Need Help : PTZ camera with POE

[teolisa 0]

Hello everyone. I'm Lisa from China. I worked as a sales in a company which professional manufacturing cctv cameras.

 

Recently there's a customer needs PTZ camers with POE. But I know a little about that. I think there're many friendly friend can help me of the cctv camera so I come here .

 

And I will come here to learn more day by day!

[Airick 0]

Hi Lisa.

 

POE standard 802.3af allows for 15W. Most PTZ cameras require more power than that. Now, a new standard, 802.3at allows for more power and I'm hoping that some new PTZs coming out will work on that standard. Until that time, I think we are out of luck.

 

I really hope somebody else comes along and can point out a PTZ that does work on POE.

[Maui Custom Surveillance 0]

Hello everyone. I'm Lisa from China. I worked as a sales in a company which professional manufacturing cctv cameras.

 

Recently there's a customer needs PTZ camers with POE. But I know a little about that. I think there're many friendly friend can help me of the cctv camera so I come here .

 

And I will come here to learn more day by day!

 

I run all my PTZ cameras using some kind of POE. This can be a built in feature of the camera, or you can customize the ethernet wire, or purchase POE adapters.

[teolisa 0]

Hi Lisa.

 

POE standard 802.3af allows for 15W. Most PTZ cameras require more power than that. Now, a new standard, 802.3at allows for more power and I'm hoping that some new PTZs coming out will work on that standard. Until that time, I think we are out of luck.

 

I really hope somebody else comes along and can point out a PTZ that does work on POE.

 

Thank you

[teolisa 0]

Hello everyone. I'm Lisa from China. I worked as a sales in a company which professional manufacturing cctv cameras.

 

Recently there's a customer needs PTZ camers with POE. But I know a little about that. I think there're many friendly friend can help me of the cctv camera so I come here .

 

And I will come here to learn more day by day!

 

I run all my PTZ cameras using some kind of POE. This can be a built in feature of the camera, or you can customize the ethernet wire, or purchase POE adapters.

Thank you very much

[kelvin 0]

Anyone can explain the POE full name and the definition?

 

I don really understand what is that

[Maui Custom Surveillance 0]

Anyone can explain the POE full name and the definition?

 

I don really understand what is that

 

"Power Over Ethernet".

 

Ethernet or CAT5, consists of four twisted-pair 24 gauge wires. Only two of the twisted-pair, (orange and green) carry data in ethernet configuration. This leaves the brown and the blue twisted-pair wires available to carry DC electrical current to a device such as a camera, a switch, or an access point.

 

I custom make all my ethernet to carry DC current on the brown and blue wires so I do not need to run an extra wire to power a camera, even if that camera is not POE capable.

[jisaac 0]

poe is great but most people dont have poe switches. It will be nice when they do. Extremely nice.

[kelvin 0]

I don really understand what is that

 

I custom make all my ethernet to carry DC current on the brown and blue wires so I do not need to run an extra wire to power a camera, even if that camera is not POE capable.

 

 

As i know in order to run cat5 with DC power and you have to apply using balun. So do you need any balun for youor custom made cat5?? if not need, mind to share how you do it?

[Maui Custom Surveillance 0]

I don really understand what is that

 

I custom make all my ethernet to carry DC current on the brown and blue wires so I do not need to run an extra wire to power a camera, even if that camera is not POE capable.

 

 

As i know in order to run cat5 with DC power and you have to apply using balun. So do you need any balun for youor custom made cat5?? if not need, mind to share how you do it?

 

Running 12 V DC, or even 24 V AC over a category five wire with balums for the purpose of powering and running analog cameras would not be called "POE", or power over ethernet, because it is not an ethernet wire when configured for analog cameras. POE expression is used exclusively for ethernet wire configured for network devices, such as IP cameras, access points, computers and so forth. This particular forum is dedicated to IP cameras.

[wfernley 0]

Doesn't POE distance also effect PTZ's. I have heard you can power PTZ cameras. however, if the distance from the POE power source is far from the camera, you can loose some functionality.

[Thomas 0]

The PoE standards suffer from voltage drop, like any other method of pushing power. But you'll reach the max limit of Cat5 before that becomes an issue.

[Souljah 0]

Anyone can explain the POE full name and the definition?

 

I don really understand what is that

 

"Power Over Ethernet".

 

Ethernet or CAT5, consists of four twisted-pair 24 gauge wires. Only two of the twisted-pair, (orange and green) carry data in ethernet configuration. This leaves the brown and the blue twisted-pair wires available to carry DC electrical current to a device such as a camera, a switch, or an access point.

 

I custom make all my ethernet to carry DC current on the brown and blue wires so I do not need to run an extra wire to power a camera, even if that camera is not POE capable.

 

That is one hell of a way to ghetto it. Im guessing your getting quite a bit of CRC and frame errors too.

[Maui Custom Surveillance 0]

Anyone can explain the POE full name and the definition?

 

I don really understand what is that

 

"Power Over Ethernet".

 

Ethernet or CAT5, consists of four twisted-pair 24 gauge wires. Only two of the twisted-pair, (orange and green) carry data in ethernet configuration. This leaves the brown and the blue twisted-pair wires available to carry DC electrical current to a device such as a camera, a switch, or an access point.

 

I custom make all my ethernet to carry DC current on the brown and blue wires so I do not need to run an extra wire to power a camera, even if that camera is not POE capable.

 

That is one hell of a way to ghetto it. Im guessing your getting quite a bit of CRC and frame errors too.

 

Why would I get any errors? If you comprehend my procedure, then you would know there would be no more errors than any device using a POE adapter. If you are insinuating you actually know something about networking, then why not just come out and clearly state what you think is wrong with my cable conversions, and why you think it couldn't possibly work. So far I have a 50 plus success rate with no failures on these conversions.

[Souljah 0]

Anyone can explain the POE full name and the definition?

 

I don really understand what is that

 

"Power Over Ethernet".

 

Ethernet or CAT5, consists of four twisted-pair 24 gauge wires. Only two of the twisted-pair, (orange and green) carry data in ethernet configuration. This leaves the brown and the blue twisted-pair wires available to carry DC electrical current to a device such as a camera, a switch, or an access point.

 

I custom make all my ethernet to carry DC current on the brown and blue wires so I do not need to run an extra wire to power a camera, even if that camera is not POE capable.

 

That is one hell of a way to ghetto it. Im guessing your getting quite a bit of CRC and frame errors too.

 

Why would I get any errors? If you comprehend my procedure, then you would know there would be no more errors than any device using a POE adapter. If you are insinuating you actually know something about networking, then why not just come out and clearly state what you think is wrong with my cable conversions, and why you think it couldn't possibly work. So far I have a 50 plus success rate with no failures on these conversions.

 

Ever heard of the 802.3af standard? lol. If you think its all good to split your pairs like that, then by all means go for it.

 

As for a good PTZ with PoE, I prefer the Panasonic WV-NS202. It does MJPEG as well as MPEG-4.. and is day/night. You can set quite a bit of presets with the capability of utilizing triggers. It also accepts SD cards for storage, and has SDIII capability as well. Plus it has a built in microphone with a line output for hooking up an external speaker.

[Maui Custom Surveillance 0]

Anyone can explain the POE full name and the definition?

 

I don really understand what is that

 

"Power Over Ethernet".

 

Ethernet or CAT5, consists of four twisted-pair 24 gauge wires. Only two of the twisted-pair, (orange and green) carry data in ethernet configuration. This leaves the brown and the blue twisted-pair wires available to carry DC electrical current to a device such as a camera, a switch, or an access point.

 

I custom make all my ethernet to carry DC current on the brown and blue wires so I do not need to run an extra wire to power a camera, even if that camera is not POE capable.

 

That is one hell of a way to ghetto it. Im guessing your getting quite a bit of CRC and frame errors too.

 

Why would I get any errors? If you comprehend my procedure, then you would know there would be no more errors than any device using a POE adapter. If you are insinuating you actually know something about networking, then why not just come out and clearly state what you think is wrong with my cable conversions, and why you think it couldn't possibly work. So far I have a 50 plus success rate with no failures on these conversions.

 

Ever heard of the 802.3af standard? lol. If you think its all good to split your pairs like that, then by all means go for it.

 

As for a good PTZ with PoE, I prefer the Panasonic WV-NS202. It does MJPEG as well as MPEG-4.. and is day/night. You can set quite a bit of presets with the capability of utilizing triggers. It also accepts SD cards for storage, and has SDIII capability as well. Plus it has a built in microphone with a line output for hooking up an external speaker.

 

Well, obviously I'm not using the 802.3af standard.

 

There are basically three methods of sending PoE on the ethernet cable:

 

"First type of PoE, using "spare" wire pairs. The Unshielded Twisted Pair wiring (UTP) for ethernet has 8 wires, twisted in 4 pairs. Ethernet connects to only two pairs for data, leaving the other two free. Simply using the "spare" pairs is the hands-down most economical and efficient way to do PoE. But, beware of incompatible standards for polarity and voltage, which vary from brand to brand. More info below. Beware also, some other devices, such as ordinary analog phones, may already be using the "spare" pairs in your network. Also, if you plug your laptop or some kind of non-PoE ethernet device into a port energized with PoE, it may or may not harm your devices. All homebrew and many commercial PoE devices use the "spare" pairs in UTP wiring, and it is the absolute fastest and easiest way to adapt a non-PoE device to use PoE.

Second type of PoE, using "data" wires. The IEEE (Institute for Electrical and Electronics Engineers), same folks who standardized Ethernet itself, standardized PoE in June 2003. The IEEE 802.3af standard uses the same "data" pairs as ethernet, leaving the "spare" pairs free. This PoE adds DC power to the data pairs using signal transformers, and pickes off power at the far end the same way. A comprehensive set of technical standards for Power Sourcing Equipment (PSE) and Powered Devices (PD) create an "idiot proof" system protected from shorted wiring, polarity reversal, or accidentally plugging in non-PoE equipment. IEEE 802.3af is technically complex and best implemented with power management chips specially designed for the purpose, supplied by Dallas, Maxim, Linear Technology, Texas Instruments, and others, that are intended to be embedded into the PoE devices themselves. Expect PoE device makers using their own standard to migrate to IEEE 802.3af in the future.

Third type of PoE is a combination of the two. The new IEEE 802.3af standard alternatively allows the "spare" wire pairs to be energized, to be compatible with both types of wiring. You may mix 802.3af with older or homebrew PoE devices, but the result may not be "idiot proof". If your mixed network has only PoE sources that are IEEE 802.3af compliant, your mixed network is pretty safe from damage, but older devices may or may not operate correctly. This mixed PoE allows brands to migrate to the common standard."

 

http://www.altair.org/labnotes_POE.html

[Souljah 0]

"Also, if you plug your laptop or some kind of non-PoE ethernet device into a port energized with PoE, it may or may not harm your devices."

 

No, it WILL hurt your non-PoE devices. Theres a reason it states "Power over Ethernet." The 802.3af standard was created to protect non-PoE devices that are plugged into a PoE port. 802.3af works by detecting if the remote devices requires Power.. it simply does not just send raw power across the cable. It will not transmit power until the end device and the switch negotiate power is necessary.

 

Running raw power across those extra pairs is definately not the right way to do it.. I gaurantee any PoE camera manufacturer will not support your method for injecting power.

 

But if you feel comfortable doing it, by all means go ahead.. just let me know how many seconds it takes for your PC's NIC to start smoking.

[Maui Custom Surveillance 0]

"Also, if you plug your laptop or some kind of non-PoE ethernet device into a port energized with PoE, it may or may not harm your devices."

 

No, it WILL hurt your non-PoE devices. Theres a reason it states "Power over Ethernet." The 802.3af standard was created to protect non-PoE devices that are plugged into a PoE port. 802.3af works by detecting if the remote devices requires Power.. it simply does not just send raw power across the cable. It will not transmit power until the end device and the switch negotiate power is necessary.

 

Running raw power across those extra pairs is definately not the right way to do it.. I gaurantee any PoE camera manufacturer will not support your method for injecting power.

 

But if you feel comfortable doing it, by all means go ahead.. just let me know how many seconds it takes for your PC's NIC to start smoking.

 

You still don't get it do you

 

I splice open the category five wire at both ends and cut the brown and blue wires and attach to them a male plug on one end for the camera, and the DC power adapter to the other end. In other words, there is never any power going through the RJ-45 Jack, no possibility of harming any device unless of course I get the polarity wrong.

[rory 0]

I splice open the category five wire at both ends and cut the brown and blue wires and attach to them a male plug on one end for the camera, and the DC power adapter to the other end. In other words, there is never any power going through the RJ-45 Jack, no possibility of harming any device unless of course I get the polarity wrong.

 

Just using the cat5 spare pairs for standard 12vdc power right?

[Maui Custom Surveillance 0]

I splice open the category five wire at both ends and cut the brown and blue wires and attach to them a male plug on one end for the camera, and the DC power adapter to the other end. In other words, there is never any power going through the RJ-45 Jack, no possibility of harming any device unless of course I get the polarity wrong.

 

Just using the cat5 spare pairs for standard 12vdc power right?

 

That is correct

[ak357 0]

I splice open the category five wire at both ends and cut the brown and blue wires and attach to them a male plug on one end for the camera, and the DC power adapter to the other end. In other words, there is never any power going through the RJ-45 Jack, no possibility of harming any device unless of course I get the polarity wrong.

 

Just using the cat5 spare pairs for standard 12vdc power right?

 

That is correct

 

What is your experience with Max length,voltage loses and current drop ?

[rikky 0]

any experiences with PTZ domes including fan / heater ??

Mostly it are these add-ons which are power consuming.

[lynndiwagon 0]

Something you might not know.....the POE switch outputs 48VDC. The end device regulates that down to the required operating voltage, internally. This would probably allow some voltage drop on the CAT pair before you reached the needed voltage for the end device. POE injectors are located at the far end and accept a RJ45 with a continuing RJ45 to the camera. Internal to this device is a regulator, usually switchable between 5 or 12VDC to feed the cameras external power connector. This way you can use a non POE camera with a POE switch.

[CollinR 0]

I splice open the category five wire at both ends and cut the brown and blue wires and attach to them a male plug on one end for the camera, and the DC power adapter to the other end. In other words, there is never any power going through the RJ-45 Jack, no possibility of harming any device unless of course I get the polarity wrong.

 

Just using the cat5 spare pairs for standard 12vdc power right?

 

That is correct

 

What is your experience with Max length,voltage loses and current drop ?

 

It's super crappy. I still double up with 18-2 for the most part. I wouldn't even think about using it with a PTZ.

 

It does actually work fine for alot of stuff though.

 

 

EDIT:

 

If you were asking about REAL POE rather then using Cat5 as a power cable it's not a problem. 40VDC will go the 300' maximum for ethernet.

[btsforklift 0]

Sometimes an adapter of some sort is in order. PanOptic Technology makes quite a few elegant solutions for providing power to both PoE and non-PoE devices over Cat-5 cabling:

http://www.panoptictechnology.com/network-smart-adapters/