Residential Axis IP Camera Installation

[CamB 0]

Been doing some research on a home outdoor video surveillance system to keep an eye on my house when I'm away. I use exclusively Apple products so the hardware software to view remotely must be compatible with and optimized for iphone, ipad, and macs. My experience in trying to find a turnkey solution as been disappointing...and I do live in a major metropolitan area.

 

Here's why the experience has been disappointing:

- Installers all seem to have their own preferred brand of camera, nvr, and technology. Usually they are names like ICRealTime, 3S, etc. that don't seem to have the best reviews from my online research. Some even want to push me to analog vs. IP. Some also tell me that using Axis cameras would

- Pricing is all over the board for 4 1.3MP Dome IP Cameras, NVR, POE Switch, Conduit, Cable, Labor ($3,000-$15,000)

- Some tell me to just provide my own server...but I don't want to be responsible for buying, setting up and maintaining a server to be used for NVR. If something isn't working, it'll be a nightmare

 

My research has surfaced Axis as the best name for quality of camera, warranty, and customer service. I don't need the Ferrari of IP cameras, but I do want something that is reliable and that a manufacturer will stand behind if something were to go wrong. I am open to alternatives...

 

Now to my questions:

- How do I go about identifying a reputable installer?

- How do I know if the bids are fair? How much should a 4 outdoor IP camera system cost?

- Should I just buy the equipment myself and hire an installer? If so, so much should installation and setup cost?

[vector18 1]

Where do you live?

[CamB 0]

SF Bay Area

[markshaw 0]

I actually bought my cctv wireless audio camera online. There are cameras available that are actually easy to install by yourself, the DIY ones that are actually not expensive but are easy to install. The quotations you mentioned are a bit steep in my opinion. You can get 4 cameras for less than $200.

[buellwinkle 0]

Here's the problem with Axis, they make nice cameras but not really one that makes cameras with built in IR LEDs. They do have one outdoor model, the P3364-LVE that does, but it's only 1MP (720P) and I like at least 1080P or 3MP outdoors. So you say, why not just run Axis external IR illuminators, brilliant, until you find out they cost more than the already expensive camera. We are looking at one that's $1,300 for one illuminator, just for the part, not installing it. But you may be able to get away with cheaper Axis illuminators in the $800 range. But lets go with just the one model that has built in IR LEDs. Then they don't make NVR's, you don't want a PC with software, so figure you'll need a third party standalone NVR, hard drives and setup. I can tell you for something like that, figure between 2,500 and 3,000 per camera installed and about the same for the NVR, so $12,500 to 15,000 is normal but I'm sure you'll get bids for a lot more too. Bids much below that may be from low ballers trying to do somethings that's above their heads.

 

The real problem will be finding an NVR that works well via a Mac. Yes, all the cool kids have Macs and I've had a Mac since the early Mac SE's so I know how wonderful Macs can be and that's why I run Windows on my Mac so I can connect to my cameras and NVR software. I have yet to find one that's compatible with my Mac that I like. Sorry, it is what it is. Sure, you can connect to Axis cameras directly from a Mac, but the not the NVR, not the recordings. So let us know how that works out for you, always interested in keeping my Mac happy, although Windows runs really well using VMWare Fusion and I have an IE icon on my task bar and sure, the first time it takes a minute or two to come up, after that it's pretty quick.

 

As for iPads, iPhones, tons of apps out there to watch your cameras from your phone or tablet. That's the least of your worries. The Axis apps are not written or maintained by Axis and are expensive and have very poor ratings and have no access to recording or any advantage over any other app on iTunes, so shop that like any app, view the customer reviews, load the free version and try it if you can. I would not pay more than $5 for an app. I use IP Cam Viewer on my Android tablet and phone and it's awesome. On my iPhone and iPad I don't use any such apps, screen is too small on iPhone and my old 10" iPad's too big to haul around these days for what it does so I take my Macbook Air instead or my Android Nexus tablet. While I always liked Macs, not an iPhone fan, only have it because my company gave it to me.

 

The real way to save money and I can't tell you to do it yourself if you are afraid but find a licensed electrician to run all the Ethernet cables, mount the cameras and do all the heavy lifting. This may set you back a full day of labor, $50-60/hr, $400-500. Worst case, you have a complex house to wire, so double that, $800-1,000. My electrician does stuff like this all the time, even for schools and businesses. He has no clue how to configure or aim anything, just installs.

 

Then figure how to aim the cameras and configure them. It's not rocket science and you have the entire network camera braintrust here for assistance. Doing it yourself teaches you all you need to know about the cameras, so if something goes wrong, you know how to fix it. Also, for what it's worth, even if you have all the cameras installed by an electrician and then call in a surveillance camera tech, how much can he possibly charge to aim and setup the cameras and an NVR, say one day, $100/hr, $800. So you see, with $5,000 worth of cameras and NVR maybe $1,500 worth of labor and you saved half on your project.

 

And trust me, we hired top surveillance camera companies and the quality of work was embarrassing. Finding someone that truly knows what they are doing is going to take you more effort than learning it yourself. We had one guy spend an entire month setting up 7 cameras, every day, 8 hours for one month. After that time, I took a peek and none of the date/time was set, none of the cameras names were specified, none of the cameras had motion detect zones set, the router was not configured correctly, the cameras weren't focused properly, the aiming was terrible and nothing was recording. I had to go in and spend a day and do it myself. In contrast I had one guy install 4 cameras, same brand, Mobotix, in one day and was done, with just some minor tweaks I had to do myself. Too bad I can't find him anymore.

[tome9999 0]

The real problem will be finding an NVR that works well via a Mac. Yes, all the cool kids have Macs and I've had a Mac since the early Mac SE's so I know how wonderful Macs can be and that's why I run Windows on my Mac so I can connect to my cameras and NVR software. I have yet to find one that's compatible with my Mac that I like. Sorry, it is what it is. Sure, you can connect to Axis cameras directly from a Mac, but the not the NVR, not the recordings. So let us know how that works out for you, always interested in keeping my Mac happy, although Windows runs really well using VMWare Fusion and I have an IE icon on my task bar and sure, the first time it takes a minute or two to come up, after that it's pretty quick.

 

Running Windows as an application on MacOS (unix) is as god intended. I would add that Parallels (Desktop 8 ) works great as well. My MacBook Pro has a fast SSD. I usually just suspend Windows (version 7 currently) so it wakes in about 3 seconds. But even booting Windows in Parallels from a full stop is 17 seconds. I would rather the NVR software was native on Mac/unix but you use the tools you have. The apps I do run on Windows, mostly CAD/CAM, work great, performance is outstanding on this hardware.

 

There is also Oracle's VirtualBox which is free. I have used it in the past with success but I can't vouch for it working for any of the NVR apps.

[Hitch 0]

Cam - As you noted in the other thread, I was in a somewhat similar situation as you several months ago. We had some issues in our neighborhood (including the house across the street being robbed while the owners were asleep), so I decided to purchase some cameras. I did some research, narrowed down to a few manufacturers and came here for some help. I ended up choosing Axis. Several things, including the thoughts and comments from here, went into that decision.

 

One was the experience of my parents. They decided to install security cameras at their place. Their experience was not very good - largely because of the installer. I'm certainly not going to claim that all are bad. They just got a bad one. As you, I had trouble trying to find someone to do it for me. Also, hiring someone brings additional cost. That's fair, but I needed to watch the money as my wife is not much of a spender. So, I decided that I would install them myself.

 

Equipment - Fortunately, I already own a windows based home theatre pc. Other than that, I have all Mac computers. I also own a Synology, which is a small desktop server. The one that I have holds 4 drives (which you buy separately). The Synology is set up in a RAID format. I use it to store our family photos, videos, etc. I use the Synology as the storage location for recorded video for both of my cameras. With the exception of one issue, it works great. I have plenty of space on the Synology for all of this stuff. The one issue that I am having is that older recordings are not being deleted. I've seen some posts on Axis' forum about other people having the same issue. Frankly, I really haven't spent much time looking into it.

 

I am not sure how much the NVR's that you are looking at cost. However, it might be easier to "stomach" buying a Synology which will give you many other options than just a storage location for security cam video. Synology also has a software app called Surveillance Station. I didn't go that route, as Synology charges a license fee per camera (after the first). I just use the Synology to store the data.

 

As far as installation, if you are fairly handy, you can do it yourself after some research. I mounted my cameras under the eve of my house. It took me a while to figure out how to remove the soffit without damaging it. From there, I cut a hole in the soffit (noting where the roofing beams came into that area). I then installed some wood in between the roofing beams - to mount the camera to. After installing the camera mounts and the camera, I ran the networking cable through the attic and down into the room where I installed the PoE switch. Each camera took me around 6 hours to install and run the networking cable. This includes many, many, many trips up and down the ladder. My legs were sore....

 

I did have some issues with getting the first camera setup for internet access. Long story short, I never added the address for the router into the software. I have some previous experience with port forwarding (just around the house), so that helped. There are websites that will tell you how to do port forwarding - even for your specific router. If you go this route, I am certainly willing to do what I can to lead you through the entries that you need to make in the Axis software.

 

I did use the Axis software to get the cameras set up. Since then, however, I log into the cameras just using Safari or Chrome on my Mac. It's the same interface that the Axis software takes you to on a PC. Heck, I can use Safari on my iPad to access the "Settings" option on the cameras.

 

On my iPhone and iPad, I use IP Camera Lite. I just downloaded it a week or two ago. Before that, I would just access the cams via safari. I have no complaints with IP Camera Lite. It is basic - but it does what I want it to do, which is let me see what my cameras see.

 

If I found a good installer, I would have a cleaner install (I had to add some expanding foam between the edge of the camera body and the soffitt - to keep bugs out). Also, the cameras would quite likely be "tuned" better. I really didn't mess with the factory settings much. I very much like the fact that the Axis cameras are well made and have strong support. I like that they include a heater and a fan. They are well made.

 

As far as a PC, you could buy a cheap one from Dell, Costco, BJ's, etc. Since the Axis cameras do the "heavy hitting" internally, with regards to things like motion sensing, you don't need a powerful PC. Or maybe you can borrow a friend's for the install?

 

So, obviously, you can add me to the camp that would suggest you do the install yourself. Obviously, certain things worked out for me - already having the Synology, the HTPC, having access to an attic to run wire, etc.

[Hitch 0]

One other thing that I should have mentioned is lighting. As of now, I have one camera in the front of the house and one in the back. In the back of the house, I removed two regular light fixtures and replaced them with motion sensing lights (maybe halogens). I bought them from Home Depot - they weren't very expensive. From a security point of view, I wanted lights back there but I didn't want them on all of the time. The Axis camera certainly looks better in color, in the light of day, but I can still see what is going on out there with no lighting. Also, if the motion sensing lights turn on, it's plenty of light to see well through the camera.

 

In the front of my house, I always leave on two 60 watt equivalent bulbs. There are two more, near the garage, that I often leave on during weekend nights as well. Again, they provide enough light in the front of my house.

 

I am not running any external IR illuminators. Would it be better if I did? Sure. However, I am happy with what I have. Obviously, it is a subjective thing. The two cameras that I am running are P3364-VE's. Doing the install yourself also allows you to spend your money over time. I bought the first two cameras over the first several months of this year. I am to the point where I am considering buying the third. I will likely end up with 4 (or 5, if I decide to put one in the garage).

[DaveMedlin 0]

As far as installation, if you are fairly handy, you can do it yourself after some research. I mounted my cameras under the eve of my house. It took me a while to figure out how to remove the soffit without damaging it. From there, I cut a hole in the soffit (noting where the roofing beams came into that area). I then installed some wood in between the roofing beams - to mount the camera to. After installing the camera mounts and the camera, I ran the networking cable through the attic and down into the room where I installed the PoE switch. Each camera took me around 6 hours to install and run the networking cable. This includes many, many, many trips up and down the ladder. My legs were sore....

 

That's where I am now, looking for tips on how to remove vinyl soffit without damaging it. Any hints??

 

Dave