NVR Software - Expensive

[Quantum 0]

I've been trying to find decent NVR software, but it's just too expensive. I'd much rather it run on Linux, but if necessary I can create a VM for Windows.

 

ExacqVision runs on Linux, but only runs on Debian (not RedHat), but crucially is only 32bit. Plus not only is there a base fee, but annual per-camera licenses. Milestone only runs on Winduhs, and it also has a base fee, but annual per-camera licenses. HikVision are clearly incompetent at making NVR software.

 

Are there any quality NVR systems that don't have per-camera or per-year license fees? This is just for my 2 camera house, and maybe also for my 2 camera car.

[thewireguys 3]

Most all professional VMS software runs on Windows. Also most VMS solutions have recurring fees but not all.

 

http://www.networkoptix.com runs on Windows and Linix. You have a license fee and nothing recurring

http://www.Avigilon.com runs on Windows only and you have a licenses fee but nothing recurring.

[ak357 0]

I've been trying to find decent NVR software, but it's just too expensive. I'd much rather it run on Linux, but if necessary I can create a VM for Windows.

 

ExacqVision runs on Linux, but only runs on Debian (not RedHat), but crucially is only 32bit. Plus not only is there a base fee, but annual per-camera licenses. Milestone only runs on Winduhs, and it also has a base fee, but annual per-camera licenses. HikVision are clearly incompetent at making NVR software.

 

Are there any quality NVR systems that don't have per-camera or per-year license fees? This is just for my 2 camera house, and maybe also for my 2 camera car.

All u need couple Avigilon Core Lic to be very happy

[Quantum 0]

I thought Avigilon was very exclusive? How would I buy, and how much?

 

Will it work with Hiks?

[ericq 0]

You can purchase from any Avigilon dealer like the wireguys or ak357 and yes it does support Hiks IP Cameras along with motion detection.

[jeromephone 6]

Not everyone likes it but Geovision does have nvr that has many features and if you use their cameras there is no license fee. Look on their website and you can download the nvr software as well as other info. We used a lot of geo over the years mainly due to licensing fees from other brands would put us out of contention on bids.

[ssmith10pn 0]

So what motivates developers to constantly improve and fix free software?

Think about that for a second.

[jeromephone 6]

my guess would be that the free software that many different cameras mfgs supply would be to push sales of their hardware.

[mkkoskin 0]

Ksenos (http://www.ksenos.com) runs also on Linux, CentOS 6.

One time fee per, per camera license (1 camera with limited recording space without license for testing, demo license for full features and 16 cameras for 90 days just by asking).

Runs as an NVR with GUI or as a headless machine with web UI or client access.

[weebs 0]

Does anyone have experience with Blue Iris? It's Widows based but the full version can support up to 64 cameras and can operate on a 64 bit system for $59.99.

 

edit: maybe not, sounds like you are required to pay $60 each time a new upgrade comes out

[Dan9527 0]

we use ILDVR NVR Software, linux OS, $10 per camera, all the lifetime. ILDVR is good.

[Quantum 0]

You can purchase from any Avigilon dealer like the wireguys or ak357 and yes it does support Hiks IP Cameras along with motion detection.

Thanks, but neither of them will respond.

 

Any other options?

[thewireguys 3]

You can purchase from any Avigilon dealer like the wireguys or ak357 and yes it does support Hiks IP Cameras along with motion detection.

Thanks, but neither of them will respond.

 

Any other options?

 

I checked my inbox and I don't have any messages from you. I really hate turning business down but we are slammed with installs right now so I would recommend working with another Avigilon partner like AK357 for this project.

[dalepres 0]

I've tried every NVR program I have been able to find for Windows. If I could find a quality tool in a paid version, even if it cost a thousand dollars - perhaps even a little more than that - I would buy it but, in my opinion, they're all crap.

 

Of all the programs I have tried, Blue Iris, by very far, had the worst performance. On my older PC that ran every other program I tried fairly well, Blue Iris would use 100% CPU. I built a new i7 quad core box and Blue Iris would run on it but would use 30% CPU utilization with just 2 cameras at 3MP. I stopped testing at about 47% utilization with 4 cameras. There were several apps I tried that run 13 cameras under 20% and one even under 10% CPU utilization so Blue Iris went completely off my list. Now I'm using a dual-xeon, 8 cores per CPU (plus hyperthreading for a total of 32 threads) with 128GB RAM but I'm not even going to try Blue Iris on it.

 

I tried Avigilon and found it's UI to be very unusual. It's not like it's unworkable; it's just not what you'd expect. The way it boxes various cameras on the screen seemed pretty unintuitive based on my experience but it did work. Perhaps, over time, I would get used to the UI and even understand the value in why they built the UI the way they did. The problem I had was that it still used more CPU than the best of what I tried but it took everything I threw at it in the way of cameras and demand on those cameras without missing a beat. I was impressed enough that I was about to buy it but I had just a couple questions before I made the commitment. Since I was using the trial version, neither Avigilon nor the dealers would help to answer my question. That proved to me that I would continue to get poor service. As a home user, once I bought the app once they have no expectation to ever get any more money from me so why would they care to support me? I took them off my list.

 

I wanted to try IPCENT. Their package looked pretty good but you have to buy it through the Windows Store for Windows 8 and above - it doesn't work with Windows 7. I don't buy from the Windows Store because I refuse to give Microsoft my personally identifiable information so I can purchase products from places that are not Microsoft. And I hate the metro app look and feel.

 

I tried the Hikvision software - free with Hikvision cameras but many Hikvision compatibles are available and they ship the software as well. It works pretty well. I don't like the way it treats every camera as a possible multi-camera recorder or server so every camera has to go in a folder. Adding the cameras is pretty spotty; sometimes it will only add the first camera and won't remember any future cameras. I've had to upgrade the software a few times to get to a reliable place but it seems ok now. Now that it is working, it's been rock solid, as have been the cameras. The problem with Hikvision is that it is the second highest CPU utilization - but still less than half of Blue Iris. There are two processes. The process that is labeled Hikvision uses only a percent or two but there's a server process running that the Hikvision process is dependent on that, with my 13 cameras, uses up to 30% CPU. That's not terrible and if I didn't know there were many apps that do so much better I would have been very happy with the Hikvision software.

 

The very best performing software is free UC software that comes with several brands of Chinese imports based on the TI-365/368 chipset. I'v run all 6 of my compatible cameras - and as many as 9 when I had others on the bench, testing for a different location, and most at 3MP, full record, with under 10% CPU utilization. The problem with UC is that it doesn't work with anyone else's cameras. Hikvision has this problem but I'm not averse to going all Hikvision or Hikvision compatible. So if you buy the cameras UC works with, it may be the best performing but it's a struggle to get email and ftp working. Otherwise, and other than the ugly green borders, this is a great app. But I didn't want to be tied to one brand no matter what the brand. No one maker has all the camera types I want at any price. So I'm working on replacing my UC compatible cameras as they fail (3 years old before the first one did) or when I just feel like replacing one with a HUISUN PTZ.

 

There were a few other high-end apps I used that I tossed out, the names of which escape me for now.

 

The best, overall, of the free apps that came with the various camera brands is one simply named CMS published by JuFeng. I got it with a Sunba speed dome. CMS takes any ONVIF camera I have thrown at it. It has a limitation that it can only display 1080p max resolution but for monitoring that's fine. That means, though, that I need to use my other recorders and I don't use CMS for recording. What I haven't tried is displaying 1080p or less but trying to record at full resolution. I haven't tried because I have several other recorders already. It might work in which case this would be even better. My opinion, though, is that I don't record where I watch because a criminal may see where I watch. If he steals the PC running my monitoring software then he's stolen the recording. Viewing and recording are always separate tasks for me though you could use the viewing station as tertiary or other recording. This is what I use at about half of my monitoring stations.

 

I've also used Synology Surveillance Station. If you turn the NAS on to record cameras and leave it alone, it mostly works. A neighbor asked me once if I had caught anything on my camera after their car had been broken into and when I checked I found my Synology had dropped the connection to all three cameras at that location without notification. I didn't even realize I had no recording there. I quit buying the silly per-camera licenses and have quit using Surveillance station on all 4 of my Synology devices. I use them for NAS storage only and let PCs record to them as tertiary recording - never primary or secondary. The ActiveX based web client for Synology runs at about 80% CPU utilization with just 8 cameras. I quit using it for monitoring before testing beyond that. I don't recommend Synology almost as much as I don't recommend Blue Iris.

 

There is a very big surprise, to me at least, in the NVR space - both recording and monitoring. There's a mini-nvr thread, or threads, here about some under-100 dollar mini NVRs. I think I paid about 65 dollars each for the several I have. I've tested the 16-channel version with up to only 13 cameras - which is all I have needed them for. They record great to the 2TB internal 2.5" drive (sold extra) and I have read where people use them with eSata or USB drives; I haven't tried it. The IE app works with or without ActiveX. I've had it running over a month at a time without any hickups. The only thing that makes it stop is me stopping it to do something on one of the PCs. I use them for secondary and tertiary recording in multiple locations. Honestly, either with a direct connect computer monitor, keyboard, and mouse, or as a remote connection by PC with IE for viewing, this is a great and inexpensive option for viewing and recording your cameras.

 

I hope this helps some readers in choosing a suitable solution for them.

[dalepres 0]

I was just reading my own post. The real lesson in it isn't which recorder or software to buy or not buy. The real lesson is something I've said many times. If you read all the time and money I have spent trying different software, different cameras - I started with analog and soon after went all digital. I've wasted thousands of dollars and hundreds of hours - but with my technical background and personality type, it was all fun for me. For most people, they're much better off going to a pro. You won't save money on a basic system by doing it yourself if you do all the trial and error I have done. The pro may not use the brands we know, or maybe they do. But their advantage is that they know the brands they use inside and out. That's how they save all the time and money I spent.

 

Unless you're an ENTJ like me and, by nature, you have to do everything there is to do, just once, you might be better off calling one of the vendors here.

[ak357 0]

I was just reading my own post. The real lesson in it isn't which recorder or software to buy or not buy. The real lesson is something I've said many times. If you read all the time and money I have spent trying different software, different cameras - I started with analog and soon after went all digital. I've wasted thousands of dollars and hundreds of hours - but with my technical background and personality type, it was all fun for me. For most people, they're much better off going to a pro. You won't save money on a basic system by doing it yourself if you do all the trial and error I have done. The pro may not use the brands we know, or maybe they do. But their advantage is that they know the brands they use inside and out. That's how they save all the time and money I spent.

 

Unless you're an ENTJ like me and, by nature, you have to do everything there is to do, just once, you might be better off calling one of the vendors here.

 

Here is example for you

Avigilon server with 24 2MP cameras

[ak357 0]

And if you still have ??? about Avigilon

maybe I can try to help you

[Quantum 0]

Very useful, comprehensive, and helpful post dalepres. This is unusual, but matches my type of posts when I've studied a subject. I'm also one who has to learn everything about everything before I do anything, but you've saved me alot here.

 

Well, either wireguys and ak357 websites have malfunctioned, or they both have too much business to have responded, I'll move on.

 

I've heard that Hik's software is obtuse so I didn't bother, but now I'll try it. But first I will try https://ksenos.fi/ and http://www.networkoptix.com/nxwitness/#connect to see how they behave. I'll let you know.

[thewireguys 3]

I tried Avigilon and found it's UI to be very unusual. It's not like it's unworkable; it's just not what you'd expect. The way it boxes various cameras on the screen seemed pretty unintuitive based on my experience but it did work. Perhaps, over time, I would get used to the UI and even understand the value in why they built the UI the way they did. The problem I had was that it still used more CPU than the best of what I tried but it took everything I threw at it in the way of cameras and demand on those cameras without missing a beat. I was impressed enough that I was about to buy it but I had just a couple questions before I made the commitment. Since I was using the trial version, neither Avigilon nor the dealers would help to answer my question. That proved to me that I would continue to get poor service. As a home user, once I bought the app once they have no expectation to ever get any more money from me so why would they care to support me? I took them off my list.

 

Interesting feedback. For your future reference Avigilon offers FREE 24/7 phone support to dealers and end users. Most other VMS platforms do not offer this or they charge a lot of money to access support. Avigilon's support is very good and will answer any questions you have.

 

When it comes to professional VMS software Avigilon is very light on CPU resources including the both the client and server side of the software. We have one system with 230 camera streams coming into one server and the CPU is less than 20% utilization.

 

As far as the UI we and our customers find it is very intuitive to the point where most customer don't even need training to start viewing live and recorded video. When you start showing customers some of the advanced tools on how you can search days/weeks/months of recorded video for people and vehicles only and get this results in seconds they are always impressed. If you have any specific questions I will do by best to answer them as time allows.

[Boogieman 1]

Very useful, comprehensive, and helpful post dalepres. This is unusual, but matches my type of posts when I've studied a subject. I'm also one who has to learn everything about everything before I do anything, but you've saved me alot here.

 

Well, either wireguys and ak357 websites have malfunctioned, or they both have too much business to have responded, I'll move on.

 

I've heard that Hik's software is obtuse so I didn't bother, but now I'll try it. But first I will try https://ksenos.fi/ and http://www.networkoptix.com/nxwitness/#connect to see how they behave. I'll let you know.

 

 

I would take everything dalepres says with a HUGE grain of salt, regrading all the vms options he mentions. He obviously did not test them properly. All I see is user error.

Here is just one example. He never states the "i7" he used with blue iris or whether he set it up properly. There is a huge variations between i7 processors. He also did not build an i7 box. He bought an i7 laptop.By reading the blue iris help file, he would learn that you must set the cameras to record direct to disc (which doesnt rencode the video) if you are using high res cams. Blue iris also supports hardware acceleration when used with intel HD graphics that support quicksync. He states he was hitting 30 percent utilization with only 2 3mp cameras. Well then how am I getting 22 percent on an i7-4770 system with 7x3mp dahuas, 3x2mp hikvisions and one cheap vga camera. Is it magic? I get similar results with my many other systems.

So, bottom line is his "reviews" are worthless. This includes his "review" of Avignon - a great piece of software. Its unfortunate that incompetent users leave baseless "reviews".

[ssmith10pn 0]

I sent Wireguys a test PM and he responded within 10 minutes.

 

Maybe this clown should have just picked up the phone.

[Boogieman 1]

I was just reading my own post. The real lesson in it isn't which recorder or software to buy or not buy. The real lesson is something I've said many times. If you read all the time and money I have spent trying different software, different cameras - I started with analog and soon after went all digital. I've wasted thousands of dollars and hundreds of hours - but with my technical background and personality type, it was all fun for me. For most people, they're much better off going to a pro. You won't save money on a basic system by doing it yourself if you do all the trial and error I have done. The pro may not use the brands we know, or maybe they do. But their advantage is that they know the brands they use inside and out. That's how they save all the time and money I spent.

 

Unless you're an ENTJ like me and, by nature, you have to do everything there is to do, just once, you might be better off calling one of the vendors here.

 

Here is example for you

Avigilon server with 24 2MP cameras

For reference, what cpu is that?

[ak357 0]

For reference, what cpu is that?

System was built and delivered in 2012

I5 with 8 Gig of RAM

still working

[Boogieman 1]

For reference, what cpu is that?

System was built and delivered in 2012

I5 with 8 Gig of RAM

still working

Thats great!

[Quantum 0]

I sent Wireguys a test PM and he responded within 10 minutes.

 

Maybe this clown should have just picked up the phone.

Are you trying to make time with WireGuys, or are you just an impudent kid?

 

Don't expect respect if you don't give it.