GE Legend domes & DVMre

[Marrkk 0]

I am upgrading my company's surveillance system and have replaced the panasonic VCR with a DVR. Because we are locked into GE's SecurePerfect access control system and wanting to integrate it with the surveillamce system, I went with the GE DVMre. For the same reason (ease of integration) I decided to go with GE's new Legend PTZ domes (how can they be legends when they just came out??) to replace my ancient Pelco Intercept domes. The three new PTZs arrived last week. I'm now discovering that I will need additional wiring to the PTZ locations, as the Pelco PTZ communication was via the coax. Not a big issue since the previous installer use CATV coax, so it had to be replaced anyway. However, the hook-up to the DVMre is also much more complicated. With the Pelco set-up, the coax simply went to a switch to allow camera selection for the Coaxitron controller, then looped to the VCR. Now, even though I paid $1k for the SecurePerfect camera integration package to allow me to control my cameras from SecurePerfect, I still need a GE keypad (KTD-405 0r KTD-400) to the tune of $400-$700 to program the cameras if I want to preset positions (for movement to an alarm location, for example). Also, the PTZ can't be directly wired to the key pad - I need another device (I believe a KTD-83) to accomplish that task. In addition I believe I need a second intermediary device between the keypad and the DVMre. I'm not certain what that device is for a three camera set-up.

 

Can anyone out ther help me understand the communication (data) set-up of my system? Thr DVMre and Legend installation manuals are of little help - they focus on their individual set-up issues, not interconnection.

 

Also, GE says to use 22 guage UTP (Unshielded Twisted-pair) wire for data, which eliminates CAT 5 or 6, which are 24 and 23 gauge. Any source for this? If I can find it, I'd like to use an outdoor rated cable as I have to bring it across a roof area and would like to avoid the need for conduit. Two twisted pair wire would also allow me to bring the video signal down and I would not have to run coax (the runs are 500-800 feet).

 

Thanks in advance forr any advice/assistance

 

Mark

[SeanMort 0]

Hi Mark & welcome,

 

The first thing to address is the cabling issue; GE makes a range of active and passive UTP devices for transmitting video on CAT cable. For the distance you mentioned I would opt for the active UTP devices in lieu of co-ax. The CAT cable solution would also allow you to use the same cable for a data path to the domes. If the data cable is to be wired in a star configuration you would need the KTD-83 (data distributor), but you can avoid this by wiring the domes in a daisy-chain (multi-drop) configuration if it is possible, with the last domes data line terminated. The data line would then simply be wired straight into the RS-485 data port of the DVMRe. I'm not sure what cable types are available to you locally though (I'm sure other members can advise), but go for a thicker core size (0.5mm) if you can.

Secondly; If you are going to use the WaveReader software supplied with the DVMRe across a LAN link you can control/set the domes via this software across the LAN connection. Expect a bit of latency on the video through the LAN though. The software PTZ control still works great though, and no keyboard is needed in this instance. Otherwise the keyboard is required.

[Marrkk 0]

I would like to do just what you say (use CAT 5 or 5e), but my conversations with a GE tech support personnel led me believe the following:

 

a) The data wiring should be min. 22 awg (CAT 5 is 24 ga., 0.511mm nom. dia,)

 

b) It is not a good idea to run the data signal from more than one camera in a single cable (which contradicts the method they themselves provide for daisy-chaining)

 

c) The dome presets must be programmed via a KTD keyboard (and cannot be set via WaveReader)

 

If the above is all bad info from GE, I would plan to to do the following per your suggestion using a single run of outdoor rated CAT5E (24 awg) or CAT6 (23 awg).

 

1. Start at the first GE dome and connect the CAT 1st pair for the data and the 2nd pair for video.

 

2. Come to the next-in-line camera and tie in to the 3rd pair for video or video/data via coaxitron) using a balun. This will a standard camera in an enclosure, either fixed or on a Pelco PTZ mount.

 

3. Come to the third-in-line camera, another GE dome and daisy-chain the 1st pair for video and tie into the 4th pair for video. Terminate the daisy-chain at the camera.

 

4. Run the CAT5/6 to the DVMre location and tie pairs 2, 3 and 4 into an RS232/coax converter and then from the converter into their respective DVMre BNC coax ports.

 

5. Terminate the 1st pair in a RJ45 (RJ11?) connector and plug into a KTD-83

(the third GE dome comes from different location and cannot be daisy-chained).

 

6. Connect the KTD directly to the DVMre or to a KTD keyboard (if I can't do camera presets from WaveReader).

 

Does this make sense/ will it work?

 

Thanks!

Mark

[Marrkk 0]

If I use a Pelco PTZ mount, I will use my existing coaxitron controller for it initially and tie it into DVMre control later if i want to spend the $ for for the GE to Pelco converter.

 

Again, thanks for the feedback

 

Regards, Mark

[rory 0]

i dont know about the GE UTP gear as never thought about using it (price) .. but check the NVT site out, tons of info. With their gear Cat5 is the better of the 2, but you can also use a multi pair Cat3 cable if you want, just get slightly less distance.

 

http://www.nvt.com

 

Rory

[SeanMort 0]

Hi again Mark,

 

Apologies for the late reply but I've been on a customer site for the past week. In answer your last posting;

 

The data daisy-chain config response is puzzling as RS-485 is designed to be daisy-chained. Only in a star config do you need the data distributor device. You don't have a whole bunch of domes with great distances between them so by all means daisy-chain them if your site/system allows.

 

As for the UTP devices; as Rory said above, check out the NVT gear as it is good. I just thought you may get a good deal out of a bulk purchase on the GE gear (and uniformity if you like that).

 

The WaveReader dome control does allow you to set pre-positions, but I'm not sure it will let you past the passcode feature of the Legend series domes (I've not worked with them yet). Perhaps a new release of WaveReader in the future will ?? Looks like you may need the keyboard. Maybe another member has some experience of the Legend dome and WaveReader ??

 

 

Regards

 

Sean

[Marrkk 0]

2 of my domes will be daisy-chained because they are nearly inline to my DVMre (furthest one at about 730 feet). The other one comes from a different direction thus the need for a KTD-83. I just got one on Ebay for $43.00, I'm keeping my finger crossed on that (it's worth the risk at that amount). Gem electronics has an amplified transceiver that will connect 4 cameras, and it's about $100/ vs. $250 x 2 for two GE single camera transceivers (p/n KTS-271).

 

Thanks for the input.

 

Regards, Mark