Q-See 720p QCN7001B taken apart (images)

[AaronHolio 0]

Hello everyone, my first time here.

 

I recently purchased the Q-see 8016 NVR package with 720P cameras from Costco. As I've read in other posts, some people are having the same problem as me with the IR LED's flashing on and off. I assume this is most likely due to the CDS light sensor cell catching the light from the LEDs creating a loop where it can't decide if it is daylight or not. And by looking closer into the internals of it, I think I can see why. The light sensor is picking up light in the visible spectrum before it even exits the glass lens. But it typically won't do this as long as you have the camera mounted up far away where it tends not to catch the light.

 

In an attempt to see if I could modify it somehow, I completely disassembled on unit. Unfortunately I found no decent solution as of yet. I even unplugged the LED board (4 conductor cable) in the hopes that I could just get the camera to stay in color mode no matter what - because for some of my camera positioning I have plenty of street light. It required power cycling the NVR to get it to re-initiate the camera, and the result was that it stayed in black and white mode no matter what (at least it was robust enough to keep working with the IR board unplugged instead of malfunctioning).

 

I first bought a 8 camera DVR system for $400 from costco, this was about 4 months before the NVR IP systems became available. I paid $699 for the 4 camera system, which I found odd considering they want $300/pair for the cameras, it came with 4 ($600 worth) and for $100 more you get the DVR. A sure sign that the cameras should be selling for $80-$100. I just got the Costco preview "web only" advert for December and I was really hoping to see the package with 8-12 IP cameras, or a price drop on the 720p camera pack, or the 1080p cameras being available as Q-See themselves told me they would be 6 weeks ago. Looks like we may have to wait until after new years for that.

 

I really wish Q-See had the foresight to allow the IP cameras to be configurable to turn off the IR, or set a light-dark value as to when it switched. Guess I can only hope for a firmware update for that (unlikely)

 

I'll provide a better review and input once I'm a bit more conscious, but for now I thought I'd post the pictures I took before I put the unit back together.

 

Important to note for any of you that want to tinker with this. Be very careful with the allen wrench main outer screws. The metals of the screws aren't exactly hardened well. I stripped out the hex head on the first unit I tried. Also, the screws inside the unit are very tiny and hard to nab onto without a magnetic tipped screwdriver (which I had).

 

I'll update this more when I am more awake.

Edited November 13, 2012 by Guest

[AaronHolio 0]

Sorry had to make a second post to post the remaining 3 images.

Edited November 11, 2012 by Guest

[lowpro 0]

Welcome! Thanks for the pictures. Is this Aaron from the q-see fb page?

[AaronHolio 0]

Yup. Same Aaron. I'm the one often trying to nudge them with tips and suggestions. And not being very nice when I posted this reply to their 11% "deal"

Edited November 11, 2012 by Guest

[lowpro 0]

See, I'd knew you'd be a good fit! Welcome.

[groovyman 0]

Have you seen the night time demo of this camera on youtube? You can clearly see a reflection of headlights moving up the middle of the video as the car moves closer. Interesting if this is the best demo video Qsee can post of this camera:

 

This package doesn't seem like much of a bargain if there's flickering, reflections and, as another member posted, major cropping when dropping the camera's main stream to lower resolutions: viewtopic.php?f=19&t=32683

 

I guess the old saying "you get what you pay for" is holding true with these cameras.

[AaronHolio 0]

Groovyman: That looks to me like pretty mild lens flare.

 

As for the flickering, I'm only noticing it when I'm getting odd bounce back off the IR LEDs being reflected back in.. In other words, the camera seems to be thinking "It's too dark! Turn on the LEDs! It's now bright and must be day! Adjust the luminance internal settings and turn off the LEDs. It is odd, in some placements I have of the camera, it is perfect, the image beats the pants off of what I was getting out of the analog cameras.

 

On your last point, I think I remember reading that q-see is calling this their first dual core cpu powered box. I'd like to know the processor being used (anyone wanna take theirs apart and see, or know offhand?) - but I can tell you, whatever CPU they are using, I bet my Samsung Galaxy Note 2 has 5 times the processing power. Because if they are rating it as doing 30fps on 4 720 cameras, I can already tell you the system is stressed. I have a direct HDMI connection to a 42" TV that I use to monitor it.. and when cars drive by, and it is dealing with recording it. It is certainly NOT 30fps per channel. It can get choppy, looks to be about 20-22fps. Now add to that load -- setup the automatic FTP upload of video and snap shots, email alerts, and other background processes, and I've even had it where the mouse skips unresponsively across the screen. So q-see, if you are reading this, you better (or you better ask your actual OEM) to start to get serious about adopting a better processor than my cell phone has. Because this isn't cutting it. It supports up to 16 cameras, where you are going to drop to 5-7fps (not including if you have a few 1080p cameras in the mix. This latest (new) NVR should be their bottom of the line model. I mean really, it costs about $100 and comes with a 1TB HD, supports having two 3TV internal HDs.. That is pretty good, but they've skipped out on expandability. They should be very hard at work at this point at a model that can handle 16 1080p cameras at 30fps. Because 2-3 years from now, that is going to become standard issue.

 

The reason I still like them, it is cheap. Sells at Costco where I can return what I don't like easily, and get cheap replacements. If a camera dies, I can likely get a free replacement. 3-5 years ago a camera with these specs was $800. Last month I bought complete 4 camera + NVR system for $700. I bet in late January or February, we see this same system going for $500, the 720 cameras going for $80-$100/ea, and hopefully, the 1080p cameras below the $225 mark.

 

I can tell you for sure, there are many lighting situations where the camera could still perform excellently in lower light conditions before it is switching to B&W IR illumination mode. A good solid firmware update could fix this, but from what history has shows us, q-see doesn't seem to really make any dramatic upgrades to their hardware, only minor fixes.

 

If money was no object, q-see wouldn't be my pick. But in the next half year I have about 40 cameras to deploy across our business and for some clients. None of which could happen if I was spending $500 per camera.. So you are right, there are some trade-offs here.

[SportPlumber 0]

Maybe I missed something but can't you just log on to the camera in IE and go to the Day and night setting and select "color" or "BW" or "switch by period" ?

[AaronHolio 0]

Maybe I missed something but can't you just log on to the camera in IE and go to the Day and night setting and select "color" or "BW" or "switch by period" ?

Hey Sport, I read thru the manual for the camera and I didn't see that option. Did I miss something? Unfortunately I have yet to buy my PoE enabled switch so I haven't directly logged into the camera, and once it is behind the 4 port PoE on the NVR they become their own subnet - unreachable by anything on the LAN side of the NVR..

 

Maybe I better double check again once I buy the PoE switch?? Let me know if you know more.

[SportPlumber 0]

When you get the ability to log directly into the camera web service, you will see the functions you want are there along with lots of other cool stuff. For example you can change the default "auto" day night mode to "color" and force the camera to remain in color mode. Also you can define a time period for it to switch modes or leave it in black and white.

 

Who knows, you might even click the like button on Q-SEE's facebook page...

[AaronHolio 0]

Odd, I didn't see that in the manual for the camera. I better double check. I'll have to order a PoE switch this week so I can login to the camera and check it out. Thanks for the tip. I'll report back if I find out that I can rig it to the settings I want.

 

p.s. I did click Like on the q-see FB page, and have liked some of their postings. I'm just a critical reviewer.

[Kawboy12R 0]

With a name like A. Holio whowouldathunk it?

 

Thanks for taking the time to dismantle it and show pics. Much appreciated.

[SportPlumber 0]

That may not be in the manual which is not uncommon in cameras costing much more than these. Actually I was quite impressed with the effort Q-SEE went to to create documentation and the ease of setting one of these systems up.

 

But when you are able to see the features available through the Web Service, you might consider a retraction. These re-branded Dahua cameras are a very good value looking at what is on the market in their price range.

 

Best Regards!

[AaronHolio 0]

Well this is a bad sign. Costco isn't shipping the 4 cam nvr for $699 anymore and has the 2 cam nvr for $599. Not the direction I was hoping to see them head. Guess it is selling pretty well ?

 

http://www.costco.com/Q-See-4-Channel-HD-Digital-NVR-with-1TB-Hard-Drive-and-2-HD-720p-IP-Cameras.product.11767205.html

 

Meanwhile they have a lower price on the 16 channel DVR with 16 included cameras at $699. The digital IP revolution is not happening at the pace I hope for

http://www.costco.com/.product.100007973.html

[buellwinkle 0]

The offer was one month only, expired Sunday on 11/11. Now it's gone back to what it was before, $599 for NVR + 2 cameras + $299 for 2 more cameras.

[lowpro 0]

Well this is a bad sign. Costco isn't shipping the 4 cam nvr for $699 anymore and has the 2 cam nvr for $599. Not the direction I was hoping to see them head. Guess it is selling pretty well ?

 

http://www.costco.com/Q-See-4-Channel-HD-Digital-NVR-with-1TB-Hard-Drive-and-2-HD-720p-IP-Cameras.product.11767205.html

 

Meanwhile they have a lower price on the 16 channel DVR with 16 included cameras at $699. The digital IP revolution is not happening at the pace I hope for

http://www.costco.com/.product.100007973.html

 

Look at the Costco thread. I was told today (by Q-See) that an 8-channel ip system would be offered at the beginning of next year. However, still no signs of the 1080p cameras that were supposed to be available back in Oct.

[fran 0]

The Q-see camera is from China? good

[AaronHolio 0]

Look at the Costco thread. I was told today (by Q-See) that an 8-channel ip system would be offered at the beginning of next year. However, still no signs of the 1080p cameras that were supposed to be available back in Oct.

 

Ah thanks, I hadn't searched much and read up on the other threads. viewtopic.php?f=19&t=32694

 

They could have at least reverted to the $499 price for the NVR + 2 cams. But supply and demand wins I guess, I'm sure these are selling pretty well or we may have seen a better deal come up by now, or the same deal to at least continue.

 

Glad you heard from them we'll see the 8 channel system after new years. I can wait that long. Hope the deal is good. Maybe after that we'll see the 1080p cameras show up.

[dnbhd 0]

I just purchased this QSEE kit and I'm having a hard time trying to fig out how to mount it outdoors. Can anyone with thie unit snap a couple of pic of how they have the camera mounted and where their putting/hiding the female CAT5 and the DC12V Female plug. I'm totally new to this and I'm lost.

 

Thanks

[KyleK29 0]

I just purchased this QSEE kit and I'm having a hard time trying to fig out how to mount it outdoors. Can anyone with thie unit snap a couple of pic of how they have the camera mounted and where their putting/hiding the female CAT5 and the DC12V Female plug. I'm totally new to this and I'm lost.

 

Thanks

 

Drill a hole that will fit the plug, plug in your your wires (cat5, etc), and then drop/push it through that hole (wall/ceiling/etc.). A 3/4" or 1" will probably suffice. Then mount over that hole. You want to avoid exposed wires.

 

 

With regards to the Q-See camera IR issue .. may have been suggested. Have you tried adding a foam donut to the IR sensor? I've seen this in other cameras with surface-mounted IR sensors. Just a piece of foam with a cone shape (small end over sensor, large end touches glass). This should be effective in stopping the cycle.

 

=========== <--- Glass

\fff\____/fff/

------xx-----

 

---- = PCB

xx = light sensor

fff = foam

[AaronHolio 0]

With regards to the Q-See camera IR issue .. may have been suggested. Have you tried adding a foam donut to the IR sensor? I've seen this in other cameras with surface-mounted IR sensors. Just a piece of foam with a cone shape (small end over sensor, large end touches glass). This should be effective in stopping the cycle.

Hey Kylek, a great idea. I had thought of that myself. But I haven't found a foam or plastic doughnut around the house that would do the job. I'm sure I can find something online if I search long enough but haven't made the effort. I'm willing to bet that if the light sensor only saw light coming from the outside of the glass it would make a good difference. But maybe also cause the camera to prematurely switch to night (B&W) mode as it wouldn't be seeing as much day light. I wonder if there is a clean IR filtering flim out there that I can find that could be placed over the sensor -- you know, something that would pass normal day light, but filter out the IR that the LEDs are sending out. I guess I won't have much of a problem once I finally go up in the attic and mount the cameras where their view is 30+ feet away from the target view.

[MaxIcon 0]

Maybe I missed something but can't you just log on to the camera in IE and go to the Day and night setting and select "color" or "BW" or "switch by period" ?

 

You can do this, but it doesn't disable the IR LEDs. They always come on when it gets dark, even when the camera stays in daylight mode, so IR reflections may still show up.

 

They also don't let you adjust the day/night switch sensitivity. Mine stays in day mode long after the main field of view is dark, due to a patch of sky at the edge of the field of view.

[AaronHolio 0]

Got around to putting up a couple of my IP 720P cameras today, so took down the older analog models. -- and look what I discovered, the light sensor does have a shroud around it extending almost all the way to the glass front lens. This may explain why the IP camera is so much more sensitive to its own visible spectrum IR LEDs.

 

Also note the IR LEDs on the analog camera, the are shaded a bit more to pass less visible light, while the IP camera has clear plastic. Although both seem nearly as bright when viewing in pure darkness. Perhaps the LEDs used on the analog cameras are more powerful and that is balancing the comparison out.

[AaronHolio 0]

FYI cross post link. I posted an image of the internals of the QC-804 QC-808 QC-8016 to this thread viewtopic.php?f=19&t=33196&p=211759

[AaronHolio 0]

I mentioned to q-see on their Facebook Page the issue about the flashing IR LED issue (mentioned before where the light sensor is seeing its own light from the IR LEDs causing it to go into an endless on/off loop) and they said they'd look into it. I really hope this means we get a firmware update for the cameras.

 

If this issue or the RTSP stream corruption bug is bothering you too, I recommend going to Q-See's FB page and liking that wall post or adding a comment of your own to encourage them to address it.