Looking for a VMS with these functions (if exists)

[hardcopy 0]

Hi all,

 

I have a idea in my head regarding a security service. However, for that to work, i need a VMS that is capable of these things. I was hoping you guys could give me a push in the right direction.

I need a system that:

 

- Runs on a dedicated off-shore server (linux/Windows) Headless

- Auto detect new camera's on the network

- Does not record all ip camera's continuous, but only records when the camera's alarm is triggerd

- Works with a time schedule for the alarms, when the alarm goes off outside it's time, it is ignored

- Can group camera's

- Can add a large number of camera's (more than 256) it monitors

- Can scale up adding a second (or third) server

- Has a web interface (maybe per group of camera's?) that is password protected

- App for android/iPhone

- 2 way audio

 

Obviously a system with all these function probably won't exist, however, is there a system that comes close?

 

thanks for helping out!

 

regards

 

Mike

[ak357 0]

Hi all,

 

I have a idea in my head regarding a security service. However, for that to work, i need a VMS that is capable of these things. I was hoping you guys could give me a push in the right direction.

I need a system that:

 

- Runs on a dedicated off-shore server (linux/Windows) Headless

- Auto detect new camera's on the network

- Does not record all ip camera's continuous, but only records when the camera's alarm is triggerd

- Works with a time schedule for the alarms, when the alarm goes off outside it's time, it is ignored

- Can group camera's

- Can add a large number of camera's (more than 256) it monitors

- Can scale up adding a second (or third) server

- Has a web interface (maybe per group of camera's?) that is password protected

- App for android/iPhone

- 2 way audio

 

Obviously a system with all these function probably won't exist, however, is there a system that comes close?

 

thanks for helping out!

 

regards

 

Mike

Check Avigilon

[hardcopy 0]

Check Avigilon

 

Thanks for your reaction.

 

Can i use 3rd party ipcameras?

And what about pricing info?

As i see the features, i would need the enterprise edition, however as a starting company i would like to pay per camera and pay more as i get more clents. Would somethig like this be possible?

Would it run on Amazon EC2?

 

 

Thanks

 

Mike

[cliff369 0]

Hi there, let me see if I can assist on this -

based off your questions and as it relates to if Avigilon could work for you.

 

 

- Runs on a dedicated off-shore server (linux/Windows) Headless

== runs on any windows 64-bit os system

- Auto detect new camera's on the network

== If the camera is onvif compliant and one of the native mfgs they support yes it will auto detect it. still have

to manually add (drag&drop) the camera to the server because if there were multiple servers you wouldn't want it adding itself

to the wrong one.

- Does not record all ip camera's continuous, but only records when the camera's alarm is triggerd

== You can record on motion detection, digital I/O, or various other reasons based on alarms/rules

- Works with a time schedule for the alarms, when the alarm goes off outside it's time, it is ignored

== Yes, you can schedule alarms at timeframe you want per camera if you want also

- Can group camera's

== group cameras by name or location? you can create a site view that lets you organize the cameras that makes

sense to you.. like Floor 1 has these cameras, Floor 2 has these cameras, etc..

- Can add a large number of camera's (more than 256) it monitors

== Enterprise supports 128 channels or 256Mbps of bandwidth which ever comes first per server.

Obviously you couldn't add say 128 2Mbps cameras as it would be to much bandwidth.. What type of cameras

are you talking about.

- Can scale up adding a second (or third) server

== You can have has many servers as you want with Enterprise and clients as well.

- Has a web interface (maybe per group of camera's?) that is password protected

== There is a web client (internet explorer) available to login to servers and cams. You can create users/groups and

limit which cameras they have access to and other rights.. active directory is also supported.

- App for android/iPhone

=== yes.. free

- 2 way audio

=== yes on all h.264 H3 series cameras and free with standard or enterprise s/w

 

They also support 3rd party cameras - about 12-13 natively like Axis, Panasonic, Bosch now, Sony, etc... as well

as ONVIF compliant cameras.. Although you probably won't get motion detection support in 3rd party off-branded ONVIF cameras

simply because those camera mtgs usually aren't at the latest onvif version or profile S compliant.

 

I would not recommend to use Amazon EC2 with a full IP system as you would need quite a bit of upstream bandwidth from your location

to the cloud. a 2MP camera could send anywhere from 1-12Mbps of bandwidth and if you have lets say 50 cameras all recording to the cloud

that's lets roughly 3Mbps per camera - 150Mbps upstream connection required for usuable quality. Better to record locally and view remotely in my opinion.

Besides there is not a lot of quality of service going through internet hops to get to your cloud location.

 

Pricing is also a one time purchase of licenses, with no recurring licensing fees which is nice.

I'd recommend reaching out to the other avigilon certified partners on here like The Wire Guys to help you out if you are

still interested.

 

Oh and go check out their youtube channel if you want to see the software.

 

Hope this helped some.

[mkkoskin 0]

- Can add a large number of camera's (more than 256) it monitors

== Enterprise supports 128 channels or 256Mbps of bandwidth which ever comes first per server.

Obviously you couldn't add say 128 2Mbps cameras as it would be to much bandwidth.. What type of cameras

are you talking about.

 

Why is 128 x 2Mbps (= 256Mbps?) too much bandwidth if they support 256Mbps or 128 cameras?

[hardcopy 0]

Maybe it is best to explain the purpose of it. I want to:

 

1) Sell residential camera security equipment

2) Additionally want to offer a service that keeps an eye on the camera's for a fee, so when a alarm is triggered (motion etc) the 'dispatch room' gets an alert and can view the camera instantly.

 

So as i can see it there are multiple scenarios, can you tell me what are plausible and what are not?:

-------

Network Camera's with a DVR on-site, connected to a VPN network. When there is a alarm i connect to the DVR and view the camera.

 

Network Camera's with a DVR on-site, connected to a VPN network. The DVR outputs a h264 stream to a centralized VMS in the Dispatch room. VMS notices the alarm by the DVR.

 

Network Camera's without DVR, connected to a VPN router. Local storage in camera. Connected by VPN to the VMS in the dispatch room.

 

Network Camera's without DVR, connect to a cloud service (ivideon?) and Dispatch room uses their account to view the camera when an email alert comes in.

-----

 

There are a few important things here.

 

I would like to keep the bandwidth at a minimum, so 1fps(or no data) when no alarm, 25fps when a alarm goes off. Every client is running on a 10-50mbit resident internet connection (minimum)

 

I Expect people to have 2-4 camera's installed in their house

 

I will need the system to scale up per client, so if i get 5 clients it has to work, but if the service becomes populair, it should also have to handle 150 cameras

 

 

 

 

Thanks for giving your 50c about this ideal. Essentially, i would like to make 'business service' camera security with dispatch room, possible for residential home-owners.

[thewireguys 3]

What do you plan to charge for this service? How much per camera?

 

FYI you are not the first person to come up with this idea which sounds great on paper but not so easy to implement.

[hardcopy 0]

I was thinking of $80 for the first camera and for each other camera $20. Per month.

 

Can you tell my what the problems where with other people that tried this?

[thewireguys 3]

I was thinking of $80 for the first camera and for each other camera $20. Per month.

 

Can you tell my what the problems where with other people that tried this?

 

 

Bandwidth, bandwidth caps, price and low resolution.

 

For a 4 camera system your going to charge $140 per month x 12 = $1680 per year just for your service. The customer also must have a internet contention which will be an additional cost.

 

You can purchase a 4 channel HD system for under $1680 and own it unlike your solution which I will have to continue to pay for and it will be MUCH lower resolution and frame rate.

[cliff369 0]

mkoskin, because realistically nobody would buy 2mp cameras and dumb them down to 2Mbps of bandwidth..

might as well buy 1MP cameras or analog. When you cap the bandwidth of the camera then if it's always pegged at 2Mbps

it will always compress and degrade the video quality more. You are correct though, you could put 128 cameras at 2Mbps of bandwidth

I just never would or would recommend it.

 

hardcopy in my opinion it would be best to put a small mini-itx i3 nvr at the house or maybe the new intel avalon 64bit atom board

and record locally... then just monitor and stay logged into all the homes remotely. but i'm not in the residential business so, just my .02

 

wireguys, agree with your statement as well.. seems like it would be better to just sell the whole system to the house for $1500 or something

like that..

[tomcctv 190]

I was thinking of $80 for the first camera and for each other camera $20. Per month.

 

Can you tell my what the problems where with other people that tried this?

 

 

 

hardcopy. Hi. get yourself a coffee sit back and read your above quote over and over.

 

your problems first ........ it will take you two years before you see any profit from your customer with $80 camera and 6 years for you $20 cameras and the more customers you get the more outlay you have.

 

you would have to give your customers cameras that have good warranty just to protect your outlay

 

and have you seen the cost of liability insurance for monitoring.

 

 

but any customer with a good head for figures is going to ask you to explain WHY first is $80 and the rest are ONLY $20 that does not add up at all

[hardcopy 0]

Okay, thanks for kicking me back to earth

 

My though was to sell the camera system, however, i wanted to add a extra dimension of security. Because if there is some one breaking in when i'm a sleep, the system will record but cannot sound an alarm?

 

How to provide for that extra piece of security, that makes the home even safer. Attach it to an alarm system?

 

Too bad the dispatch room idea isnt plausible. I am wondering, security companies, monitoring for example industrial areas in a city, they have live video right? How do they do it?

 

 

 

thanks guys

[thewireguys 3]

Also most people dont like the idea of random people being able to watch cameras inside there homes.

 

Also you will have a hard time getting a small business to pay $140 a month let alone a home owner.

 

Also what your trying to do is nothing like a city wide cctv system which 99% of the time has there own dedicated network (wired and/or wireless network) to work with.

[thewireguys 3]

Okay, thanks for kicking me back to earth

 

My though was to sell the camera system, however, i wanted to add a extra dimension of security. Because if there is some one breaking in when i'm a sleep, the system will record but cannot sound an alarm?

 

How to provide for that extra piece of security, that makes the home even safer. Attach it to an alarm system?

 

Too bad the dispatch room idea isnt plausible. I am wondering, security companies, monitoring for example industrial areas in a city, they have live video right? How do they do it?

 

 

 

thanks guys

 

He is a solution doing exactly what you want. http://www.videofied.com/us/en/home/

[buellwinkle 0]

You can trigger emails or text on motion detection, but not easy to set like an alarm,where you can work the system from keypads like typical alarm systems. Also, there are a few cloud providers for surveillance where the motion detection and short term storage is done on-site and then pushed to the cloud as quickly as the network bandwidth allows. You just need to attend a trade show where they these companies exhibit. If you are creative and a do it yourselfer, you can setup an EC2 server on the Amazon Web Services (AWS) cloud that the cameras FTP to (many do), then push the video to AWS S3 Cloud Storage.

 

The best thing for me for security is AVTech's Push Video series like the AVN813. These typically have PIR motion detectors and smartphone apps where they homeowner can easily turn the notifications on/off and get instant alerts with video. I love mine, lets me know if someone is in our home when we are not there, shows me the video that triggered the event, and I can have live video with 2-way audio, call the appropriate people, maybe a neighbor with a shotgun.

 

You can have network cameras with alarm I/O trigger the house alarm to go off, not sure if that's a smart idea, at least I would not want to live next to the home that got that setup.

 

If you want to be unique, consider a security fogger and strobes. Temporarily blind the suspects - http://www.flashfogsecurity.com/ I would play a recording first to leave immediately to avoid poison gas exposure, LOL. The cameras would be more for recording the fun so you can post it on YouTube later.

 

 

 

Okay, thanks for kicking me back to earth

 

My though was to sell the camera system, however, i wanted to add a extra dimension of security. Because if there is some one breaking in when i'm a sleep, the system will record but cannot sound an alarm?

 

How to provide for that extra piece of security, that makes the home even safer. Attach it to an alarm system?

 

Too bad the dispatch room idea isnt plausible. I am wondering, security companies, monitoring for example industrial areas in a city, they have live video right? How do they do it?

 

 

 

thanks guys