Large Project: Enterprise DVR, 60+ Cameras

[jpalazzi 0]

I have a customer who is interested in 60+ Cameras. Does anyone have a product they recommend that will scale that well? I dont think putting in mulptiple DVRs is the solution>

 

PLease let me know if anyone has used the AXIS video servers or Honeywells Enterpise Video Server.

 

Thanks

James

[kandcorp 0]

If you are going to go the NVR route I would probably recommend:

http://www.video-insight.com/productsoverview.htm

[rory 0]

Not sure if Video Insight will do 60 cameras IP based ... thomas can maybe shed some light on that ....

 

Also check out Acti Video Servers & Milestone.

Acti has the lowest bandwidth for real time D1 transmission.

[Thomas 0]

We can. It's going to vary by camera model a little, some of them require a little more CPU power then others. With the Toshiba WB-02A (Middle of the road for CPU load) we have run 85 cameras on one server at 5 fps per camera.

 

(Server specs:

Dual Xeon 2.8s

1 GB Ram

XP Pro

Dell Poweredge 1800)

 

More then 85 cameras I would worry about the load on the NIC even if I added more CPU power.

[jpalazzi 0]

What is the difference in FPS and IPS? is there any other measurement I need to know?

 

Is there a place on the internet that will show me 5FPS vs 30FPS?

 

Thanks

James

[Thomas 0]

I have seen 1 fps = 1 IPS or 2 IPS depending on the company. And to be clearer, by FPS I mean frames per second (rather then fields). 30 FPS is pretty easy to find, most videos/DVDs should be at 30 fps.

[KrCCTV 0]

Actually with that number of cameras, and considering required ips/camera record rate (still unknown) and the general camera requirements and layout of those cameras (unknown) a distributed network of standalones might be a great solution (at least I have found it to sometimes be the case). Considering the cost of IP cameras, especially "specialty" cameras, the potential limitation on record rate, and potential advantages of system distribution it's worth a look. I have put distributed 4, 8, or 16 camera embeded solutions up against NVR systems and often found advantages both in cost and performance - depends, of course, on the application.

 

Can you, without giving up "prospect" info tell us more about the application. General requirements including any "special" camera requirements like PTZ and/or low-light... and camera layout stuff (one building vs. many, indoor/outdoor, distances to one or more central locations? Also, will someone (like a guard) be monitoring or needing to control cameras and/or the system? More "application" info would help a lot!

[griffonsystems 0]

i agree with kr. with a nvr if the system goes down you lose all 60 cameras, if you have the cameras distributed on several dvrs then at most u lose 16 at a time. casinos with hundreds of cameras use 8channel and even 4 channel dvrs so i wouldnt just dismiss the dvr as an option

 

my 2 cents

[jpalazzi 0]

i dont mind doing multiple DVRS but the problem i think i would face is managing 60+ cameras on 4+ DVRs....what camera was on what DVR etc. Is there a solution for htat? will the DVR software allow you to view as many cameras on multiple DVRS?

[KrCCTV 0]

Appreciate your openness to the concept... and yeah, max 16 viewed simultaneous from any of the dvrs anywhere, grouped logically to come up on a single mouse click. Oh... and management - well you might divided the building in to 4 equal quadrants and run cams logically from there to that quadrant's DVR if things can lay out that way. "On DVR screen" labeling helps - 1/1 is DVR 1, cam 1... 2/5 is DVR2, cam 5... But back to the real question - - is it the right solution? This is the really difficult part where lots of folks seem to struggle... where one actually has to "think ... ahead ... of .... time." Still interested in answers to my earlier questions. I'm not trying to sell you on an approach but rather solve a problem. The proper approach will sell itself if it fits. Should you tell me that you don't need but a few frames per per camera per second recorded... all indoors... the most basic picture with be totally good enough... no special lighting or lensing challenges... cameras are all-over-the-place with no good home runs anywhere (like one cam per class in 28 buildings spread over 14 miles) and you have 6 million feet of Cat5E stocked in your warehouse, a great network guru on staff with nothing to do... or free broadband coming out your ears... oh and a bunch of dirrerent users that you only want to allow access to one camera each through a browser interface - - gotta be a browser interface!! Well then... man... I'm gonna recommend a bunch of 2100's and an NVR for sure. If i'm wrong about the application maybe you can clear that up without divulging stuff to protect your interests... you know.

[jpalazzi 0]

Well my application is pretty basic.

 

It is a bar scene with low light. I do have some outdoor IR cameras for the front door and back patio area. They are interested in watching the doors, cash registers, they also want to make sure everything goes okay if there is a band or DJ meaning if there is a fight etc. For the most part they are interested in watching for stealing. The bar is fairly large. One is around 3400 sq.ft and I proposed around 22 cameras and the second is going to be 60+ cameras. The square footage is a lot larger I would say roughly 6K Sq ft, but its broken up pretty good.

 

Right now both bars have seperate internet connectivity, but we are going on getting a site to site VPN or maybe some fiber between them.

 

They also have 3-4 other small bars that already have CCTV and are using Dedicated Micros DVRs (which I am not a big fan of).

 

I would like to proposed monitor the cash register with some sort of RS232 interface.

 

We are an IT company by trade that specializes in data security. We are slowly getting into CCTV and Access Control due to demand from customers. I have a strong back ground in physical security and i would a decent one in smaller 4-16 cameras CCTV installs.

 

Let me know if that is enough information.

[KrCCTV 0]

Thank you, thank you, thank you - - helps a lot! Now give me a little time to get some coffee in me and I'll have a thought or two for you (I'm sure some other folks will be able to do a lot with this too). Awesome start!!!

[Thomas 0]

Given your set up then you would want to use four seperate DVRs. You won't have anywhere near enough bandwith to handle that many IP cameras. You could feed the DVRs to a central location for monitoring. There are a number of options for viewing the DVR's, and most PC based DVRs and standalones have software to let you do multisite.

[jpalazzi 0]

what kind of bandwidth are you referring to?

[Thomas 0]

To feed 60 IP cameras or Axis video servers? I wouldn't try it on less then a full T3 on the incomming side. For this application I would suggest analog cameras into a local DVR with multisite software of some kind.

[jpalazzi 0]

interesting point i didnt even think about it.

 

Is there some sort of calculator or documentation on that fact.

 

thanks again.

[Thomas 0]

The general rule of thumb I use is between 1.5 Mb/s and 2.5 Mb/s per camera. They work great if I have a seperate gigabit internal network. So it's doable to stream to a DVR (an NVR is the same thing) and then let the DVR handle the stream to a multi-site applications.

[kandcorp 0]

Good little Conversion table and bandwidth calculator:

 

http://www.ibeast.com/content/tools/band-calc.asp

[Daryl733 0]

Well..

I've done it using multiple 4-16 channels DVR.

The software client that comes together with it enables you to do multiple dvr mangement, creating virtual dvrs as well.

Can connect up to 300 DVR at one time, viewing up to 64 cameras in a single screen at one time.

You'll be able to mix and match cameras from various dvr to form a virtual DVR. Cameras and dvr can be swap, added in using drag and drop method.

 

Check out the dvr here.. http://www.sleek.com.sg

For the mpeg4 models, you'll be able to do do dvr time synchronisation from a single master dvr, enabling you to have synchronised timing across various dvr.

 

For pricing, email me.

Prices range between ard USD$500 to USD$2000.

10 different models. From MJPEG to MPEG4. Frame rate up to full 400/480(PAL/NTSC) recording. Display refresh all live.

[KrCCTV 0]

I've got some great units too... all much better quality for less money.

 

For pricing, email me.

Prices range between MC$100 to MC$200.

25 different models.

_________________

Prices Posted are MSRP the Moon in accordance with guideline. Appearently some people are not that comfortable due to maybe difficulty in making "will call" or whatever on the Moon (we don't ship). No more exact model prices posting. If you really want to know, PM me,