1" DVR would greatly improve the image quality, and therefore identify an intruder farther away than the 20' or so I can now.

 

But then there was the camera test post that calls that into question with a Super HAD II chip technology mentioned as the only really better technology of camera itself. So now I am in fact a bit confused.

 

I would welcome example DVR's and cameras to go see that some of you might have experience with and can vouch for.

 

Thanks all info appreciated.

[ak357 0]

 

Analog CIF (old school)

D1 and 4CIF - ballpark similar

Megapixel Digital (various levels)

 

I dont think I can afford IP/Digital Megapixel type technology, so my next step looks like D1/4CIF

 

I would welcome example DVR's and cameras to go see that some of you might have experience with and can vouch for.

 

Thanks all info appreciated.

 

Do your self a favor and buy IP megapix or HD-SDI

lots of choices

they are not expensive as u think

 

As we used say in my old country

"I am not that reach to buy garbage"

if that make sense to you

[Brent1971 0]

can u please post a few links of example products? would be a great help!

 

 

Analog CIF (old school)

D1 and 4CIF - ballpark similar

Megapixel Digital (various levels)

 

I dont think I can afford IP/Digital Megapixel type technology, so my next step looks like D1/4CIF

 

I would welcome example DVR's and cameras to go see that some of you might have experience with and can vouch for.

 

Thanks all info appreciated.

 

Do your self a favor and buy IP megapix or HD-SDI

lots of choices

they are not expensive as u think

 

As we used say in my old country

"I am not that reach to buy garbage"

if that make sense to you

[nDAlk90 0]

I think I would have to agree...

 

IP cameras have a noticeable quality difference from analog.

 

Dahua products which are often recommended on this forum are inexpensive and yet have very good quality. I have tested a few of their models and have been impressed. I should be posting some sample pics in a few days.

 

You can find their products sold re-branded, or by doing a Google search you can find them sold under the OEM (Original Equipment Manufacturer) name like from links below.

 

 

http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_noss?url=search-alias%3Delectronics&field-keywords=dahua+ipc

 

http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_nkw=dahua+ip&_sacat=0&_odkw=dahua&_osacat=0

 

 

Do your self a favor and buy IP megapix or HD-SDI

lots of choices

they are not expensive as u think