New system NVR-PC build. Need some advices

[Raikkok 0]

Hi everyone.

 

After reading a lot of ebay articles about cctv systems and cctv information webs, I have moreless the idea what I want, but at final i need your help

 

 

The system where i want to record the cameras´activity is:

 

system build for me, pc

 

I would like to use a pc that i had in the garage (amd apu, psu 550w, 4 gb ram, 2 hdd, asrock board, case, etc..)

 

The big problems that i find in my system is:

 

 

- I want IP cameras like this one

 

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1080X960P-1-3MP-P2P-Security-IP-Camera-HD-outdoor-Onvir-network-NightVision-/141243293659?pt=US_Security_Cameras&hash=item20e2c19fdb

 

but i don´t know what type of NVR card PCI i need to connect that type of IP cameras.

 

The only cards that i find are these ones:

 

http://www.ebay.com/itm/4-CH-Video-4-CH-Audio-PCI-H-264-Realtime-100-120-FPS-DVR-Capture-Card-3G-mobile-/261017943060?pt=US_Surveillance_Digital_Video_Recorders_Cards&hash=item3cc5e1bc14

 

as you can see, it is for a DVR system.. but not for a NVR.

 

I don´t know if i understand well or wrong a thing:

 

If a need a resolution higher than 700p or TVL, i need neccesary ip camera megapixel, that is correct?

 

4 IP weird cameras + Poe switch

I need some suggestions about them

 

thanks in advanced, i hope your help

Edited June 5, 2014 by Guest

[MaxIcon 0]

You don't need an NVR card for IP cams. They're on your network, and all you need is a network connection, camera power, and software that supports the cams you want to use.

 

There's a huge variety of software out there, from free to very expensive. Many no-name cams aren't supported very well, even if they're ONVIF, so it's good to do a little homework first.

 

Two popular starter packages are Xprotect Go, which is free, supports 8 cams, doesn't require a high power CPU, and will record up to 5 days, and Blue Iris, which is $40-50, supports as many cams as your PC will handle but needs a fairly powerful CPU, and records as long as your hard disk will support.

 

You can download both and test them out.

[Raikkok 0]

Thanks MaxICON

 

After posted the message, i continued surfing on the net and discovered what you say..

 

I don´t need a nvr card..

 

Well, about the NVR-PC would be:

 

CPU: AMD APU FM1 A6-3500

 

MOTHERBOARD: ASROCK A75-Pro4

 

RAM: 4 GB RAM KINGSTON

 

HDD: 2 x HDD. 1 HDD for S.O. and other one for recording.

 

CASE: HAF 932 (but i´m looking for another one more little than that)

 

PSU: I have to buy it. 550-600w i consider enough..

==============

 

 

And now the network and cameras:

 

I need to buy a switch poe 4 ports ( i see trendnet brand, also considering Tplink, etc..)

10/100 is enough or better get a gigabit?

 

Camera, i need the next:

 

HD, Outdoor, good record night vision, move detection, 1-3 MP, etc..

 

I see this one, that comes with all that type of features:

 

http://www.hikvision.com/es/products_show.asp?id=7326

 

http://www.aliexpress.com/item/2013-Hikvision-Original-infrared-gun-waterproof-network-camera-DS-2CD2032-I-3MP-IR-ip-camera-support/1397052584.html

 

100 euro per camera in Ebay. (70 euro at aliexpress)

 

is there any product (refering to cameras ip wired) with similar features and price?

 

 

I see in that video, comes with two cables, one is ethernet (cat 5 utp enough no?) and the other one 12V, where do i have to connect it?

 

thanks so much for your help

Edited June 5, 2014 by Guest

[MaxIcon 0]

That Hik 2032 is a great camera for the money, and is very popular. It's hard to go wrong with it when you're starting, though you'll find many more cams you want as you go along. There are similar cams that are cheaper, but you get a lot of support on the web with the Hik because it's popular. There are many posts about it here and on other forums.

 

It doesn't have the greatest night images, but they're not bad, and you have to pay a good bit more to get good night vision in 2MP and 3MP cams.

 

The PC should be OK, depending on how many cameras, what resolution and frame rate, and what software. Your CPU benchmarks at 3209. It should run Xprotect Go with no problem, and will run Blue Iris if you don't run too many MP cams at a high frame rate.

 

I run Blue Iris on an i5-3570k with 4GB, which benches at 7174, and it handles 9 cams, 15MP total, at 10 fps. Many folks who are buying PCs now for Blue Iris and lots of cams are buying i7 3rd and 4th gen CPUs.

 

I also have an old i3-540 that benches at 2686, and it runs Blue Iris with 6 cams, 9MP, 10 fps, but not much more. Other people run Xprotect Go on a similar PC with more cams with no problem.

 

You don't need a huge power supply, though it doesn't hurt. My i3-540 and i5-3570k both draw 90W at 60% cpu utilization. One has a 200Wps, one has a 350Wps, and both have been running for quite a while with no problems.

 

You didn't mention a video card, but just in case, you also don't need an external video card if your motherboard has on-board video, as most NVR software doesn't require 3D capability. Both of my boxes run the on-CPU video.

 

You can use either 12Vdc power or POE. If you go with the POE switch (recommended), that's all you need, as the camera will get the power over the network cable. It's a good idea to tape up the 12Vdc connector so it doesn't get water and bugs in it if it's going to be outside, but I have several that aren't protected and have run fine for a long time.

 

Sounds like a good start. If you go with Blue Iris and add more cameras, you may need more CPU power, but it will depend on your settings.

[Raikkok 0]

Thanks again for your support.

 

Well, I forgot metion some details that could be interesting:

 

 

1.- First of all, I want to attach a simple map about my second home:

 

Green border line ---> hedge

 

The second red square belongs to a garage, but as I know, for the down limits thieves never come.. i don´t mind put there cameras (at the begining i considered put two NVR, one in the garage and another one in the house, but too expensive, so i prefer keep safe and monitoring the house. Other reason is because thieves the principal access where they enter is through the principal door.

 

Blue triangles, belongs to the vision angle of the cameras

 

2.- Number of cameras, no more than 6. I don´t know if my CPU AMD A6 3500[benches at 2009] will be enough... (i was wrong about the model cpu). At beginning i will only buy 2 cameras, the rest will come soon

About Hikvision.. any good retailer at Aliexpress recommended?

 

3. About network communication.

Well, in my second home, i don´t have telephone line, internet dsl, fiber, etc.. So I was thinking about convert a smartphone unused (htc desire) in a modem 3g, to share the internet network connection with the NVR PC. Is there any problem with it?

 

4. About dedicated graphic card.

The idea is to use the onboard card that comes with the cpu. In my case is a Radeon HD6530D

 

5. About you say, with a 450w or 500w psu will be enough no? any brand recommended? OCZ, Corsair?

 

6.- Going back to the cpu.. the top FM1 CPU at AMD is A8-3870K, benches at 3673. New costs 98 euro, Second hand.. i don´t know. As I said, 6 cameras will be enough, probably 4 (the only point i ´m not sure if install inside home or not a DOMO camera ip..

So the question is, with my actual cpu (A6-3500)... 4 cameras ip 3 Megapixel each other, Will be enough?

 

And finally two doubts about the installation:

 

1º. What type of ethernet cable i have to use to connect cameras ip to Switch POE? Cat 5 or 6 UTP? With this type of installation (cameras ip ethernet) can i use more than 100 meters cable without loosing signal or quality? or it is recommended less than 100?

 

2º Any idea about a switch poe 8-ports with good quality/price ratio?

 

3º The Hikvision camera or any other with IR night vision, at night, The IR leds, are illuminated?

 

4. To avoid too high power consumption... In the NVR PC system i will install windows 7 and my question is... can i record images in hibernation or suspended mode?

 

5. I´m also considering get an UPS. How can i calculate what is the most properly for my use?

 

Thanks so much

Edited June 5, 2014 by Guest

[ssnapier 0]

1º. What type of ethernet cable i have to use to connect cameras ip to Switch POE? Cat 5 or 6 UTP? With this type of installation (cameras ip ethernet) can i use more than 100 meters cable without loosing signal or quality? or it is recommended less than 100?

 

2º Any idea about a switch poe 8-ports with good quality/price ratio?

 

3º The Hikvision camera or any other with IR night vision, at night, The IR leds, are illuminated?

 

4. To avoid too high power consumption... In the NVR PC system i will install windows 7 and my question is... can i record images in hibernation or suspended mode?

 

5. I´m also considering get a SAI. How can i calculate what is the most properly for my use?

 

Thanks so much

 

1 - CAT-5E is more than adequate

 

2 - I like this one, it is quite nice and reliable: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16833120656

 

3 - The IR's have a very faint red glow to them, not a big deal.

 

4 - NO! How could you record if the operating system is not running? That is like asking if you can drive your car without starting it first.

 

5 - SAI?? What the heck is that? Did you mean a NAS? (network attached storage) If so, you need to know how many days you want to record and at what framerate/ resolution. It is also not a bad idea to know how much of it is daylight and how much is at night. Night recording tends to take a bit more space typically.

[Raikkok 0]

1º. What type of ethernet cable i have to use to connect cameras ip to Switch POE? Cat 5 or 6 UTP? With this type of installation (cameras ip ethernet) can i use more than 100 meters cable without loosing signal or quality? or it is recommended less than 100?

 

2º Any idea about a switch poe 8-ports with good quality/price ratio?

 

3º The Hikvision camera or any other with IR night vision, at night, The IR leds, are illuminated?

 

4. To avoid too high power consumption... In the NVR PC system i will install windows 7 and my question is... can i record images in hibernation or suspended mode?

 

5. I´m also considering get a SAI. How can i calculate what is the most properly for my use?

 

Thanks so much

 

1 - CAT-5E is more than adequateOK

 

2 - I like this one, it is quite nice and reliable: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16833120656 Ok, I take note, but i´m looking for something like 100 dollars or less

 

3 - The IR's have a very faint red glow to them, not a big deal. OK

 

4 - NO! How could you record if the operating system is not running? That is like asking if you can drive your car without starting it first. Sorry for the stupid question

 

5 - SAI?? What the heck is that? Did you mean a NAS? (network attached storage) If so, you need to know how many days you want to record and at what framerate/ resolution. It is also not a bad idea to know how much of it is daylight and how much is at night. Night recording tends to take a bit more space typically.Iin english is "UPS", uninterruptible power supply. So the question is, how can i calculate what UPS buy? More properly?

 

 

and the question, about smartphone as modem is very important, if anyone do it, it would be very useful to know if works or not.

I don´t know if to see the cameras image in real time, what bandwitch i would need?

 

Thanks so much

[Securame 0]

5. I´m also considering get a SAI. How can i calculate what is the most properly for my use?

 

This just made me notice that you are from Spain...

[ssnapier 0]

To address the UPS question, you need to determine how long you think it will need to run on batteries. I typically use a 1500VA UPS unit for most PC systems and that will give you between 12 and 20 minutes depending on the total load. Units in that size range typically cost between $150-$225 depending on brand and options. If you get larger than that the prices start to go up very quickly.

 

As for the POE switch, there is no 8 port POE switch that I would trust in the under $100 range, heck I cannot even think of one that exists in that price range! I also use this one which gives you all 8 ports for POE as opposed to the Cisco I posted earlier that only gives you 4 POE ports.

 

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16833122367&cm_re=Netgear_POE-_-33-122-367-_-Product

[Raikkok 0]

@ MindTwist: Yes, hahahahah.

 

@ssnapier: Ok, thanks so much. I have an old UPS but i don´t know what is its actual status, so i will re-check and about the poe switch i will make the effort.

 

 

 

At final, i will try first with my actual cpu (a6 3500) and try with 4 cameras and see if can move fluently. In the negative case... i will try with another configuration (nowadays mobo+cpu) i can find a good pack for 150-180 euro good ratio quality/price/power.

 

Some final questions more:

 

1.- Can someone recommend a good seller (low price and trusted) of Hikvision cameras?

http://www.aliexpress.com/item/2013-Hikvision-Original-infrared-gun-waterproof-network-camera-DS-2CD2032-I-3MP-IR-ip-camera-support/1397052584.html

 

I don´t see anything under from that price..

 

 

2.- And sorry for repeat again, but if anyone know about the bandwitch needed for see in real time the camera´s image, i would be very glad

 

3.- I´m seeing as you said above, a 4port poe is cheaper than 8port (obviously, and I have a friend that sells me one 4port poe Dlink for 50 euro) The problem is about the power cable of the 5th camera (Power Supply DC12V ± 10% / PoE )

Fast shipping Hikvision DS-2CD2132-I 3MP Network Mini Dome Camera cctv camera 30M IR Digital HD waterproof w/POE

 

http://www.aliexpress.com/item/FREE-shipping-Hikvision-DS-2CD2132-I-3MP-Outdoor-Network-Mini-Dome-Camera-30M-IR-Digital-HD/1397050451.html

 

What type of cable I need to supply power, and where i have to connect it?

 

4.- Exists any type of free software record all 24 hours along a month? I see blueiris,yes i know is shareware, and i send them an e-mail with my pc setup to see if i can with it fluently (i see minimum/optimal, i ´m not clear at all)

 

I see a video in youtube about the hikvision at night, and looks like really good

 

 

 

Thanks for all!

[MaxIcon 0]

For bandwidth, you set the bit rate on the camera, and there are trade-offs between bit rate, resolution, frame rate, files size, and image quality.

 

I run mine at 4096 kbps, 2MP or 3MP, 10 fps, and they look good. I could probably drop it to 2048 kbps without losing image quality. Higher frame rates and higher resolution require higher bit rates to maintain image quality. Higher bit rates give larger files sizes, too.

 

Hikvision has a file on their web site that shows recommended bit rates at different settings:

 

ftp://ftp.hikvisionusa.com

user name: hikfirmware

Password Hikvision123 (note the H is capitol )

 

Look in /technical bulletin/2014/IP Camera Recommended Bitrate v2.0_20140219.pdf

 

 

For POE, power comes over the network cable, so that's all you need for the first 4. For the 5th, you'll need either a POE injector (lets you use a network cable, just like the POE switch) or a 12Vdc, 1A (if the camera is 10W or less) supply with a 2.1 x 5.5mm connector (connects to the power plug on the camera, 1.5M cable on the one below, so you may need an extension). Here are examples:

http://www.amazon.com/Power-Adapter-Supply-1000ma-Quality/dp/B005JRGOCM/ref=pd_sim_e_2?ie=UTF8&refRID=14HX36R9Z9M0TH74AMQC

 

http://www.amazon.com/TP-LINK-TL-PoE150S-Gigabit-Injector-compliant/dp/B001PS9E5I/ref=sr_1_1?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1402087943&sr=1-1

 

 

Hikvision also has free NVR software. I haven't used it, but others here have. If you only use Hiks, it should work fine.

 

For your earlier question about a PS recommendation, the main thing is to buy good quality. Since the system will be running 24x7 and you never want it to go down, it's important to buy all good quality components.

[Raikkok 0]

For bandwidth, you set the bit rate on the camera, and there are trade-offs between bit rate, resolution, frame rate, files size, and image quality.

 

I run mine at 4096 kbps, 2MP or 3MP, 10 fps, and they look good. I could probably drop it to 2048 kbps without losing image quality. Higher frame rates and higher resolution require higher bit rates to maintain image quality. Higher bit rates give larger files sizes, too.

 

Hikvision has a file on their web site that shows recommended bit rates at different settings:

 

ftp://ftp.hikvisionusa.com

user name: hikfirmware

Password Hikvision123 (note the H is capitol )

 

Look in /technical bulletin/2014/IP Camera Recommended Bitrate v2.0_20140219.pdf

 

 

For POE, power comes over the network cable, so that's all you need for the first 4. For the 5th, you'll need either a POE injector (lets you use a network cable, just like the POE switch) or a 12Vdc, 1A (if the camera is 10W or less) supply with a 2.1 x 5.5mm connector (connects to the power plug on the camera, 1.5M cable on the one below, so you may need an extension). Here are examples:

http://www.amazon.com/Power-Adapter-Supply-1000ma-Quality/dp/B005JRGOCM/ref=pd_sim_e_2?ie=UTF8&refRID=14HX36R9Z9M0TH74AMQC

 

http://www.amazon.com/TP-LINK-TL-PoE150S-Gigabit-Injector-compliant/dp/B001PS9E5I/ref=sr_1_1?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1402087943&sr=1-1

 

 

Hikvision also has free NVR software. I haven't used it, but others here have. If you only use Hiks, it should work fine.

 

For your earlier question about a PS recommendation, the main thing is to buy good quality. Since the system will be running 24x7 and you never want it to go down, it's important to buy all good quality components.

 

 

Many thanks Max

 

About the switch POE i gonna buy this one:

 

http://www.ciudadwireless.com/d-link_dgs-1100-08p_8-port_10-100-1000mbps_gigabit_easysmart_switch_8-port_1000basetx_auto-negotiating_10-100-1000mbps-p-7133.html

 

Do you think a correct buy?

 

Thanks

[ssnapier 0]

That is a good switch for sure, good find.

[Securame 0]

About the switch POE i gonna buy this one:

 

http://www.ciudadwireless.com/d-link_dgs-1100-08p_8-port_10-100-1000mbps_gigabit_easysmart_switch_8-port_1000basetx_auto-negotiating_10-100-1000mbps-p-7133.html

 

Do you think a correct buy?

 

Good choice. Keep in mind that you will usually need 1 port for the computer/NVR, and another port for the router/network. So with with the 8 ports you will be able to connect up to 6 or 7 POE cameras.

 

If you don't plan on going over 4 cameras, you can find TP-Link TL-1008P (100mbps) for 53EUR or TL-SG1008P (1gbps) for 85EUR. They have 8 ports, 4 with POE, the other 4 do not have POE.

[Raikkok 0]

Thanks MindTwist and ssnaiper

 

Other i saw is this one:

 

http://www.amazon.es/gp/product/B00AUEYX0Y/ref=olp_product_details?ie=UTF8&me=

 

but i don´t know if it hasn´t gigabit network is important or no.

 

[MaxIcon 0]

Gb isn't really important for current IP cams. I like having a GB uplink port to give lots of overhead, but that's not really critical for a small number of cams. If you ran 6 cams at 4096 kbps, that's only 25 kbps total, and is not much load on a 100Mbps switch.

[Raikkok 0]

Next I will start with some tests.

 

Today I just bough my first Hikvision 2032-I, in next days will come

 

Next week, if nothing changes... Poe switch will come.

 

Only faults... the PSU (probably a Coolermaster 600w)

 

Thanks for watching