Kalatel Boot Loop

[buckethead 0]

I recently purchased a used Kalatel DVMRe-16ezt and it goes into a boot loop from which there is no escape. It's running 4.09 software and the drives make a lot more noise than I expected. This is my first dvr and I was used to the quiet operation of Panasonic dvd recorders which are hard drive based.

 

Is this indicative of hard drives which are ready to keel over, or am I overlooking something more basic ?

[rory 0]

Bad Hard Drive maybe, especially if it is making alot of noise.

 

Also, you can check to make sure the HDD is not a 7200rpm, that may cause a problem too, not enough power to push the 7200rpm, which is why they come with 5400rpm drives.

 

Disconect the slave drive, if there are 2 drives, or disconnect one at a time and power back up and see what you get. There should be a master and a slave drive. Maybe it is only 1 drive that is bad. Try a new 7200rpm drive (just 1 drive) and set to master, and see what you get.

 

To do this I would suggest you know something about hardware, HDDs, etc.

 

There is a member here that replaces HDDs in DVMRes often, so maybe he can tune in.

 

Rory

[buckethead 0]

Thanks for the feedback, Rory. This now brings up several questions :

 

1) Can any off the shelf 160 gig hdd be used ? The unit currently has two 160 gig Maxtors.

2) Is special formatting needed ?

3) Is there proprietary software on the hdd ?

4) Will the unit run permanently with only one hdd ?

 

Oh boy, this will be a learning experience ...

[rory 0]

The OS is embedded on chip. If this is a moderately new model then it will have Quickwave and WaveBrowser server files on the HDD. There is a program that can be used to reinstall these to a new HDD.

 

Generally they require 5400rpm drives, due to power restrictions.

 

There is a mod that lets you use 7200rpm drives, but its not easy to get a hold of, depends which region you are located in also, GE USA requires you be factory certified before they sell you the mod, even though its simple to do.

 

First thing to do is see what version the DVMRe is, may show on the boot screen.

 

There is a member on here that has done this many times, I'll PM him regarding it if he doesnt see this post.

 

I was "told" you could probably get away with 1 single 7200rpm drive with the current power supply, but ive never upgraded a DVMRe myself.

 

What country are you located in? And do you know how old the DVR is? May still be under warranty and can just send it back, used or not.

 

Rory

[buckethead 0]

Rory,

 

The version shown during the boot is 4.09. I live in the U.S. and the date stamped on the two Maxtor drives inside is 04NOV2002.

 

From testing last night, here are my observations :

 

1) On the original setup, the front drive is the master and the rear drive is the slave (set to cs enabled).

 

Result : constant rebooting.

 

 

2) Front drive set to master, rear drive disconnected.

 

Result : constant rebooting.

 

 

3) Rear drive set to master, front drive disconnected.

 

Result : "Error : no hard disk found:.

 

 

4) Rear drive set to master, front drive set to slave.

 

Result : "Error : no hard disk found".

 

From all this, it seems that the front drive is faulty and/or corrupted. Also, I downloaded the operators maunual off the web and was wondering, is there a proper shutdown/powerdown procedure ? It seems odd with any hard drive based system to simply pull out the power cord to turn it off.

 

I hate to chew up so much of your time on this, but getting this right the first time will save lots of headaches down the road. Thanks again !

[rory 0]

You can just pull the power, it doesnt use a windows type OS so no file issues. Obviously if it is done excessively over and over for a long period it may damage the HDD, but just what you are doing, nope.

[Jasper 0]

The CS (Cable Select), shouldn’t cause you any problems. On a regular PC the CS just allows the drive to become master or slave depending where it is connected on the IDE cable. If the first drive is set to Master and the second one to CS, then the CS drive automatically becomes the slave drive.

 

Rebooting can be caused by too little power reaching the circuit board or too much. I don’t know where you would measure this. If someone knows the power range that the machine will run at that would be helpful.

[scottj 0]

Score a 4500 RPM drive and set it to Master and give it a try. I have a strong feeling your unit will not support 7200rpm, or UDMA133.

 

 

Scottj

[rory 0]

I think both his drives are shot .. thats a 5400 right

 

Yes they require 5400rpm drives, or a power upgrade kit for the DVMRe. Or you could always try a normal PC power supply, and a 7200rpm drive and see what you get.

 

Make one Master and the other Slave by the way, at least that is how they do the new ones.

 

rory

[blowrabbit 0]

ive got a dvrme600A-16ct that once a day or so it will reboot on its own. i wonder if i have the same problem as you?

[SeanMort 0]

I've had this problem before on the older series GE units. There are three things to check here before going into the hard drive issue. The first thing to check is what version of power pack came with the unit. It is a documented problem with GE on the power packs supplied with the older units. The power pack may seem fine after a few weeks action, but then it seems to have problems delivering the right current supply to the DVMRe. This causes the unit to go into a continuous reboot. The reboot is as a result of the units internal RTOS monitoring the boot-up drive speed and, when it meets criteria, carries on with the boot-up. In this case it never does reach the right speed (because the drive collapses on current demand) and the RTOS keeps rebooting. GE has stated that they will replace these earlier power packs at no charge. You can find this document somewhere on their website. The older power pack is much smaller than the units currently supplied now.

The second reason I remember, although I've never experienced it but it has been "copied" to me by their service personnel, is if there is a non-IP cable plugged into the LAN port. The LAN port apparently senses this and reboots to make sure. I'll have to find the mail sent to me on this and make exactly sure what it says though.

The third thing is a bit more tricky; I've also had the same problem occur to me on older DVMR units (Rev LE motherboard) where the edge connector on the small secondary processor PCB (next to the RAM PCB) seems to make bad contact with the motherboard connector. We solved this problem by very carefully tinning the edge connector on both sides with a soldering iron and then very carefully stripping the solder back with de-solder wick, cleaning it up with an ultrasonic cleaner. This leaves a very fine solder layer on the edge connector and ensured a much better connection with no re-booting. I've only had this happen to me twice though, so it's unlikely.

 

The hard drives; a single 7200RPM drive should work with no problems in these units, and with a newer power pack. Two of these drives would be a problem though. It will work initially, but the current draw on the 5V line will put the 5V regulator on the motherboard under strain and it will overheat causing a problem with the drives. Ideally the drives should be jumper selected as Master/Slave. I've not tried the CS selection, but I'd stick to how the manufacturer sets them up. The new drives will auto-format when all is OK with them and the power requirements are met. From what you describe it sounds to me like the power supply is at fault though. Just a question, every time it reboots does the power pack LED also turn off then on ?

[SeanMort 0]

Here's the link for info on the Power Pack:

 

http://www.geindustrial.com/ge-interlogix/docs/kalatel_tech_nu_60.pdf

[buckethead 0]

Wow, you guys are terrific.

 

Seanmort : As you suggested, the power supply is indeed an N60. I will see if GE will replace it.

 

After hours of sweat, spittle and cursing, I managed to get the unit to boot up (initially with the slave drive disconnected and later connected). The boot process took 20 minutes. I timed it with a stopwatch. At that point, I went into Disk Maintenance and used the Destroy command. From that point on, the unit has worked perfectly.

 

Does the Destroy command do defragmentation as well as video file purging ? Or was this simply a coincidence ?

 

Once again, my humblest thanks to one and all ...

[SeanMort 0]

What normally happens when you swop the master / slave drives around is that the RTOS sees them as potentially new drives and then formats them for use. If there was prior information on the drives it would destroy them in the process. It seems this format process is also done at a low level whereby it also checks the drives for defects (all drives have inherent defects) and marks them against future use just as any standard PC low level format would. The menu commands for Delete and Destroy: well the Delete command would naturally delete the image files, but with the possibility of undeleting them before being overwritten, and the Destroy would permanently erase the information. I'm not sure if it does fragmentation though. Fragmentation to my mind is an old Microsoft OS "thing" whereby files are not always stored in contigious sectors on the disk. Perhaps it is, perhaps it isn't ??

[SeanMort 0]

OK .. meant to say defragmentation.

[rory 0]

i wonder if i can try that with this DSR i still got sitting here

But it just doesnt boot up at all .. maybe needs to just take out the battery too ?

[SeanMort 0]

Is this the same DSR you spoke of some time back ?? What are the symptoms again ?

[rory 0]

doesnt booth with old Drives ... doesnt boot with new drives .... get 3 dots (...) and a noise .. sometimes the noise doesnt appear . .. like when i switched the drive around .. also .. HDD light 1 doesnt come on, or flashes .. i switched them all around still .. plus these are 2 newe 5400 rpm drives .. well i brought it home to mess with 1 of the drives but had alot of renovating going on and just didnt get to it yet .. but will want to mess with it this week sometime ..

 

thanks

rory

[SeanMort 0]

What ver software is it ? Can you direct mail me a screen shot ? Is the noise coming from the buzzer ? Is the BDM jumper block on the front of the motherboard set correctly (can you send me a pic if not sure) ?

[buckethead 0]

Two new questions :

 

1) The manual says that 60 pps can be used. When going through the setup, the highest rate seems to be 30 pps. What gives ?

 

2) Will I be shortening the life of the harddrives if I only run them for say 12 hours a day, ie. power up in the am and power down in the pm ? Will this power cycling save or wear down the drives faster ?

 

Thanks !!

[SeanMort 0]

1. How many cameras are connected ? The pps is divided amongst the amount of cameras you have hooked up.

 

2. I don't see a big problem with switching the DVR off every day, after all the drives are also used in standard PC's on a similar cycle. All drives have a finite lifespan, but the big thing to take care of is the regulation of the power to the DVR, particularly if you want to switch it off every day. Use a decent voltage regulator. Perhaps Rory or other members could advise you here for locally available gear.

[buckethead 0]

Eventually, I will have about four or five cameras connected, but while testing, I had only a single camera hooked up and still couldn't get more than 30pps be it timelapse, event or global. Very strange ...