Network Video Recorders

[t84a 0]

Hi folks. Newbie here. I need some schooling on NVRs. I'm pretty well versed in networking (I'm a Cisco and Linksys partner) and have installed some basic IP cameras in vacation homes. I have an upcoming project for a current customer that necessitates a recorder. I want to take advantage of IP and POE technology so I'm not real interested in DVRs. In my basic searches, I'm blown away by user licenses. Is that a racket or what? In any event, I don't have a problem purchasing the solution from a cctv installer as a package as I don't really understand the hardware/license arena and don't want to jump into the wrong platform.

 

So, given that, tell me about NVRs and how one should go about the selection process. Thanks

 

Ken

[buellwinkle 0]

Chicken and egg, you want to record but you haven't selected cameras. Select the cameras you want to use, and then find an NVR that works with them. Some cameras don't need an NVR to record.

[prairietech 0]

I just purchased Blue Iris for $ 50.00 that runs on a XP Pro box. For the price, I think it has been a good investment.

 

 

 

Hi folks. Newbie here. I need some schooling on NVRs. I'm pretty well versed in networking (I'm a Cisco and Linksys partner) and have installed some basic IP cameras in vacation homes. I have an upcoming project for a current customer that necessitates a recorder. I want to take advantage of IP and POE technology so I'm not real interested in DVRs. In my basic searches, I'm blown away by user licenses. Is that a racket or what? In any event, I don't have a problem purchasing the solution from a cctv installer as a package as I don't really understand the hardware/license arena and don't want to jump into the wrong platform.

 

So, given that, tell me about NVRs and how one should go about the selection process. Thanks

 

Ken

[ak357 0]

Hi folks. Newbie here. I need some schooling on NVRs. I'm pretty well versed in networking (I'm a Cisco and Linksys partner) and have installed some basic IP cameras in vacation homes. I have an upcoming project for a current customer that necessitates a recorder. I want to take advantage of IP and POE technology so I'm not real interested in DVRs. In my basic searches, I'm blown away by user licenses. Is that a racket or what? In any event, I don't have a problem purchasing the solution from a cctv installer as a package as I don't really understand the hardware/license arena and don't want to jump into the wrong platform.

 

So, given that, tell me about NVRs and how one should go about the selection process. Thanks

 

Ken

Where are u located ?

[t84a 0]

I'm in Maryland. I'm open as to cameras and NVR. The only requirement I have (or want) is IP based and the NVR should be self contained. My customer doesn't have, nor does she want or have room for, a dedicated PC. The business is a restaurant.

[t84a 0]

I just purchased Blue Iris for $ 50.00 that runs on a XP Pro box. For the price, I think it has been a good investment.

 

That's the Foscam product. I'm looking for something a little more comprehensive than that. Thanks though.

[MaxIcon 0]

Foscam sells BI software, but it's not a Foscam product (and the Foscam website is known for including malware in software packages). BI is a far higher quality product than Foscam.

 

What do you need that BI doesn't do? That would help reduce the selection.

 

As for licenses, I use 2 solutions that don't include per-cam licenses. I'm sure there are others, and people will chime in, but both of these work for me.

 

Blue Iris - Able to use up to 32 cams, limited by the PC capabilities. MP cams cause a lot of CPU usage, and you need a pretty powerful modern PC if you want to run, say, 20MP or more. I doubt you could hit the 32 cam limit unless they were all VGA/D1 cams.

 

Aver NVR software (used with an NV6240-16 card) - Limited by the card design. Mine will take 16 cams, and is much more CPU stingy that Blue Iris. The software is free, but the cards are expensive if bought new. Essentially, the card acts as a dongle for the software if you don't use the analog inputs.

[t84a 0]

Thanks. We don't want to buy a PC. I just want a box hanging somewhere on the network that can be accessed by the main Point of Sale PC if they need to configure, view or download something. We don't have room for another PC.

[buellwinkle 0]

If you are starting from scratch, stick one one brand and the NVR's will be less expensive and you'll have one throat to choke when something isn't working the way you want.

 

On the very low end, Dahua makes very good cameras ranging from $100 up to as high as $800 with a very good mix of products. Their NVRs are dirt cheap, maybe $400 for a 16 channel NVR with a 2TB hard drive. Dahua has pretty close to zero service and support.

 

The next step up are the Taiwan companies like Vivotek, Geovision, Messoa, ACTi, Avtech, and to me the top is ACTi with a broad product line, prices that are probably double Dahua. Figure an average outdoor camera runs about $600. They have a 16 channel NVR, it's about $800. ACTi has excellent service and support.

 

The next step up are the European companies like Mobotix and Axis, excellent cameras, excellent support and services. Figure 50% more for European over Taiwan brands.

 

There's a few American made brands and I have not been impressed by any American brand which includes Arecont, Stardot and others. Suprisingly, I received poor service and support from Arecont only 60 miles from my house.

 

There are also the Japanese cameras like Samsung, Sony, Panasonic. Panasonic is probably the largest, I've heard #2 in the network camera behind Axis. They have some good PTZ cameras that are reasonably priced. Sony and Samsung I rarely hear anything about. Toshiba basically buys cameras from other companies and rebrands them. Sanyo was popular for a little bit, now I don't hear anything about them. My issue with support from a large consumer electronics company like Sony is you may get lumped in with the guy trying to get his alarm clock radio doesn't work right. Just saying, don't know, never had a Sony camera, only cameras with Sony guts.

 

If you are doing it for someone else for a commercial environment, and your reputation is important, avoid Dahua, avoid any boutique brands were you are not sure about support and I would go with either Axis or ACTi. In special situations, where a distributed network is key, Mobotix. If you buy a lesser known brand, first them may not even make an NVR and companies that offer generic NVRs may not support them.

 

Also, there are alternatives to NVRs. With Axis and Mobotix, you can have the cameras do all the NVR work including motion detection, notifications, recordings. Then you use free client software on a PC only when you want to view the cameras or recordings. With Mobotix it's called MxControlCenter and with Axis it's called Axis Camera Companion. The client software is free, and in reality, you'll need a PC to view the cameras anyway.

[thewireguys 3]

^^ what no Canadain companies?

[buellwinkle 0]

Avigilon, but serioulsy, does anyone take cameras made in Mexico and Canada seriously. Beer & Hockey, that's another story.

[ak357 0]

Avigilon, but serioulsy, does anyone take cameras made in Mexico and Canada seriously. Beer & Hockey, that's another story.

 

Hmm, I hope u joking

[thewireguys 3]

Avigilon, but serioulsy, does anyone take cameras made in Mexico and Canada seriously. Beer & Hockey, that's another story.

 

What cameras are made in Mexico?

[buellwinkle 0]

Exactly, who knows, who cares, don't buy a burrito from an unknown source.

[tomcctv 190]

aver nvr. not limited like the dahua also as a sales ptch have POS takes most IP cameras with no licence costs

[voip-ninja 0]

I think Buell gave you some really good information and a great summary. There are a lot of Avigilon partners here and it is also supposed to be really good but you will have to have a PM conversation with them for pricing.

 

I think that Axis might be a good fit for you, because in the case of Axis, you don't even need a DVR... the Axis cameras have an onboard DVR capability (Axis Companion) in certain models and can record the events to SD card and still be web accessible from a browser. It will even do time-line and events from a bunch of cameras in one browser view, all using no NVR, which is pretty neat.

 

Cutting the NVR box/license out of the equation can easily lop $500-$1000 off of the hardware/license cost of your deployment and Axis cameras are very good quality and well supported. All you would need is a small PoE switch to power them that could be co-located with the other layer2/3 switches in the deployment.

[tomcctv 190]

cutting nvr costs means using a pc ???? which op has said he does not want.

 

The business is a restaurant

 

it is always best to have a monitor showing in a bar or restraurant. just so staff can keep an eye on none payers

[t84a 0]

Ok, I looked at the Axis stuff. I need to get this out there: my budget is about $2000-$2500 total for this piece. My customer doesn't want to spend $5000-$10000 catching someone stealing $100 worth of food or alcohol. Given that, any options or should I just go with Foscam? Thanks

[t84a 0]

Buellwinkle,

 

Your site is great.

[thewireguys 3]

Axis camera station is free for a reason... It's SLOW searching video.

[voip-ninja 0]

Axis camera station is free for a reason... It's SLOW searching video.

 

Do you really think that it matters for a restaurant to spend 10 minutes searching for a recording vs it being done in 10 seconds?

 

I agree with what someone else said that they should have a live view monitor, but it did not sound like the OP had enough room for any additional hardware.

[voip-ninja 0]

Ok, I looked at the Axis stuff. I need to get this out there: my budget is about $2000-$2500 total for this piece. My customer doesn't want to spend $5000-$10000 catching someone stealing $100 worth of food or alcohol. Given that, any options or should I just go with Foscam? Thanks

 

Axis M1014 they are about $240 a pop for 720P with audio... you put some $14 SD cards in and run Axis Companion. You can do a six camera installation for about $1500 including PoE.

 

Or, I guess you can get Foscam.

Edited January 10, 2013 by Guest

[tomcctv 190]

Ok, I looked at the Axis stuff. I need to get this out there: my budget is about $2000-$2500 total for this piece. My customer doesn't want to spend $5000-$10000 catching someone stealing $100 worth of food or alcohol. Given that, any options or should I just go with Foscam? Thanks

 

 

 

 

hi..... sell customer a foscam ......and watch them get upset.

 

 

if your not looking at a NVR now and you cant use a PC how are you going to give your customer a view of there cameras

[voip-ninja 0]

Ok, I looked at the Axis stuff. I need to get this out there: my budget is about $2000-$2500 total for this piece. My customer doesn't want to spend $5000-$10000 catching someone stealing $100 worth of food or alcohol. Given that, any options or should I just go with Foscam? Thanks

 

 

 

 

hi..... sell customer a foscam ......and watch them get upset.

 

 

if your not looking at a NVR now and you cant use a PC how are you going to give your customer a view of there cameras

 

He previously said they would use a web browser or application running on one of the point of sale computers if they needed to look at video.

[t84a 0]

I am looking at NVR. I'm not sure where you got the idea that I'm not. In any event, ninja is correct in that she will have a PC; just not one to dedicate to surveillance.