Newbie needs help! Guide me! I need a new system!

[CaptainCuddles 0]

Hey all!

 

I am so overwhelmed. This security cam world is just enormous. I've been looking at camera stuff for days. And at the end of a 2-hour run of wading through piles of videos, ads, and Chinese pages, I'll stumble onto something that basically tells me everything I just looked at was crap. Sigh...

 

I need help!

 

We recently had some folks at home that, well, weren't supposed to be here! And for peace of mind, I'd like to get some cameras on the property to keep an eye on the place while we aren't here.

 

There are just so many options out there. So many systems, terms, cameras, wiring jobs, wireless options--it's very difficult to feel comfortable making decisions.

 

I'm a technical guy, and generally can set up things on that side of the fence with no problems. Reading about port forwarding doesn't bother me. But, I'm not a handy guy, and I don't particularly enjoy projects around the house, drilling holes, or being in my scary attic. So, when I stumbled onto this "wifi IP cam" stuff, I got excited. Maybe not the best quality, but just plug 'em in and put them on a table? Wow!

First I saw those 'dropcams,' but the price on them seemed outrageous for what they were. Then I got led to Foscam, which turned out to be shunned by people and plagued with firmware and security problems. And now I'm reading that most of these cameras are garbage, can't run a framerate worth a darn, kill your internet, and suck over Wifi.

 

I need help. I need guidance. Here's my ideal situation--maybe you guys can point me in a direction:

 

- A good starting point would be 4 cameras for me, all INSIDE. One near each entryway (front, garage, back), and one in master bedroom, where all the theives love to be

- Doesn't have to be mega-HD, but a blurry mess won't cut it, and 5FPS on video just sucks.

- Something that will notify me with photo/video when there is motion detected (and preferably not just the cat).

- Something that can be checked on remotely (smartphone)

- Something that can be easily turned on/off

- Something that records video, especially if there's movement. And I would really prefer an option to copy that footage OFF SITE. Dropbox or something? It'll just get stolen onsite.

- Something that'll work with the lights off

- And of course... all this, but that won't break the bank I mean, I've been looking at $65 Foscams, so my stomach isn't going to handle $300 cameras.

 

 

So, help! Give me some suggestions, re-set my expectations, and I will be eternally grateful! Thank you!

[drocer 0]

Inside only and you don't want to screw with wires? Get foscam "720p" cameras and be done with it. Just lower your expectations on quality and reliability; however, some have great luck. Outside? Don't even think about putting them there or even use foscam. Night vision is going to suck with those too.

 

Another option could be to buy $50 prepaid android phones, install IP camera apps, and that would work just like foscam. You would need IR lights to see at night.

 

Once you move to actually good IP cameras, prepare your wallet.

[Q2U 0]

Hmmm...have I not seen this post elsewhere? Send me $2,500.00 and I send you what you need. Next.

[CaptainCuddles 0]

Hmmm...have I not seen this post elsewhere? Send me $2,500.00 and I send you what you need. Next.

 

Yes, I posted my inquiry on two completely separate camera discussion websites. My apologies if that offends you.

[steuk 0]

You saw foscam for $65 so for you it's a cost reference ?

 

Sorry to say that but Foscam are bad cameras...if you want cameras that do the stuff you say and that are reliable, then you'll have to pay at least $120 each

[CamB 0]

If you just want inside cams and don't want to mess with port fowarding, forget the Foscam and get a few Dropcams. They work right out of the box after being connected to WiFi.

 

Just make sure you have fast internet via Comcast, WebPass, etc...as more than 4 of these cameras could suck up alot of your bandwidth.

[CaptainCuddles 0]

steuk, well, yeah, kind of. It was a starting point. I realize that, since they aren't good, better ones will be more. $120 sounds reasonable.. about twice as much. But $300-$400 would be out of my range.

 

CamB, if I could get some metrics on the WiFi performance of those things, I think I'd be more apt to look into a true WiFi setup inside. I have a pretty good setup, I think, as far as internet and internal network goes. The big issue with the dropcams is that, as far as I can tell, you're paying a lot for 'brand and marketing'... like "Apple tax." Also, I think I could set up my own offsite storage and not have to pay their big fees for cloud services.

[steuk 0]

IMHO, WIFI is not ready for video recording.

 

The reasons are :

1. You need top wifi card on cameras and top wifi router to prevent loss connection (WIFI reliability sucks !)
   
2. You always have one of your cameras which is out of range (damn, I will break this f**** wall ! )
   
3. Don't use your laptop to download or view streaming series on the web, whether your download will suck or your cameras won't record anything (depends on your WIFI router QoS)
   
4. Don't record more than X cameras through WIFI (generally 4), because your WIFI won't handle it
   
5. WIFI doesn't mean no wire...you'll still have to power it up !

 

At home, my WIFI router (linksys ea6900 which is a really good one right now) is only used for my laptops, mobile phones, printers, TV.

For my cameras, all are wired/powered with a single cable (PoE) and connected to a dedicated gigabit switch with PoE...Reliability : 100%

[mkkoskin 0]

You might wanna check on D-LINK cameras, they're cheap and models with L (i think) at the end are mydlink enabled.

They have low resolution cameras for under 100$ and HD for bit over, for example DCS-2132L (150$ on newegg, http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=9SIA24G0P59768 ) which has everything you need, though i'm not sure how good their nightvision is.

 

More info about mydlink:

https://www.mydlink.com/entrance

[steuk 0]

Did you go on buellwinkle's (great ) website ?

 

I'm pretty sure you will find many answers that will help you choosing the cams you need !

[gatorguy 0]

I read the OP and am in a VERY similar situation, so I didn't want to start a new thread. In fact, I'd say take exactly what the OP said and change only following items. My three main questions are in bold below:

1. I only need one camera (maybe 1 more in the future).
   
2. I don't care to store offsite. I would like to store to my 12TB NAS running the unRAID OS (http://lime-technology.com). I can do FTP, NFS or SMB.
   
3. I have no problem hard wiring camera (and prefer to versus wifi).
   
4. I'm more a quality over quantitiy guy, but obviously, I want to pay only what is necessary to do the listed tasks. I would hope to keep it under, say $200-250 for one camera.

 

I guess after my many hours of reading/research, I'm leaning towards the Hikvision DS-2CD2032. Is there an obviously better choice I'm overlooking?

 

Are these Swanns from Costco the exact same model (obviously re-branded)? https://www.costco.com/Swann-HD-1080p-NVR-IP-Add-on-Bullet-Camera-2-pk.product.100039914.html

 

Finally, if the linked Swanns are in fact the same as the DS-2CD2032, will the interface look the same as seen on blogs such as buellwinkle's?

Thanks in advance for your patience, answers and constructive advice!

[Kawboy12R 0]

Yes, the Swanns have the same interface and are basically the same camera. The Hiks and Swanns will store to NAS. Do some reading on here and on networkcameracritic for specifics and some limitations. I'm not sure that the DS-2CD2032 would be my first choice for mounting INSIDE my home though (not sure how identical your situation is to the OP). Too in-my-face for my liking. I'd go with an Axis P12 series cam if discrete is important and you'll always be dealing with a lighted situation. "Regular" unwanted visitors will probably turn your lights on, thieves probably won't. For indoors, you can find cube cameras (much less obtrusive sitting tucked away on a shelf than hanging a bullet cam somewhere) with infrared and PIR detection to virtually eliminate false positives- really handy for email notification when you KNOW someone isn't supposed to be there. Most of the Axis M10 series cubes will record to NAS (some will do edge storage to SD card as well), some do sound, plus some have PIR detection with LED lighting assist. The M1054 is probably the Cadillac you'd be looking for. If you're looking for outdoor cams though, it's hard to beat the bang for the buck of the little Hik-based bullets or domes.

[gatorguy 0]

That's a very helpful reply and gives me some good direction to continue my reading and research. Thank you for taking the time to post that info!

[MaxIcon 0]

It's really hard to go wrong with the 2032 if you're a new IP cam user on a budget. You'd have to spend a good bit more money to get better performance, and going below the Hik price range takes you into mostly lower quality or bad support turf.

 

The main question in that price range is whether a mini-bullet will do the trick, or if you need the less conspicuous appearance of a dome, especially for indoor use or in public facing areas.

 

Buying one or two Hiks would be a good start, you'd learn a lot about IP cams, support is very good for them, and you could figure out if you need to upgrade for the remaining cams.

[CaptainCuddles 0]

mkkoskin, I'll check on the d-links. I saw them briefly but with mixed reviews. I think they use a cloud service from d-link too.. not sure if that has a subscription fee.

 

steuk, I did see his site. Didn't see a lot of cameras like this, though. Only a couple tabletop cams from what I could find.

 

 

I'll keep browsin' around at stuff. Axis seems to have the nice M10 series stuff, but I really can't afford $300 cameras.

[drocer 0]

I read the OP and am in a VERY similar situation, so I didn't want to start a new thread. In fact, I'd say take exactly what the OP said and change only following items. My three main questions are in bold below:

1. I only need one camera (maybe 1 more in the future).
   
2. I don't care to store offsite. I would like to store to my 12TB NAS running the unRAID OS (http://lime-technology.com). I can do FTP, NFS or SMB.
   
3. I have no problem hard wiring camera (and prefer to versus wifi).
   
4. I'm more a quality over quantitiy guy, but obviously, I want to pay only what is necessary to do the listed tasks. I would hope to keep it under, say $200-250 for one camera.

 

I guess after my many hours of reading/research, I'm leaning towards the Hikvision DS-2CD2032. Is there an obviously better choice I'm overlooking?

 

Are these Swanns from Costco the exact same model (obviously re-branded)? https://www.costco.com/Swann-HD-1080p-NVR-IP-Add-on-Bullet-Camera-2-pk.product.100039914.html

 

Finally, if the linked Swanns are in fact the same as the DS-2CD2032, will the interface look the same as seen on blogs such as buellwinkle's?

Thanks in advance for your patience, answers and constructive advice!

 

Store what on your NAS? AFAIK, FTP motion detected pictures is all that really works unless you want to risk bricking a camera by loading hikvision firmware. (See that thread). I haven't messed with either as I have a dedicated machine to view/store.

 

Same interface but firmware is from swann and lags the latest ones offered to hikvision branded cameras.

 

Source: I own 4 2-packs.

[steuk 0]

Didn't see a lot of cameras like this, though. Only a couple tabletop cams from what I could find.

 

I'm pretty sure most of Hikvision cams can do what you want :

1. HD : Yes, as least 1280x760 at 25FPS
   
2. Notifies on motion detection (email - ftp)
   
3. Can be checked from your smartphone through apps
   
4. What do you mean by "can be easily turned on/off" ?
   
5. records video on motion detection. Can record ON SITE or OFF SITE (just mount your Dropbox as NFS partition and you'll be able to record on it - but you should have a really good internet connection !)
   
6. Good IR on these cams
   
7. From $100 to $250 for good models

[CaptainCuddles 0]

Didn't see a lot of cameras like this, though. Only a couple tabletop cams from what I could find.

 

I'm pretty sure most of Hikvision cams can do what you want :

1. HD : Yes, as least 1280x760 at 25FPS
   
2. Notifies on motion detection (email - ftp)
   
3. Can be checked from your smartphone through apps
   
4. What do you mean by "can be easily turned on/off" ?
   
5. records video on motion detection. Can record ON SITE or OFF SITE (just mount your Dropbox as NFS partition and you'll be able to record on it - but you should have a really good internet connection !)
   
6. Good IR on these cams
   
7. From $100 to $250 for good models

 

 

Easily turned on/off means when I or my wife come home, we can press a button and turn them all off. Hardwired cameras running to an NVR in the basement would just be on all the time, and we don't want that. We want a tabletop camera that we can put on an outlet, with a little remote light switch, and just kill the power when we get home.

 

The rest of the Hikvision line is domes & bullets mostly... I'm really looking for something to set on a table and plug into the wall. I feel like that's limited.

[Kawboy12R 0]

Easily turned on/off should be simple even if whatever you're using for an NVR doesn't autoboot when the power is turned on. Just run the cams through a switch that's turned on/off with a light switch. If you don't want to run wires etc for a wired lightswitch, use something like this remote power outlet to turn the switch (or possibly NVR) on and off.

[steuk 0]

To turn on/off easily, with wired cams you just have to power them through PoE.

Once connected to a NVR (or a PoE switch), you will just have to turn off the NVR (or switch) to turn off all your cams (or just unplug the ethernet cable of the camera you want to turn off).

 

I don't know cams having a power button, that would be a real security issue (everybody would be able to turn it off - but thieves would thank you for that help for sure )

[CaptainCuddles 0]

The outlet switch stuff that Kawboy posted is really what I was thinking. I just want to make sure killing power to cameras:

1) Won't hurt the hardware

2) Won't cause the config on them to 'reset'

3) Won't throw them out of alignment when they turn back on

 

So far it seems these things are not an issue for the most part. But that is what I meant by that particular piece of criteria.

[Kawboy12R 0]

I was thinking you wanted a no-brainer extremely convenient way for the cams to be on when you wanted them on and off when you didn't. Nobody would want to have to go to another room and physically unplug or turn on/off something every time they entered or left the house. Easy peasy with a switch or key fob by the front door. Just don't label it "Security camera off switch".

 

Personally I'd try the key fob idea first. Low effort and easy to stash out of the way.

[CaptainCuddles 0]

I was thinking you wanted a no-brainer extremely convenient way for the cams to be on when you wanted them on and off when you didn't. Nobody would want to have to go to another room and physically unplug or turn on/off something every time they entered or left the house. Easy peasy with a switch or key fob by the front door. Just don't label it "Security camera off switch".

 

Personally I'd try the key fob idea first. Low effort and easy to stash out of the way.

 

You're right on the money, good sir.

[steuk 0]

First time I see a Wireless Remote Control Power Outlet, I didn't know it existed, what a cool stuff !!!