Why is image in cheap dashcam better than expensive IP cams?

[buellwinkle 0]

Actually, the post is of a review and the links create an eBay search in your country. I don't believe this to be spam, but I could be wrong.

 

I do like the product, quite impressive, just not sure how I can make use of a dash cam as I would want a more discrete solution, not something that looks like a radar detector on my dash plugged into my cig lighter. So instead of an all in one device, I would want one that was a box mounted say under the dash, with a thin wire and a tiny camera lens that I can run up my A-pillar, through the headliner and have just a small lens at the front and rear windshield that stuck on, like double stick tape.

[Alan2000 0]

Instead of arguing, why don't you go and buy 8 dash cams and install them on the side of your house.

Come back a year later and tell us how you saved a ton of money installing the dash cams and that they provided everything you needed from a professional surveillance system.

 

Prove us wrong...

 

 

Nicely said Mark! And I'd still like to know why he linked a youtube video to the company selling these things!

 

Who is arguing but the two of you two? The rest of us were having a civilized dialogue before you went nasty.

 

I had a general technical question based on my surprise on the image quality of a tiny camera compared to my IP cameras. This is suppose to be a forum dealing with security cameras. I would expect there would be mature adults here who could make productive comments about such things as camera sensors or other issues that could explain that why with such a wide FOV, the image is as good as it is, compared to a standard security camera. I have very limited knowledge in this field, and felt it was an appropriate question; so please excuse my ignorance on camera design and electronics.

 

How you extrapolated I would want to replace my IP cams with dash cams, or sell them to members here, is bizarre. You opt to accuse me of "arguing" and that I have some ulterior motive to post a YouTube video which has a link to a company selling them. The reason for the YouTube video was because it was a good review with details about the camera by a person that does reviews on many cameras. (I thought if someone wanted more info it was easier to click on a video link that search Google.) The person who created and uploaded the YouTube video does not sell them. If you would have bothered to go to the web site of the person who posted the YouTube video, before insinuating I'm trying to sell them, you would have found reviews on many cameras with links for info on where you can download firmware, manuals, and sites that sell the specific cameras in the reviews. I'd say he puts those links there as a service to people who may be interested in them given the helpful nature of all his reviews.

 

I was just having a dialogue, and trying to be helpful, until you started your less than cordial tone here. Nothing more, nothing less.

[Alan2000 0]

Actually, the post is of a review and the links create an eBay search in your country. I don't believe this to be spam, but I could be wrong.

 

I do like the product, quite impressive, just not sure how I can make use of a dash cam as I would want a more discrete solution, not something that looks like a radar detector on my dash plugged into my cig lighter. So instead of an all in one device, I would want one that was a box mounted say under the dash, with a thin wire and a tiny camera lens that I can run up my A-pillar, through the headliner and have just a small lens at the front and rear windshield that stuck on, like double stick tape.

 

Hey buellwinkle - I recommend that you look at the RC forums and adapt some of those techniques for installation in a car. I fly RC helicopters and airplanes, and what we do is take the electronics out of the case and run a longer cable to the lens assembly to a desirable spot in the airplane. This is not so much to hide the camera but to try to get it to fit in often very cramped spaces in the airplane.

 

Your post has made me think about doing the same in my car! I also don't like the attention of things stuck on my windshield. (But I will wait a while until I open in up just in case it craps out and I void the warranty. Cam is still too new. If it holds up until the end of the summer in the baking car heat here, it should be good to go after that.)

[Alan2000 0]

Are you saying this image from your camera:

 

 

 

Is better than a 2mp IP camera?

 

 

 

Yes, and if you had read through my posts, you would have also read that I also later said I realized I'd need to compare the dash cam video to video from the IP camera that was not processed through the DVR as the compression used in the DVR very well could be the reason my IP camera video is not nearly as crisp and detailed as the dash cam video. I made a newbie mistake of not comparing apple to apples.

 

Not sure about your comparison in your post between the two photos. You appear to be trying to make a point that the 2MP video snapshot from some 2MP camera is better. On the surface it seems that way until you see the same frame you posted again captured with better technique. You also are comparing a close shot of a SUV with excellent lighting with a camera that probably has something with less than 70 degree FOV lens to a totally different shot. You compare it to a dash cam shot taken from heavily compressed YouTube video, using a 120 degree lens, shot from a moving vehicle, from behind a windshield, with inferior lighting conditions to boot! Does that seem like a good way to compare two shots? I'm not an AV expert by a long shot but the comparison technique seems poor.

 

But for the fun of "arguing" let's try to do a comparison. Here is a video frame captured from my dash cam as I was driving through Taco Bell. Not ideal lighting conditions as late afternoon but good enough. Despite the image sensor capturing a much larger area, it doesn't look the the 2MP camera is that much better when you zoom into the plates. And look how sharp the edges are for a wide angle shot. (BTW, I'm not saying your 2MP camera image is bad, in fact it looks very nice, and so does...)

 

You may want to double check how you capture still frames from video clips. I captured the same section of video that you posted that looked pretty crappy and got something quite different. What I posted is not as good as the original frame capture because it had to be compressed down from 3.3MB to 500KB to post it here. After you click on the image to enlarge it, click again on the bottom right corner to get full size. Pretty darn impressive quality to me for a cheap cam through a windshield, and keeping in mind the original 3.3MB image is even better.

 

Okay, I'm done arguing now. Sorry folks for getting a little long winded on this but hopefully I didn't stray too far off topic and responding to luckyfella and Mark gave people a chance to see that cheap dash cams have come a long way in the last year or so. BTW, I personally would not buy one from the link on the YouTube video in case anyone was interested. I checked that link and it is a place located in Hong Kong. I paid a little more and bought mine here in the good ol' USA.

[Thsoer 0]

Instead of arguing, why don't you go and buy 8 dash cams and install them on the side of your house.

Come back a year later and tell us how you saved a ton of money installing the dash cams and that they provided everything you needed from a professional surveillance system.

 

Prove us wrong...

 

+1.

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[buellwinkle 0]

Tough crowd. Maybe Larry, if he's watching can create a dashcam subcategory under megapixel cameras like there is for SDI since they are all megapixel these days and surveillance/security is become more prevalent in cars. It seems to have some interest here, I'm interested.

[Razer_SE 0]

I too am interested - no idea why I want one but I do. Just got a new car and a dash cam could be fun and the video quality is truly impressive to me anyway. For no more than they cost I'd like to try one of these out.

 

The market seems to be full of many tiny brands, seems that someone big could really make a nice business for themselves by making and marketing a quality "brand name" dash cam at a good price.

 

I understand the lifetime concerns and weather issues and such people have brought up, but I think the op was specifically asking about the quality of the video compared to IP cameras. I have to say that the quality of the captured video on many of the dash cams are better than I'm getting out of 3mp security cameras. They are not cheap by any means, so I just want that sharpness and image quality in a security camera.

 

If I get a dash camera I could take some shots beside some IP cameras just to compare image quality, that could be fun as a comparison. Maybe some day.

[Alan2000 0]

Hello Razer_SE. I'm also planning to shoot some comparison videos with my 2-3MP IP cams when I get a bit more time. I was planning on shooting some comparison videos with my IP cams to compare the image using various bit rates to optimize my DVR settings. Won't take much more time just for kicks to throw in the dash cam for comparison.

 

I've used various dash cams over the years and most have had shoddy quality. Part of that is because I don't want an expensive "break into my car now" camera cooking on my dash. I've always used ones under $100. One thing to really watch for is that in the low cost dash-cam market there are several that look identical to each other (same case) but have different electronics in them. Once I ordered what I thought was an identical camera to the prior camera I used for my wife's car. But it was total junk with horrible image and menu system. Fortunately I got it from Amazon and was able to return it.

 

Many people overlook automobiles when it comes to security cameras. We will spend thousands of dollars on a home camera system and have nothing in our cars. Yet people are much more likely to need video from their car than from their home security system. Many more people will have accidents than have their home burglarized and too many people today are too dishonest to tell the truth to the police or their insurance company when they are at fault for the accident. So in the end the innocent party can get royally screwed if he doesn't have a dash cam or a witness.

 

The dash cam doesn't have to be fancy. IMHO, after using some for the past years, is that it has to turn on and off by itself, have okay image quality, and be reliable. (Add weather resistance is you are a motorcycle rider.) There are quite a few under $100 that fit the bill. I'm pretty anal about image quality so I'm always looking at what is new in the market. Even D1 quality from one of my older cams was more than ample for most dash cam applications.

[Firefighter 0]

For what it is, and it's cost it seems pretty nice.

 

I do like the idea of having a unit under the dash or in the car somewhere with a small

tiny camera mounted near the mirror.

 

If this was the idea, why could you not do one on the rear of the car also?

It would be worth running a 2nd wire feed through the headliner or somewhere to the back of the car so you had footage of the front and back of the car.

 

For example something like this.

 

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[buellwinkle 0]

That's what I'm talking about, a single box, size doesn't really matter, shoved up under the dash with two connectors for camera lenses with long leads so you can mount one in the front, maybe snake the wire and double stick tape it to the back of the mirror and another for the rear window. A license plate frame with just IR LEDs for night lighting and camera lens mounted in the rear windshield would be perfect. In the front you have headlights, usually HID on many new premium cars anyway.

 

Man, we got a whole design team here, we just need someone to build it.

 

BTW, Allen, I do appreciate your experience experimenting with this stuff, saves me from spending money on junk.

[Whatthehex 0]

That's what I'm talking about, a single box, size doesn't really matter, shoved up under the dash with two connectors for camera lenses with long leads so you can mount one in the front, maybe snake the wire and double stick tape it to the back of the mirror and another for the rear window. A license plate frame with just IR LEDs for night lighting and camera lens mounted in the rear windshield would be perfect. In the front you have headlights, usually HID on many new premium cars anyway.

 

Man, we got a whole design team here, we just need someone to build it.

 

BTW, Allen, I do appreciate your experience experimenting with this stuff, saves me from spending money on junk.

 

 

I'm now "Whatthehex"instead of Alan2000. That was my original name here until I lost and could not find my old login info.

 

If you feel adventurous, this site has some cables and info on extending the lens.

http://www.chucklohr.com/808/extending/

 

I was thinking you could mount 2 units inside a rear view mirror with one lens facing forward and the other facing the rear. That would be very stealth. You would need 2 short lens extension cables to do it. With a little skill you could mount the circuit board so that the memory card slots are flush with the edge of the mirror to easily extract the memory cards. Would end up costing about $160 plus cost of mirror to do that. But it would take some work to do. Realistically I think I would just mount one on the front and one on the rear windshield as is. Because of the small size they don't really stick out much.

 

I bought a small 4" LCD monitor for under $20 on eBay and also the video out cable for the dash-cam. I tried the monitor with a regular security cam and it worked okay. Still have not had a chance to try it with the dash cam.

 

I noticed you mentioned putting LEDS in the rear of the vehicle to light up the area. They would have to be pretty powerful to be of much value. I have an IR illuminator for the yard that is about 6"x4" and it doesn't light up all that far, maybe about 25' usable range. I do wish this dash-cam was a little more sensitive at night. I think eventually they are adding a firmware update that will let you adjust video properties. Seems like the shutter speed could be slower to get better low light performance. Nevertheless, still okay for night use. If you just want a backup camera there are a lot for sale pretty cheap that are water resistant. If the rear is mainly just for vision backing up then a dedicated back up system where the video is only displayed, and not recorded, would he cheaper and much easier to install than modifying a dash cam for the rear.

[buellwinkle 0]

That's genius because most mirrors already have power because of courtesy lights or remote buttons manufacturers embed in them in many cars. If I can tap into 12V at the mirror and this thing is so small, it would work great just stuck on externally on the back of my mirror where it can't be easily seen. Do they make a model with a lens on the flat side of the camera instead of the edge?

[Whatthehex 0]

I doubt there are any cams that could be fit in a mirror housing without removing the lens so that the circuit board could be conveniently positioned in the mirror. But for outside mounting if there is room behind your mirror it should blend in quite well.

 

I have powered my dash cams and radar detectors by tapping into the power cable going into my rear view mirrors. Mirrors that have an automatic dimming feature have power cables conveniently running into them and are set up to turn on and off with the ignition, so it's a very convenient power source. Running a thin power line from the fuse box is also pretty easy to do, any usually not that hard to tuck the wire behind the trim pieces to make it a nice invisible run.

 

Instead of having a camera pointed to the rear I'd like to have a hidden one that points to the left and right windows to record any encounters with the popo. I once tried a dash cam that had dual front and rear lenses. Maybe I could pull one of those apart and mount in a mirror facing right and left!

 

This is the dual lens camera I bought for about $75 from Amazon. It recorded front and back, had G sensor, GPS, and LCD display! While it had great features at a great price, I didn't like the image quality so I ended up returning it and opting for less features with better image quality. ( Cam only does 640x480 per lens.) Although realistically, something like this dual lens camera should work fine for the purpose, assuming for that price the thing holds up. Lots of feature for a pretty low price so who knows how long it would last.

 

[Whatthehex 0]

Here is my quick and dirty cam installation in my vehicle. After reading your post I'm now thinking about moving my cam behind the mirror. Only problem with that is you may not be able to see the small blinking LED so you know it is recording. I used a strip of aluminum that I bent so that is tucked in between my headliner just right so the camera is level. If I were to mount behind the mirror I would only need to bend the strip at about 90 degrees and use a heavy duty 3M adhesive strip to stick to the bak of the mirror.

 

Inside the car it looks like a small garage opener. The photo outside is with full sun shinning on it. Still not too obtrusive. In other lighting conditions it is less visible.

[msecure 0]

Here's a video of the Dashcam with Ambarella A2 at night.

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[JoePool 0]

I can't see the difference, really. So is it worth paying for higher resolution if you're just a general user?

[Cure4all 0]

It probably depends on what the footage would be used for if not just for viewing purposes. If someone was in an accident they would most likely prefer high quality, or say "storm chasers" would want super high quality as they offer their clips to News outlets for profit. I would be happy to have front and rear capabilities with high quality. I think most of us want the best images we can acquire. Interesting topic, just finished reading it.