Setting Up Hitachi VK-C77U?

[Mr. Anonymous 0]

I do a lot of videography and editing but I'm new to the surveillance camera thing. My buddy needed an RCA to coaxial converter so he could stream YouTube throughout his house on the coaxial network already installed in his home. He did not have the $20-$30 for the converter and I had one, being impatient he traded me some security cams for it (dumass) so I got these both for $20! I've needed a surveillance system for a while now anyway I have several $K into my custom interior electronics in my truck, enough said.

 

 

The white Hitachi VK-C77U retailed for $399? The small cam is a cheap B&W Swann Secura Cam SW214-SCC:

 

 

I am really impressed with the Hitachi's quality, and its auto focus. I think I'll be using the Svideo interface, it is highly configurable even via remote:

 

 

This is where my truck is always parked, the view is out of the center of the house on the second floor but I have no windows to mount it in up there plus it's not waterproof so I'm thinking the basement window...also being MF it would be best for getting a focused image from behind glass:

 

 

Look for the blue circle in the upper left hand corner of the basement window, I'm thinking this is my easiest location. It is closest and eye level for face shots however I would have a blind spot on the passenger side of the truck...

 

 

I just need to find a way to get the video from the back basement window to the center of the house on the second floor. I know they make cheap wireless transmitters but they are RCA only, the cam is Svideo...I know they make adapters but how much of a picture quality sacrifice am I going to make loosing the split signal? The TV I was going to use (not camera monitor) supports Svideo input but I would be on an RCA line instead with the wireless. How would you go about this, wouldn't a long Svideo cable require some sort of inline signal booster that would add interference? They have Svideo to Cat5 adapters but Cat5&6 aren't shielded that well, they also have BNC to regular house coax cable adapters...I just don't know what to use without loosing picture quality!?

[hardwired 0]

There are a number of different S-video over CAT5 adapters available, here's one- http://www.muxlab.com/assets/files/datasheets/VE_S-Video_Balun.pdf

 

The idea of a balun of this type is to allow correct impedance matching for the signal over twisted pair cable, and the balanced signal path over twisted pair cable makes shielding (usually) unnecessary.

[Mr. Anonymous 0]

Thanks! I hadn't received much help over here so I've been keeping up on it with an electronics forum. Here is a quote I got over there do you think your method will work better though?

 

"RG-6 can be had for cheap, buy it by the foot (whatever lengths you need) and then buy the appropriate ends. I don't recall if there are BNC connectors designed for RG-6, I always only see the ones designed for RG-58. If not, an F connector on one end with a female F to BNC adapter. On the other end an RCA connector. They make those as compression connectors for RG-6

 

If you don't have the compression tool, a local cable company employee would likely do it for you for cheap or a small fee. (under the table of course)."

[hardwired 0]

Well, the S-video output is just two standard 1.0V P-P level video outputs, one carrying the Luma signal, and another carrying the Chroma, so it should work fine. (assuming you can find a decent way to break out of the S-video connector to connect to the coax).

 

Do make sure that you use pure copper core coaxial cable with copper braid shielding, (ideally 95% braid coverage), and keep both cables as close to the same length as possible.

 

The most commonly found RG6 or RG59 is usually for cable TV or satellite use, and has a copper covered steel core, with foil shielding. This type of cable is unsuitable for carrying low frequency (baseband) video.

[Mr. Anonymous 0]

If I did the coax like that it would be out of the BNC with the resulting RCA end on the monitor side. If not Id stick with the S-video and Cat extension, for $60 I could have two Balun's but my length is under 65ft so if I can make it with a good 50ft S-cable I may not even need the Cat system right?

[hardwired 0]

Yes, if you can find a decent S-video cable, that should be fine. Are you planning on recording this, or just live viewing?

 

If you think you might run a DVR later, you might want to run a standard coax cable for the composite video while you are running the S-video cable.

[Mr. Anonymous 0]

Live viewing for now, but that's an $80+ cable setup I don't have funding for at the moment. I'm thinking about putting a 4-head VCR next to the camera on LP for the time being, wouldn't it be easier to just do an S-video Y-split upstairs? (viewing/DVR)

[hardwired 0]

You should be able to run three RG59 cables with BNC connectors at each end, and use two of them with adapters like in this photo to change from the two cables to the S-video connector, and then use the third one for the composite input on the VCR. (Google Datavideo CB-2 for an example).

If you use bulk cable and put the BNC connectors on yourself, the whole thing shouldn't cost more than $40 or so.

[Mr. Anonymous 0]

Actually my VCR supports S-video input so I may only need the two cables unless when recording to tape it's easier to use a non-separated signal?

[hardwired 0]

No, I made the assumption that the VCR was a composite input, what you have planned is fine.

[ak357 0]

No, I made the assumption that the VCR was a composite input, what you have planned is fine.

What is VCR ?

[Mr. Anonymous 0]

No, I made the assumption that the VCR was a composite input, what you have planned is fine.

What is VCR ?

 

lol I know right. It's old school but it will get the trick done for now at least I'll use a decent VCR and a new tape hahaha. Where can I buy a barebone DVR with just a few channels or even a single channel? Barebone as in install your own hard drive maybe power supply etc?

 

 

I found an old bracket in one of my parts bins, used for I don't even know what but I don't need the middle extensions:

 

 

Only the middle and top holes were tapped on the camera mounting block so I drilled out the bottom and tapped it 1/4"-20:

 

 

Like I said not sure what the bracket was used for but I drilled 2 of the end holes out:

 

 

Solid anchoring system:

 

 

Mounted it right where I was talking about, I have an old creepy basement. If you look closely you can see I knocked out the inner pane in front of the camera to reduce focus problems since they are both wavy led glass, I'm also going to put a piece of plywood across the bottom of the floor beams to hold the VCR up the ceiling temporarily until I run cables two floors up which by then I may have a DVR upstairs:

 

 

Just for framing purposes I used a 13" tube TV with an S-video to composite adapter...looks good I was worried it might not have a wide enough angle lens, it even covers my ATV tarped behind my truck. I can actually screw on other lenses if need be I'm going to look for a cheap wide angle lens:

 

 

I even have clearance between the other side of the cam and windowsill, I noticed the only vent on this thing is on the top. My basement gets dusty I hope it wont get inside I see a foam pad under the vent on top:

 

 

Downside is it is easily spotable from the outside, I'm going to make a black square out of construction paper or something and cut a hole in it the diameter of the lens. Someone could easily put something in front of the window if they knew it was there ahead of time:

[Mr. Anonymous 0]

Worked on the system some more today, I cut the end off an extension cord and hardwired it to the junction box by the window:

 

 

I'm working with the cables and adapters I have on hand, to try an avoid interference I used a double male end (gold plated) composite adapter instead of a short patch cable. I realized I gave away my S-video VCR so I'm stuck with a Sony SLV-N51 which only has composite so I used an S-video to composite adapter (gold plated) and a gold plated S-video cable. In the background you can see a long stretch of mono composite video cable, it's not gold plated but will serve as a pull out connection to frame up the camera if needed with an external TV/display:

 

 

Like I said the VCR is temporary, it has gold plated composite inputs but the gold plated is only the front L2 inputs. It's a decent VCR; 19-micron heads. I like the fact you can rewind a T-120 tape in just 60 seconds with the Flash Rewind feature, good for re-recording/dumping a tape. Thing is that's a 6ft S-video cable, I don't need all that so it's curled up to the left of the VCR...but up against a wall voltage power line I hope it does not pickup interference:

[Horizon 0]

Nice score with the VK-C77U. I take it you haven't had a play with the 12x optical power-zoom and auto-focus yet?

[Mr. Anonymous 0]

Nice score with the VK-C77U. I take it you haven't had a play with the 12x optical power-zoom and auto-focus yet?

Haven't tried the zoom but the AF works really good!

Edited September 1, 2012 by Guest

[Mr. Anonymous 0]

There are a number of different S-video over CAT5 adapters available, here's one- http://www.muxlab.com/assets/files/datasheets/VE_S-Video_Balun.pdf

 

The idea of a balun of this type is to allow correct impedance matching for the signal over twisted pair cable, and the balanced signal path over twisted pair cable makes shielding (usually) unnecessary.

 

I used your quote on an electronics forum, because I have a surveillance system thread over there as well. This is what I got in return:

 

"yep ... that is correct :

impedance matching

unbalanced to balanced line drive (and vice versa)

 

what they don't mention is the roll-off and degradation of signal with the type of balanced line involved .

there is a difference between the way/method that dsl and ethernet is shipped over cat5 and straight guts baseband video .

 

sure , if you want a picture that makes it hard to tell bonnie from clyde at a cheap price ...

weeeelll ...

 

i have seen video shipped over balanced lines ... it utilized "twinax" ."

[hardwired 0]

It's true that there is a very small amount of signal degradation in balun conversion; the tradeoff is being able to use a smaller diameter, less expensive cable, often able to also provide power through a single CAT5 cable, and being able to run distances exceeding the limits of regular coaxial cable.

 

For extremely long runs, there are active (amplified) baluns that provide signal boosting, and equalization for the higher frequency attenuation that occurs.

 

Most casinos now utilize twisted pair cable for most or all of their camera systems, even on cameras dedicated for recognizing individual cards. If there was truly that much signal loss, they would be choosing some other transmission method (some are changing to IP for very high resolution cameras, but the majority are still analog).

 

Overall, the difference in signal quality between coaxial cable and (decent quality) baluns at the distances you are running would probably not be noticeable, and probably would require testing the signal with an oscilloscope or similar equipment to discern any difference at all.

[Mr. Anonymous 0]

That is what I will go with then, for the meantime I realized my VCR idea is not going to work I can't even get half a day out of a VHS tape. Trying to avoid recording on my PC so it does not have to stay running but I see it eventually going that route with more higher mounted cameras down the line. I'll still keep this ground level "face cam" recording on an off-grid DVR as an backup archive, the PC cams will be HD since web cams are the way to go with that it seems. I need a cheap DVR with just a few or a single channel...

[Mr. Anonymous 0]

This looks like decent quality cable from eBay for $11 from a trusted seller... yes?

[hardwired 0]

Without providing specifications, it's hard to say- refer back to my previous quote,

 

"Do make sure that you use pure copper core coaxial cable with copper braid shielding, (ideally 95% braid coverage), and keep both cables as close to the same length as possible.

 

The most commonly found RG6 or RG59 is usually for cable TV or satellite use, and has a copper covered steel core, with foil shielding. This type of cable is unsuitable for carrying low frequency (baseband) video."

[Mr. Anonymous 0]

I'm having a hard time finding pure copper core 95% copper shielding... any suggestions?

[hardwired 0]

I'd check around in your area for an electrical supply house that can provide bulk cable, and attach your own connectors.

[Mr. Anonymous 0]

RG-6 right??

[hardwired 0]

RG59 is the cable type most commonly used, RG6 is typically used for very long runs, due to lower resistance.

[Mr. Anonymous 0]

I found a box of 500ft good quality 95% copper with power leads for $100 shipped, so just to get up and running I was thinking about trying the $15 cord then when I get another cam re-running all copper RG59. What kind of problems can I expect with the cheap cord?