Why would anyone go with an analog camera system these days?

[shockwave199 0]

Especially with google available these days, I don't see the excuse not to own one unless you already own an analog system and are waiting for the rate of return on your analog system before purchasing digital.

If you're installing your first system then yes, IP is the way to go. But when you have an analog system in place already and you're getting great results, it's a bit tougher to make the switch. Such as a new second and large investment, running all new cables, etc. I even have a ptz in line that I don't want to give up, so there's that to consider as well. I'll probably keep my dvr in line just for the ptz and bring in that channel to an nvr when I get that in place. Or, I'll just go HD-SDI and not worry about the cable runs. But I grapple with this all the time because I look at my analog cameras and it looks great and in my key spots, I get ID. So the thought becomes- why go through the expense and labor of reinstalling when I'm doing just fine?

 

So for a first time install of course, go IP. Why people don't is largely cost and ignorance, I figure. An 8 channel NRV system will still cost you- it's no impulse buy. But then ignorance kicks in they figure analog is good enough- which it CAN be if you get it right. But there's a whole grey area for people switching from analog. It really depends.

[luckyfella 0]

I just ripped out an analog system in a warehouse in NJ. The cameras were all effio 700 TVL eyeball cameras well focused and placed. He had an 8 channel DVR and a 4 channel DVR for 12 cameras. They were both speco dvr's. The reason he upgraded was because I did his house in NY with IP and he was

absolutely amazed. The guy had the money to upgrade to IP even though he had a perfectly fine analog system. I guess lucky for me, cause that

meant two IP jobs within 2 weeks, lol.

[mkkoskin 0]

I just ripped out an analog system in a warehouse in NJ. The cameras were all effio 700 TVL eyeball cameras well focused and placed. He had an 8 channel DVR and a 4 channel DVR for 12 cameras. They were both speco dvr's. The reason he upgraded was because I did his house in NY with IP and he was

absolutely amazed. The guy had the money to upgrade to IP even though he had a perfectly fine analog system. I guess lucky for me, cause that

meant two IP jobs within 2 weeks, lol.

 

What a lucky fella

[luckyfella 0]

I just ripped out an analog system in a warehouse in NJ. The cameras were all effio 700 TVL eyeball cameras well focused and placed. He had an 8 channel DVR and a 4 channel DVR for 12 cameras. They were both speco dvr's. The reason he upgraded was because I did his house in NY with IP and he was

absolutely amazed. The guy had the money to upgrade to IP even though he had a perfectly fine analog system. I guess lucky for me, cause that

meant two IP jobs within 2 weeks, lol.

 

What a lucky fella

 

 

Funny

[CraigVM62 0]

I think it is safe to say that if the demands on the system can be met with analog and budget will not allow for IP cameras, then analog is a solution.

 

I had an installation for a Storage Facility that needed to capture people entering hallways with the cameras no more than 10' from each hallway door. Total of 32 cameras with several 500' from camera to DVR location via conduit and small junction boxes. With their specific budget, IP Cams and a NVR was simply not an option.

 

Analog was enough to meet their needs as it easily provided a prosecutable image. IP would have met their needs even better, but should I have told them to only call me when their budget could be increased to go with an IP system ?

 

My answer to the question / title of the thread is "when analog will fit the customers needs and meets a limited budget"

[mattaggie 0]

I am very new to the CCTV world. I started researching about a year ago in order to install a system into the retail store I work at. I chose to go with analogue because I was able to understand how the system fit together (camera wired to a DVR card in a PC). My impression was that IP was A.) too expensive and B.) required knowledge of networking. I bought the $1000 16 channel DVR card from Geovision and 8 nice Bosch cameras. Installed the cameras, everything works fine, nice picture. Then I hooked up the $200 2MP IP Camera that Geovision throws in with the DVR card. WOW! WHAT A PICTURE! I could have bought 5 of these cameras for the price of the DVR card.

 

I think a previous commenter hit the nail on the head when he said that people chose analogue because they don't understand and are intimidated by IP. That was definitely me. Now that I have a basic understanding of how IP cameras work, I would never recommend analogue. It is a lot of trouble to install any CCTV system and the system is usually left in place for many years. If you "cant afford" IP now, save up for it! I'd rather have a great IP system in a year, than an analogue system today. Analogue isn't "bad" and its not that it cant accomplish the task, but if you are going to the trouble to hang a camera and run wire, why not get the best result?

[Kawboy12R 0]

Then I hooked up the $200 2MP IP Camera that Geovision throws in with the DVR card. WOW! WHAT A PICTURE! I could have bought 5 of these cameras for the price of the DVR card.

 

Bingo! After you leave the extreme low-budget sector, the economics in the middle of the range seem to work better for IP in many ways.

[RVT 0]

I had an installation for a Storage Facility that needed to capture people entering hallways with the cameras no more than 10' from each hallway door. Total of 32 cameras with several 500' from camera to DVR location via conduit and small junction boxes. With their specific budget, IP Cams and a NVR was simply not an option.

 

Self storage owners are notoriously cheap. Although I did visit one site in Venice Beach CA that had a *huge* IP system, but they were storing multi-million dollar boats and RVs.

[shockwave199 0]

The thing is though, the landscape of IP/MP is changing more rapidly now too it seems. It's not unreasonable to think that 5mp cameras and NVR's to support them well is close at hand. Even 10mp cameras. And I'm talking about this product showing up at costco in the budget market. I know it's already available in the higher end market. I invested in analog three years ago before anything budget wise was around for MP systems. Then, out came 2mp systems. Now there are 3mp cameras widely available and NVR boxes are getting more throughput to support better handling of higher res cameras up to 5mp. The megapixel push is on and I'm quite sure it will be a race to have the next higher res, more capable system- just in time for you to finish installing your quickly outdated system. It's a common tale in many respects, not just this. I know you have to jump into the pool somewhere. My plan was to wait out MP technology and enjoy my analog system, which I have, and it is serving me very well. But I get gear lust and of course I'd love to make the change. But each 12 months has shown that my patience is worth it. More capable systems at affordable prices keep springing up now. At this time, I think I'm gonna hang in till 5mp cameras and NVR's to handle them is here at the budget level. 2mp is quickly becoming the 400tvl of analog, so to speak. It won't be long before it'll be hard to find 2mp cameras, as they won't be preferred. My guess, anyway.

 

The only other thing to consider is if you need audio recording, add a good deal more to your budget, especially if you need multiple locations. Unlike analog, you'll need audio cameras for audio/video recording and that will cost you. If you just need audio live monitoring, different story and not as complicated or costly.

[kmax1940 0]

The reason we are still using analog is... bandwidth.

Our customers typically have:

 

* Roughly 1Mbps upload or less.

* 16 Cameras.

* Need at least 15 web based viewers at any given time.

 

If anyone knows how to stream 16 ip cameras over 1Mbps to at least 15 viewers please let me know!

 

I will gladly change to IP immediately.

[luckyfella 0]

The reason we are still using analog is... bandwidth.

Our customers typically have:

 

* Roughly 1Mbps upload or less.

* 16 Cameras.

* Need at least 15 web based viewers at any given time.

 

If anyone knows how to stream 16 ip cameras over 1Mbps to at least 15 viewers please let me know!

 

I will gladly change to IP immediately.

 

 

If your customer had better upload, would you use IP?

[kmax1940 0]

Yes. No problem.

 

But our average client has less than 2 Mbps... and I dont see that changing for a long time.

[luckyfella 0]

So, if the customer had high upload, you would install IP rather than analog, right? So, I wouldn't say to put you on the

list of those that prefer analog óver' IP. I think this topic is more about if the scenario allowed for IP, why would anyone

chose analog rather than IP.

[tomcctv 190]

The reason we are still using analog is... bandwidth.

Our customers typically have:

 

* Roughly 1Mbps upload or less.

* 16 Cameras.

* Need at least 15 web based viewers at any given time.

 

If anyone knows how to stream 16 ip cameras over 1Mbps to at least 15 viewers please let me know!

 

I will gladly change to IP immediately.

 

 

If your customer had better upload, would you use IP?

 

 

The reason we are still using analog is... bandwidth.

Our customers typically have:

 

* Roughly 1Mbps upload or less.

* 16 Cameras.

* Need at least 15 web based viewers at any given time.

 

If anyone knows how to stream 16 ip cameras over 1Mbps to at least 15 viewers please let me know!

 

I will gladly change to IP immediately.

 

 

If your customer had better upload, would you use IP?

 

 

why would upload speed be a problem. ???

[luckyfella 0]

Um, for remote viewing...

[Chromo 0]

Many reasons!

No knowlegde of any of the systems!

No money for HighEnd equipment

Fast easy to set up, not weeks to figure out

Not Tech savey to figure it out very fast

other reason also!

 

For me I need something fast and cheap! It's not a matter of waiting till I have the money to do it right, I need to catch the thieves NOW! Not in 4 weeks when I moght have a Ip system figured out part way!

 

I had a property busted into and for about 5 days the thieves lived there and were in and out stealing a bit at a time. They stole gas out of many of my vehicles and it just so happened they hit both tanks on a PU truck that was parked about 5years and had some really nasty rank gas and luckily they ruined their car! I just happened to pull in over there that day while they were trying to get their car running again and caught them red handed and had them arrested.

Our lousy legal system let them out while waiting for court dates, which got post postponed once already! One of them came back and busted out a van side window.

Caught them about 1 month ago and 1.5 weeks ago the window got busted out.

 

Being most the vehicles are within about 20-25 feet of the buildings I think a 700TVL camera would have caught them on video well enough to prosecute. During the 5days they shacked up there it would be nice to know what all they were stealing and when also.

I keep finding more things missing all the time, and remember now and then this should have been here but is not, that was there but not now, etc...

 

probably any 480-700TVL would had shown a bicycle being carried out of my shop, I did not even know it was missing till the wife asked me where it was, NOW I have put that on the report also as stolen.

 

They got the key box with my vehicle keys, now I am worried they may try to steal a car and haul in for scrap iron, a 700TVL would probable identify them hooking up a car to drag it off if camera located in right place.

 

YES, I want all the BEST STUFF! I have maybe $500 to spend if I really cut my budget to the bone for everything else like the holidays and travel, or just forget those!

 

So not knowing any better I am looking at the analog systems with motion activation, trying for 700TVL cameras and at least four of those.

What I want is at least an 8 channel system with 4 cameras now to watch the road frontage, maybe get cheaper 420TVL Cameras to add on the watch the sides and rear.

 

If I can Identify them driving in and getting out of the car we know who they are, then even if grainy not good video to id them elsewhere we may still see what they are doing, and we will already know who they are from the front cameras.

 

Wait till I have more money for a better system than I can afford right now? Everything I own may be gone by then!

 

Sure I can save up for a year and study and learn the workings of the better stuff, but can you say for sure the thieves or their friends won't be back next month? Will they be nice and wait till I can afford the better stuff to catch them with?

 

Also, for some area's I may not care about quality as long as some actions are on video and maybe audio also.

I sometimes stay there at night, I do fully intend to protect myself if threatened in any way, that likely will mean a bullet! I only need video good enough to show they made a move at me I considered threatening! I don't know what those scumbags may do if they break in at 2am and I am there to catch them again.

No phone there and cell does not work either, so I can't just call the cops, I'll have to defend myself if needed! So any video that shows they swung an object like a pipe or jug wrench at me proves self defense!

[luckyfella 0]

I think the title of this post should be changed. Let's make it, if you KNOW how to install both an IP system and an analog system, why would you chose analog over IP? Also, I'm getting annoyed at the price thing. If you shop around, you can get

an IP system very reasonable these days. No one should be saying that they would need to save up for an IP rather than buy

an analog today. If your buying an 8 channel analog system with cameras and a dvr for under 500.00, than guess what, your

getting what you pay for, CRAP. And your going to end up buying a new system with more money so why not spend what you ended up spending and get an IP system with higher resolution than analog? Again, this is all considering the knowledge of

installing both systems are there. I think this post should be geared towards the professional installers, not the DIY'rs that

want plug and play.

Edited November 29, 2013 by Guest

[shockwave199 0]

I think it would be impossible to find an installer that wouldn't charge more money for an MP system, given the same amount of camera channels the customer wants. I want to meet the installer that charges the same price for an 8 channel MP system as they would analog. You can't always say less cameras are needed with MP because of resolution either. Sometimes you actually need X amount of cameras. So I think this thread actually IS best served to DIY'ers, where installation cost isn't a consideration, and cost per piece is not inflated. And as far as price, you can find 8 channel systems at costco at excellent prices now. Grab one and do the install yourself. But it will cost more money than an 8 channel analog package for sure. Is it worth it? I'd say yes. But you always have to keep in mind that these are the very same companies that have been selling the analog gear, and all of the less than good things about them can still apply even when you buy their MP wares. Difficult customer service. Slow process of replacements. Hit and miss quality control of the gear. Companies that got blasted when it was all analog don't necessarily get a pass just because they're selling MP systems now. So I think it still comes down to saying yes- MP over analog. But packaged systems will cost you more and they are still just that- budget minded packaged systems where risk still applies. Like analog, personally I'd still prefer to buy my NVR and cameras separately and not from big box stores. Something like an 8 channel Qsee NVR/camera package at 1,500 is very tempting- a great deal. But when two of the cameras go to crap in a month or IR's start blinking out on a camera or two, it's STILL Qsee you'll have to deal with to make it right. That's where the deal and the support can part ways.

 

As always, IMO it still...depends

[AdamDaze 0]

Here's a point of view from someone brand new to ip cameras.

 

I'm not technotarded. I work with I.T and computers on a daily basis. I know how to set VLANS, route traffic, etc. My background heavily involved networking, that's not the problem.

 

The problem is, I can't find a one-stop resource for IP cams. While people on here mention brands, most threads are full of people discussing how good "model x" might be, when it comes out....and there's very little "kit" style information. I can go out and buy up to a 16 channel analogue kit from several brands that will do the job "comfortably" for less than $2k.

 

Despite the constant claims of "Ip being cheaper", I don't see how. Nobody can seem to agree if a 1RU NVR will do the job vs recommendations that that end-users buy a server, install software, get licences, etc. I mean, come on. That's way beyond the capacity of many home and small-business users, and would intimidate even many "mid" sized businesses.

 

Most "kits" out there seem to go up to 4, maybe 8 cams. Max.

 

Me personally I'm looking for an 8-12 cam solution and it's doing my head in. I'm this close to just pulling the trigger on an analogue kit because I *know* it'll work.

[luckyfella 0]

Being an IT guy and a tech guy, why is not finding a (kit), stopping you from installing an IP system? That's a lame excuse

if I ever heard one. Of all people, I would think you would want to stay away from analog considering the additional networking

capabilities you have with IP over analog. You can use a managed POE switch and reboot any camera you choose. You can remote into any single camera and adjust settings. And the resolution limit is far greater on IP over analog. But, since you can easily find

a 16 channel dvr with analog cameras, knock yourself out. Good luck.

[ak357 0]

Being an IT guy and a tech guy, why is not finding a (kit), stopping you from installing an IP system? That's a lame excuse

if I ever heard one. Of all people, I would think you would want to stay away from analog considering the additional networking

capabilities you have with IP over analog. You can use a managed POE switch and reboot any camera you choose. You can remote into any single camera and adjust settings. And the resolution limit is far greater on IP over analog. But, since you can easily find

a 16 channel dvr with analog cameras, knock yourself out. Good luck.

+1

IT guy buying Analog

[AdamDaze 0]

Because theres very little information about which cameras are compatible with which nvr, or software, etc etc, and lots of "oooh, check this, check that". The flood of cheap chinese knockoffs that seem to get often recommended really doesn't help. Lots of fragmented stuff. The best resource I've found so far was from networkcameracritic. To the point, relevant info, knowledgable answers on the q's. Highly recommend it.

 

I'm just pointing out that as far as information, technical specs, and "solutions" are concerned IP cams have a loooong way to go as an "industry".

[SunnyKim 2]

ak_camguy,

 

Let me ask you why we all should go for IP camera.

I honestly do not know.

In IP camera, just a single bit loss, we may lose at least 1 or 2 second duration of video frames, which can be very critical for a certain application. The display is time lagged with compression artifacts as well.

[luckyfella 0]

I truly disagree with you. At this point, almost EVERY single analog manufacturer has an IP line. Digital Watchdog, Everfocus, Digimerge, HIKvision, Acti, Mobotix, and many more. As far as which NVR works with which cameras, buy the NVR the same manufacturer as the camera you chose and your good to go. There are tons of technical terms and info on each and every manufacturers website. Either your not looking hard enough, or your afraid to dabble in something you have no experience in.

But being an IP guy, you should know technically exactly what you have to do to set up an IP camera system.

[Brenning 0]

I'm not a CCTV installer by trade, but I have installed both IP and analogue systems at various properties I own. Some have pointed out that if you buy an IP cam now, it will be out of date very shortly when newer versions arrive, but that's true for most technology these days so I can see businesses just upgrading the whole system every 5 years or so. I imagine its a similar story with analogue but I've not really been keeping an eye on the scene....

 

It's worth pointing out I work in I.T...

 

So after installing and using both systems which do I like best? .....IP Cams

 

Why? multiple reasons, they just seem "smarter" as each cam has settings that are changed on the camera itself rather than on a central DVR. I also love how I can cobble a server together with raid and tell the cameras to record straight to NFS/CIFS shares rather than having to buy a bespoke type DVR so to speak or random PCI card for BNC connectors. No software needed on the server other than an OS. POE switch is a really nifty advantage too.

 

I think the analogue systems aren't too bad really. From experience I've found you generally get what you pay for although prices do slowly come down as technology moves along. IP Cameras seem like a more logical way of doing things from my point of view so I do believe they will move forward faster than analogue but I guess no-one really knows what's round the corner.

 

I don't think its a question of "which is best?", might still be here in 10 years arguing that out. Question is, "Which do you want?"

 

Reminds me of when DJs were arguing over which was best, Vinyl record decks VS CD decks in nightclubs.........never ending argument lol........ analogue vs digital