need help choosing low light camera

[what-da 0]

I need held in choosing a camera I have short listed the following

but have not seen picture of any myself. I am after the best night shots and high frame rate.

 

Dahua IPC-HFW3300

vs

Acti KCM-5611

vs

Axis P3364-VE or AXIS Q1604-E

 

also has anyone seen pics from AXIS P3364-LVE (ir version)

 

would like to here your opinions

Edited August 28, 2012 by Guest

[BrotherX 0]

Have U ever looked at Everfocus ?

They got quite good products.

 

Been using EAN3220 and never regret it.

Oh, they got good night shots too.

[buellwinkle 0]

I have the KCM-5611 and HFW3200 and both do very well at night but the Dahua is not WDR. So details in the shadow in bright sun, ability to see license plates with headlights on, is superb on the ACTi and not good on the Dahua. So depends on your expectations and if you need/want WDR. Also, the ACTi is autofocus and 18X zoom vs. about a 3-4x varifocal on the Dahua. ACTi provides NVR software, Dahua does not but don't know if that's important to you.

 

The Axis Q1604-E also has WDR, but is not their best low light camera, that would probably be the Q1602-E with the lightfinder feature but it's not megapixel. They are coming out soon with the P33 dome with lightfinder and 1MP resolution.

[what-da 0]

Thanks buellwinkle

 

Well the Dahua is out

But the two Axis cameras are the lightfinder models

Axis P3364-VE and P3364-LVE with IR

[hotwire 0]

You might want to check out the Axis P3384-VE also.

[ivan_sh 0]

I have the KCM-5611 and HFW3200 and both do very well at night but the Dahua is not WDR. So details in the shadow in bright sun, ability to see license plates with headlights on, is superb on the ACTi and not good on the Dahua. So depends on your expectations and if you need/want WDR. Also, the ACTi is autofocus and 18X zoom vs. about a 3-4x varifocal on the Dahua. ACTi provides NVR software, Dahua does not but don't know if that's important to you.

 

The Axis Q1604-E also has WDR, but is not their best low light camera, that would probably be the Q1602-E with the lightfinder feature but it's not megapixel. They are coming out soon with the P33 dome with lightfinder and 1MP resolution.

 

i hear about dahua provides the software of PSS , and the WDR is not related with the license plates with the headlights on , the HLC is related with the bright light.

[lemike41 0]

Q1604 & P3364 are correct if you have a decent amount of white light, the color mode is great but if you use IR results are not exceptional

i have one p3364 outdor and a q1604 indoor

 

-at night i have a lot of motion blur (max shutter can't be set above 1/30sec)

- it seems that on axis cameras their is an anti noise effect that can't be removed or reduced at night,

-if you want a crystal clear image you have to set a very slow shutter speed like 1/1sec

Edited August 29, 2012 by Guest

[buellwinkle 0]

Thanks buellwinkle

 

Well the Dahua is out

But the two Axis cameras are the lightfinder models

Axis P3364-VE and P3364-LVE with IR

 

They are not available yet.

[lemike41 0]

p-3364-ve is available since June in Europe

[voip-ninja 0]

p-3364-ve is available since June in Europe

 

That's interesting as there is no info about it and no demos or screenshots of it with the IR going.

 

It would be very helpful if you could post some screenshots as well as sample video of the performance of the 3364-VE with infrared at night. I am very interested in these as potential replacements for lower end cameras I have in some locations.

 

If the P3364 is not that good with the integrated IR then I am back to looking for a better integrated IR camera or going with a lower end camera and using external IR.

[buellwinkle 0]

A lot of companies will introduce a new product to one market at a time to work through firmware issues. But I pinged Axis yesterday on this and have not heard back.

[lemike41 0]

Hello

 

i don't have LVE but VE without integrated ir, i have a raytec fusion rm50 over the cam

http://www.axis.com/products/cam_p3364ve/

 

i'm sorry but i can't post any sample unless i blur half of the image

[unsportsmanlike 0]

Hello

 

i don't have LVE but VE without integrated ir, i have a raytec fusion rm50 over the cam

http://www.axis.com/products/cam_p3364ve/

 

i'm sorry but i can't post any sample unless i blur half of the image

post it something better than nothing...

[lemike41 0]

1/30sec shutter / gain : 12db

Ir light + white light in the back ground

 

[lemike41 0]

white light in back ground is a 70w spot

[what-da 0]

Some sellers told me that the ir version is not avaliable but have a look at this link

http://www.midwestsurveillance.com/AXIS-P3364-L-VE-Network-Camera-p/0001-008.htm

[lemike41 0]

Availability:: Currently Unavailable

[what-da 0]

Thanks for that I must be bind not to see that.

 

Does anyone know when they are coming out?

[bike_rider 0]

Q1604 & P3364 are correct if you have a decent amount of white light, the color mode is great but if you use IR results are not exceptional

i have one p3364 outdor and a q1604 indoor

 

-at night i have a lot of motion blur (max shutter can't be set above 1/30sec)

- it seems that on axis cameras their is an anti noise effect that can't be removed or reduced at night,

-if you want a crystal clear image you have to set a very slow shutter speed like 1/1sec

 

So you are saying that in night mode you can't set the shutter speed to something like 1/100? When you say that the IR results are not exceptional, may I ask what you are comparing against and is there something that you would consider exceptional (box preferred, but can live with dome)?

[lemike41 0]

So you are saying that in night mode you can't set the shutter speed to something like 1/100?

 

yes unless you use a fixed shutter of 1/100 for day & night = exposure problem when scene is too bright during day

 

When you say that the IR results are not exceptional, may I ask what you are comparing against and is there something that you would consider exceptional (box preferred, but can live with dome)?

 

They are sold for super low light cams but they are not unless you use a slow shutter and a lot of gain (noisy image...+noise reduction effect that can't be managed)

 

also if you turn on WDR image is worst in low light

 

i have exceptional result with my old bosch ltc0620 analog cam (i'm always in color mode), ok it's an analog cam...

 

i have similar result to the p3364 with my Mobotix if i use the same 1/30 shutter mode + IR,

(but as i like crisp images my mobotix use a 1/250 shutter so every cam has a 150w PIR flood light over) ...

[bike_rider 0]

So you are saying that in night mode you can't set the shutter speed to something like 1/100?

 

yes unless you use a fixed shutter of 1/100 for day & night = exposure problem when scene is too bright during day

 

When you say that the IR results are not exceptional, may I ask what you are comparing against and is there something that you would consider exceptional (box preferred, but can live with dome)?

 

They are sold for super low light cams but they are not unless you use a slow shutter and a lot of gain (noisy image...+noise reduction effect that can't be managed)

 

i have exceptional result with my old bosch ltc0620 analog cam (i'm always in color mode), ok it's an analog cam...

 

i have similar result to the p3364 with my Mobotix if i use the same 1/30 shutter mode + IR,

(but as i like crisp images my mobotix use a 1/250 shutter so every cam has a 150w PIR flood light over) ...

 

I always find it interesting what sort of subtle issues you only find out when you have the camera in hand. So in night mode, if I force a fixed shutter speed (1/100), as long as I have an auto iris and reasonably consistent light, it should be OK?

 

I have to say I'm a bit disappointed. I'd read good things about the 1604 and somebody hear posted 3364 images. I went back and looked at those 3364 images from a bar scene and it looked like somebody had used watercolors for the image- there was no fine detail at all.

[lemike41 0]

can't say for your situation, not sure it will work correctly, this cam has some strange behaviour with fixed shutter, mine is installed on a very bright area, and the sun shine directly on the camera too (backlight compensaton is great i have to say...)

 

watercolor effect is common with H264 in low light in general ...

 

go for a p3364 if you can add some white light you won't be disapointed

 

do you need WDR?

[bike_rider 0]

can't say for your situation, not sure it will work correctly, this cam has some strange behaviour with fixed shutter, mine is installed on a very bright area, and the sun shine directly on the camera too (backlight compensaton is great i have to say...)

 

watercolor effect is common with H264 in low light in general ...

 

go for a p3364 if you can add some white light you won't be disapointed

 

do you need WDR?

 

I need two cameras. One dome that works in lowish light (house outside lights on, lighting can be upgraded if needed) and one that will rely on a strong IR at night. Box or dome is fine for the second. I don't need WDR - I'm moving the cameras to avoid direct sunlight into the lens. The IR dependent one is a tough scene because when there is no person/car in the image the background does not reflect IR very well. This can confuse a camera that cannot quickly handle the apparent change in lighting when a reflective surface (like a person) enters the scene. the 3364 looks very promising for my non-IR dependent scene.

 

thanks

[lemike41 0]

i ask about WDR because if you turn on the WDR low light result is worst (it was on in the uploaded image)

[voip-ninja 0]

I think your results with the external IR are better than you realize. The integrated IR on the P33 when it becomes available is supposed to adjust intensity and beam spread based on the lens position.

 

Lots of manufacturers show off wonderful looking night video of their cameras that is not realistic for the typical suburban user.