Decent IP Cameras Under $250 each?

[jdoggg1 0]

I'm trying to build a 5 camera setup using blueiris and one of my PCs. I'm trying to stay at/around $1000 for the cameras alone. 3 outdoor and 2 indoor cameras. I've been eying the Acti TCM-1111, but I only see them at $275+. I want decent outdoor visibility up to about 30'; indoor I don't care terribly much about night quality.

 

I know "you gotta spend more to get good stuff" is the general sentiment, but I'm struggling to make this work at $1000. I've been burgled twice since February... never move to vallejo CA.

[buellwinkle 0]

The D31 is sort of the TCM-1111 replacement, is in your budget. Just above your budget, and maybe mixing cameras to achieve various goals may work best is the D32 which is 3MP and works quite well and slightly above budget. Indoors, the D54 IR dome should work well, should be under $250. Trick with ACTi is to find an authorized dealer and most on the net like B&H are not. If you need help, PM me.

[MaxIcon 0]

The Dahua IPC-HFW3200S is a nice compact outdoor bullet camera for under $250, assuming you can find someone selling them in the US. It's got flaws, but the daytime image is pretty good for the money, with a bit of softness.

 

Likewise, the Lorex (Hikvision) 1080p 2-pack is a decent camera for a decent price, if you don't mind spending under your budget. I haven't tested one, but the reviews here have been pretty good.

 

You'll get better software and better customer support, in general, with the more expensive cameras.

[buellwinkle 0]

I haven't seen the Swann/Lorex bullets anymore on Costco.com. I would avoid the Lorex/Hikvision mini dome for now, it's got issues and Hikvision is working on them.

[MaxIcon 0]

What are the issues with the Hik domes? I'm trying to pull the trigger on a couple of inexpensive 1080p cams for the front of the house, and am considering domes for appearance. These sounded OK so far, but it's hard to keep track.

 

Too bad Dahua can't get their act together on distributors and support. It's gone from bad to worse recently. I'd be tempted by the 1080p mini bullet if I could find somewhere to buy them.

[PaulfromCT 0]

What are the issues with the Hik domes? I'm trying to pull the trigger on a couple of inexpensive 1080p cams for the front of the house, and am considering domes for appearance. These sounded OK so far, but it's hard to keep track.

 

Too bad Dahua can't get their act together on distributors and support. It's gone from bad to worse recently. I'd be tempted by the 1080p mini bullet if I could find somewhere to buy them.

 

There is a difference between the dome and mini dome. I had the mini dome and I had issues with low light/dark (no ir) and the daytime was so-so. I had the Q-see branded (Dahua) mini dome. I currently have the Lorex Domes (with IR) on the outside of my house (which i believe is a rebranded Hikvision). They work incredibly well for the money $350/pair, look better than the bullets and are more resistant to vandalism. From the experts on this board Acti would be a step up (in price and quality).

Edited June 13, 2013 by Guest

[buellwinkle 0]

What are the issues with the Hik domes? I'm trying to pull the trigger on a couple of inexpensive 1080p cams for the front of the house, and am considering domes for appearance. These sounded OK so far, but it's hard to keep track.

 

The Hikvision mini bullet is awesome, using one soon to replace a Dahua which honestly, after having them for a while, they are not all that good, not side by side with other cameras like the Hikvision. The mini domes are not ready yet but their engineering is working on it, so hold off on those. Also, they are 2 axis, but they sell wall mounts and tilt mounts to help. Honestly, by the time I put a wall mount or tilt mount, the aesthetics of the dome vs. bullet go out the window. The bullets are so tiny.

 

I will leave you with this thought. This is a Dahua hfw-2100 image during the day looking out the window of my lake house (soon to be replaced with Hikvision, so if you want to buy it, let me know)

 

 

This is the same shot, different window with an indoor AVTech AVN812. You can see the greater detail, the much better color accuracy, the detail in the texture of the water and trees. I would say the Hikvision mini bullet or ACTi E32 is comparable to the AVTech in this regard but at 3MP.

 

[MaxIcon 0]

My problem with the Hik mini-bullet is the horizontal line noise in low light at 1/30 sec; aside from that, it's quite good. I have the 2100 watching my driveway now, and it's pretty good at night for 720p, but I'm looking to bump up to 1080p up front.

 

One post indicated the Hik mini-dome was better in low light than the Hik mini-bullet - the bullet showed the horizontal lines, while the dome looked cleaner, but it wasn't clear if the settings were the same (you'd expect them to have the same sensor and firmware). The price is right on these, as well - I can't bump up to a pair of $300 and up cameras right now.

 

The Dahua 3200S looks like a good compromise, but I haven't test one yet. Decent low light performance and small size, and I can live with the softness problem better than noisy low light. If I could only buy a couple for a reasonable price and get some software support with them...

[JoeyJoey 0]

I will be receiving the Lorex branded Hikvision domes this week to add to my system. I will then be able to compare the qualities of both.

 

If the dome works well and not too much IR reflective glare back, I'm going to order a Hikvision branded one with a 12 mm lens.

[jdoggg1 0]

Forgive my ignorance, but at the several hundred+ dollar mark, isn't it starting to approch the point where it's worth looking into frankensteining a piont-n-shoot digital camera (like a canon) into the network?

[cheetokhan 0]

I haven't seen the Swann/Lorex bullets anymore on Costco.com.

 

Costco.com had them on the site last Friday. I got a pair of the Lorex Full HD 1080p PoE Indoor/Outdoor Night Vision cameras, Item #767194, but the bullets were available too. They sell out really fast.

[Kawboy12R 0]

Forgive my ignorance, but at the several hundred+ dollar mark, isn't it starting to approch the point where it's worth looking into frankensteining a piont-n-shoot digital camera (like a canon) into the network?

 

For outdoor use?? Might be an option inside using software that'll monitor what would essentially be a webcam. Not a bad option to have inside that'll blend in if you can just sit it on a shelf with a bunch of other stuff.

[jdoggg1 0]

Forgive my ignorance, but at the several hundred+ dollar mark, isn't it starting to approch the point where it's worth looking into frankensteining a piont-n-shoot digital camera (like a canon) into the network?

 

For outdoor use?? Might be an option inside using software that'll monitor what would essentially be a webcam. Not a bad option to have inside that'll blend in if you can just sit it on a shelf with a bunch of other stuff.

Something like a GoPro for outside maybe? Their picture quality trumps all but the most expensive security cameras

[buellwinkle 0]

What was interesting on the news last night is they were showing someone's car cam that a thief broke into. Is that they next step, surveillance cams for your car? So I looked in the worlds marketplace, alibaba and there's a company that makes a rear view mirror with a 1080P cam looking out the front that records when you drive with a monitor built into the mirror and a rear camera to capture if someone rear ends you. Wholesale was about $80 and you have DVR and two 1080P cameras. Imagine trying to do that with gopro, heck, the SD cards may cost more than $80.

[MaxIcon 0]

Forgive my ignorance, but at the several hundred+ dollar mark, isn't it starting to approch the point where it's worth looking into frankensteining a piont-n-shoot digital camera (like a canon) into the network?

 

For outdoor use?? Might be an option inside using software that'll monitor what would essentially be a webcam. Not a bad option to have inside that'll blend in if you can just sit it on a shelf with a bunch of other stuff.

Something like a GoPro for outside maybe? Their picture quality trumps all but the most expensive security cameras

 

GoPro doesn't have an IR cut filter, do they? I saw a lens post with pink video because they used a lens without an integral IR filter.

 

So, there are a lot of reasons people don't use standard videocams for surveillance, but the main ones are that they're not network enabled and they don't have all the software features people want in surveillance cams.

 

It's an easy test. Get an inexpensive GoPro or whatever, and set it up to monitor your back yard for a week. Be sure to post your experiences!

[MaxIcon 0]

What was interesting on the news last night is they were showing someone's car cam that a thief broke into. Is that they next step, surveillance cams for your car? So I looked in the worlds marketplace, alibaba and there's a company that makes a rear view mirror with a 1080P cam looking out the front that records when you drive with a monitor built into the mirror and a rear camera to capture if someone rear ends you. Wholesale was about $80 and you have DVR and two 1080P cameras. Imagine trying to do that with gopro, heck, the SD cards may cost more than $80.

 

After someone dinged one of my cars in a parking lot, I started thinking about that. Dashcams are very popular in eastern Europe, as you can see in a youtube search, and they can be very useful.

 

Many of the ones you can buy in the US have lifetime problems due to heat, according to reports. What you'd really need is a set of 4 180 degree cams, watching all 4 sides of your car, with motion sensors (physical motion, not visual), and pre-frame buffers. They'd have to have low enough power draw to prevent running down your battery.

 

My prediction is that we'll have little 360 degree dome cams available to be mounted on or built into the roofs of cars in 5-10 years.

[buellwinkle 0]

Like this one?

 

[dexterash 0]

What are the issues with the Hik domes? I'm trying to pull the trigger on a couple of inexpensive 1080p cams for the front of the house, and am considering domes for appearance. These sounded OK so far, but it's hard to keep track.

 

The Hikvision mini bullet is awesome, using one soon to replace a Dahua which honestly, after having them for a while, they are not all that good, not side by side with other cameras like the Hikvision. The mini domes are not ready yet but their engineering is working on it, so hold off on those. Also, they are 2 axis, but they sell wall mounts and tilt mounts to help. Honestly, by the time I put a wall mount or tilt mount, the aesthetics of the dome vs. bullet go out the window. The bullets are so tiny.

 

I will leave you with this thought. This is a Dahua hfw-2100 image during the day looking out the window of my lake house (soon to be replaced with Hikvision, so if you want to buy it, let me know)

 

 

This is the same shot, different window with an indoor AVTech AVN812. You can see the greater detail, the much better color accuracy, the detail in the texture of the water and trees. I would say the Hikvision mini bullet or ACTi E32 is comparable to the AVTech in this regard but at 3MP.

 

 

Small glitch: you are using different angles, thus the AWB it's not the same (along with a different skyview).

 

Also, do you use them behind a window? Is that a double/tinted window?

[blake 0]

My supplier is shipping me the AVN813 so i'm gonna put it thru the test to see if i like it..

[MaxIcon 0]

Like this one?

 

 

Lol! Hoping for a bit more compact, and something that won't break off at the drive-through! I wonder how much those street view rigs cost? It would be interesting to see their specs!

[MaxIcon 0]

I hadn't looked closely at those comparisons, but the Dahua 2100 shows the same softness that the 2 and 3 MP cams have. Looking at the trees just right of center, the branches are just blobs of green, while stuff that's further away has much better sharpness.

 

I hadn't noticed this on my 2100, because it's looking at a driveway, and doesn't have the textures to show that softness, but it's a big problem on my 3300C.

 

This is one of the main Dahua image drawbacks, in my opinion. I keep hoping they'll fix it with a firmware update, but since they never list what's in their firmware updates, there's no telling.

 

Maybe it's time to bump up to a better class of camera. I was hoping not to have to pay $700 for a matched pair of cams, though.

[shockwave199 0]

I think you have to keep things in perspective too. Take a look at some analog footage for an eye adjustment. Buy as good as you can afford. I think too often we get caught up in just picture quality. I save that for when I'm picking a still camera for the holidays. A 1.3 or 2mp dahua has about as good a chance at solving a crime as a 5mp axis. It's how the cameras are implemented for every zone you're covering. THAT is the challenge. Not how well leaves look on tress, but rather, how well is your zone lighted for your camera choice in the darkness of 3AM. How well the camera is aimed and framed. When some putz is trying to pry up your garage door, take advantage of an open car door, or jiggling the front door knob, how well will the camera do THEN? You want to know how well your choices are working- be the criminal in front of your cameras in the dark of night. That's when you see what the deal is. And THAT's the footage that can impress and convince others. Still shots of absolutely nothing happening for the sake of picture clarity doesn't really help the cause. And yet, we spend all kinds of money on a hope that the camera will be okay. It actually amazes me with surveillance, that we are forced to choose our weapons of choice for something as critical as crime solving, almost sight UNSEEN for our particular applications. And we pay dearly for the wrong choices.

 

Meh- I have a head cold. Sorry I'm ranting.

 

[Firefighter 0]

I've been burgled twice since February... never move to vallejo CA.

 

 

 

JK guys.... lol

 

Seriously the Hikvisions appear to be the best value option right now for that price range.

 

Canon dslrs and other cameras like the go pro aren't used for surveillance for a reason. Long term reliability.

Their built for a couple of minutes of great quality videos, repeated over and over.

A solid 24/7 recording I wouldn't expect the cameras to be able to handle this for long term.

Not to mention their not built for that.... The engineers were not thinking about using them in that manner, which is why their not sold/marketed in that manner.

 

Worth a shot though, Would love to see someone try it and report back.

[Agentchuckles 0]

For those curious...I've had a cheap pocket style 720p camcorder hooked up by a long usb cord and staring out my kitchen window for 1.5 years now. I use it with freeware contacam for motion detection. I've caught the neighbours daughters' boyfriend stealing parts off my truck when i was out with the wife and kids one afternoon. The cop was impressed with the quality of the video (only vga 640x480 but digital) and he even showed his fellow officers back at the station. He kept asking me if it was cheap to set something like that up. Said that camera quality blew away the police station cameras. I guess he's never seen megapixel camera footage lol.

 

Planning on getting an Acti setup this summer with infrared illuminators. Special thanks to Buellwinkle for his reviews..very helpful.

[MaxIcon 0]

I think you have to keep things in perspective too. Take a look at some analog footage for an eye adjustment. Buy as good as you can afford. I think too often we get caught up in just picture quality. I save that for when I'm picking a still camera for the holidays. A 1.3 or 2mp dahua has about as good a chance at solving a crime as a 5mp axis. It's how the cameras are implemented for every zone you're covering. THAT is the challenge. Not how well leaves look on tress, but rather, how well is your zone lighted for your camera choice in the darkness of 3AM. How well the camera is aimed and framed. When some putz is trying to pry up your garage door, take advantage of an open car door, or jiggling the front door knob, how well will the camera do THEN? You want to know how well your choices are working- be the criminal in front of your cameras in the dark of night. That's when you see what the deal is. And THAT's the footage that can impress and convince others. Still shots of absolutely nothing happening for the sake of picture clarity doesn't really help the cause. And yet, we spend all kinds of money on a hope that the camera will be okay. It actually amazes me with surveillance, that we are forced to choose our weapons of choice for something as critical as crime solving, almost sight UNSEEN for our particular applications. And we pay dearly for the wrong choices.

 

Yes, it's definitely the end result that matters. I ran analog cams for years, and that's why I've replaced them all with IP cams.

 

Here's an example that's not just leaves on trees, but shows the basic issue with Dahua's softness in shadows. It's a bright afternoon; plenty of light - this shouldn't be a challenging situation.

 

Each of these is around 25' away from the camera, which is set for 3MP and 8192 kb/s, with the lens pulled back to 3.3mm. I've used Blue Iris to zoom in on the appropriate portion of the image; zoom didn't change on either capture.

 

In the well lit part of the yard:

 

And in the shade, just a few feet to the side:

 

This is why I consider Dahua's softness to be a problem.