wireless system to watch mare foaling Urgent help needed

[peanut 0]

Hi

I have just 2 weeks to install a simple cheap wireless cctv system in a stable yard so that my friend can monitor (during the nighttime) a mare that is due to foal anytime soon

 

Heres the problem

 

The horse box is approx 80-100 feet away from the monitoring position at the end of a series of solid brick built stables ajacent to the house. There is no clear line of sight between the foaling stable and house.

 

I can hardwire the length of the stable block say 80 feet but the last 30 feet across a gap between the stables and the house must be wireless.

 

I have tried one of the cheap wireless cctv systems off ebay with the IR bullet cam and can get reasonable wireless picture on a portable tv at the far end of the stable block ie 80 feet or so.

Any further and I lose picture completly when it has to pass across a 2o foot gap and then 10 foot further through the brick walls of two rooms of the house.

 

What options do I have ?

[CollinR 0]

Why can't you trench the last 30 feet?

 

You can do this wirelessly however it's cost will be quite a bit higher.

[peanut 0]

Hi

I can't trench it because the stables yard is 6" concrete besides the place is a 300 years old Stately home and grade 1 listed

 

I had thought about hard wiring the camera the length of the stable block then using a video TX RX across the 30 foot gap plugged straight into the TV .

I might try it tomorrow see what kind of signal loss there is.

can't post complete link so add www etc

 

maplin.co.uk/Module.aspx?ModuleNo=44469&&source=14&doy=search

[marzsit 0]

I can hardwire the length of the stable block say 80 feet but the last 30 feet across a gap between the stables and the house must be wireless.

 

I have tried one of the cheap wireless cctv systems off ebay with the IR bullet cam and can get reasonable wireless picture on a portable tv at the far end of the stable block ie 80 feet or so.

Any further and I lose picture completly when it has to pass across a 2o foot gap and then 10 foot further through the brick walls of two rooms of the house.

 

 

can you hardwire the 80 feet down the length of the stable block and place the wireless receiever down there? if it's the kind of cheap camera setup i'm thinking of, you should be able to power it via rg59 siamese if you don't have power at that end of the building. the downside is that the cable will probably cost more than the camera

[peanut 0]

fortunatly I do have power for the camera from a light fitting . I don't have any screened cable yet . Does it need to be any special cable ?

[marzsit 0]

for an 80 foot run you could use regular rg59 coax, which is reasonably inexpensive. for the best image quality and lowest loss, rg6 would be better..

[peanut 0]

thanks. The camera I'm using is one of these $25 cheap ones so little point in spending megabucks on cable I guess.

I'm hoping to go have a try out this Sat so will report back with results. Thanks

[CollinR 0]

for the best image quality and lowest loss, rg6 would be better..

 

 

Don't listen to that, 99% of RG6 is aluminum and NOT DESIREABLE for CCTV use. RG6 is designed for higher frequency digital signals used by cable companies.

 

RG59u with a 95% (or +) copper briad coverage and a solid copper core is the wire you should use.

[marzsit 0]

for the best image quality and lowest loss, rg6 would be better..

 

 

Don't listen to that, 99% of RG6 is aluminum and NOT DESIREABLE for CCTV use. RG6 is designed for higher frequency digital signals used by cable companies.

 

didn't know that.. about 80% of the coax running around the plant where i work is rg6...

[CollinR 0]

If it's RG6u copper you have no problems however the RG6QS normally found at Lowes/Home Depot is always aluminum with aluminum. It's not really like my post portrayed it, you just have to be picky with RG6 to not get aluminum. Yes it will actually function for the most part though so it's not like you won't get a picture at all if you use it. So you can get the correct RG6 from a wholesaler (99% special order) but normal DIY people won't have easy access to it.

 

You can also use RG11u for ~30% increase intransmission distance over RG59u. RG6u can go even further.

 

 

 

You can test your cable by looking at it. The braid should look like copper (gold color) and the center conductor should too. All the way through, whittle a little and see if it has an aluminum or steel core with copper cladding. You want solid copper, it sucks too cause copper ain't cheap.

[WirelessEye 0]

It's a double edged sword. Copper is through the roof on pricing which makes it expensive as installers. At the same time, I get a lot of jobs because copper is being stolen off of properties-- because it's so expensive. Funny how that works.

[peanut 0]

surely its not worth spending 100 bucks on the cable then stick a 20 dollar camera on one end and a 50 $ tv on the other ? any cable has got to give a better picture than wireless

[CollinR 0]

Don't be so sure of that.

 

I've had some 1500p cams running wireless before, no problems in the picture quality dept.

 

 

 

Did you know you can take a piece of pipe and smash one end, use a waterhose to NPT adapter on the other. Hook up your water hoses and you have a crappy mini waterjet. That will blast through under the cement. Not the fastest way ever but it does work.

 

Thats how I do under sidewalks but I've also done wider spans as well.

[survtech 0]

for the best image quality and lowest loss, rg6 would be better..

 

 

Don't listen to that, 99% of RG6 is aluminum and NOT DESIREABLE for CCTV use. RG6 is designed for higher frequency digital signals used by cable companies.

 

didn't know that.. about 80% of the coax running around the plant where i work is rg6...

Not really true. Yes, a lot of RG-6 is for TV/CATV RF use but every manufacturer makes 100% copper center w/95% copper braid shield (CCTV quality) RG-6. Examples include West Penn 806 series (regular, plenum, direct burial, flooded burial and Aquaseal), Belden 533945 and many others.

 

However, that misses the point. For runs of 100 ft. or less, darned near anything will work - twisted-pair (Cat-anything), mini-coax, RG-59, even CATV cable with clad center and aluminum jacket. This is especially true for lower resolution cameras (ie. less than 400 lines). If you use a cheap wireless system for the last 20 ft., that will be the limiting factor for image quality, not the cable.

[marzsit 0]

If it's RG6u copper you have no problems however the RG6QS normally found at Lowes/Home Depot is always aluminum with aluminum. It's not really like my post portrayed it, you just have to be picky with RG6 to not get aluminum. Yes it will actually function for the most part though so it's not like you won't get a picture at all if you use it. So you can get the correct RG6 from a wholesaler (99% special order) but normal DIY people won't have easy access to it.

 

You can also use RG11u for ~30% increase intransmission distance over RG59u. RG6u can go even further.

 

 

 

You can test your cable by looking at it. The braid should look like copper (gold color) and the center conductor should too. All the way through, whittle a little and see if it has an aluminum or steel core with copper cladding. You want solid copper, it sucks too cause copper ain't cheap.

 

i took a close look at our rg6 coax tonight.. the stuff close to the ground that i could get to easily and what we have on the bulk reels.. happily, it is all copper-braid belden rg6u not aluminum foil shielded cable. it was bought thru north coast electric, an industrial supplier. i never really looked at it too closely before because it's only used on the exterior camera runs which we never have to modify.. but we were told that it was used there at that time because it's the lowest loss cable for long runs. we only move things around inside the buildings where we use rg59 on short (less than 100') runs.

 

i was worried that i was going to be replacing about 4k feet of difficult-to-reach coax sometime in the near future...

[marzsit 0]

Did you know you can take a piece of pipe and smash one end, use a waterhose to NPT adapter on the other. Hook up your water hoses and you have a crappy mini waterjet. That will blast through under the cement. Not the fastest way ever but it does work.

 

Thats how I do under sidewalks but I've also done wider spans as well.

 

at home depot in the underground sprinker department, orbit makes a kit designed for doing just this procedure for about $6. it's a pair of pvc fittings, a female garden hose connector and a special high-pressure waterjet fitting that you solvent-weld to any length of 1" pvc pipe. the idea is to use it once to get the pipe under the concrete then cut the fittings off when installing sprinklers, but it's easy to withdraw the "drilling rig" and re-insert whatever conduit you wish to use, saving the unit for another job. the jet fitting does a very good job of drilling without wasting too much water, and it's reasonably fast too. i've installed many sprinkler systems using them and they do work well.

[peanut 0]

 

 

 

However, that misses the point. For runs of 100 ft. or less, darned near anything will work - twisted-pair (Cat-anything), mini-coax, RG-59, even CATV cable with clad center and aluminum jacket. This is especially true for lower resolution cameras (ie. less than 400 lines). If you use a cheap wireless system for the last 20 ft., that will be the limiting factor for image quality, not the cable.

 

thanks thats a sensible appraisal. I'll try the sheilded audio cable I already have and see how thatlooks. No point in shelling out for a drum of top of the range cable for this job its only needed for a week for the foaling . Thanks

[survtech 0]

Sheilded audio cable? No, I wouldn't recommend that. Although this is not a critical application, you still need to use a cable with the correct impedance (75 ohms for coax). Audio cable will probably give ghosting and other problems.

 

Sorry, I didn't mean that you could use anything, you just don't need RG-6.

 

By the way, to bridge the gap, have you thought about stringing the cable overhead? I've used antenna guy wire between two buildings and hung the transmission cable from that with loose wire ties or good electrical tape before.

[peanut 0]

Sheilded audio cable? No, I wouldn't recommend that. Although this is not a critical application, you still need to use a cable with the correct impedance (75 ohms for coax). Audio cable will probably give ghosting and other problems.

 

Sorry, I didn't mean that you could use anything, you just don't need RG-6.

 

By the way, to bridge the gap, have you thought about stringing the cable overhead? I've used antenna guy wire between two buildings and hung the transmission cable from that with loose wire ties or good electrical tape before.

 

No overhead possible as it would be too difficult to take cable up staircase through two offices and through sitting room. Landlord wouldn't allow that is why it has to be wireless. The audio/video cable I plan to use is the same as the cable supplied with the wireless camera. it is standard phono to connect receiver to PC /monitor video imput

[survtech 0]

Well, it's worth a try. I would lay the approximate length of wire that you plan to use on the ground and hook it up temporarily first before running it permanently. That way you will see if it causes any problems with the video.

[scorpion 0]

Good idea to pretest the wire by running along the ground for a mock up. I would be very leary doing this because I would be afraid of a horse tripping on the wire. But then they may trip while you are trenching, you know murphy's law!

 

Here is some advice for others.

 

TRENCHING PROJECT FOR DO IT YOURSELFERS

 

Take your shovel stomp it in the ground as deep as you can, pull it out place it next to your "trench" stomp it deep, and continue till you get close to the destination. When you go to bury the wire, lay the wire along your trench and shove a 3 foot or 4 foot 3/4 plastic pipe over the wire and then stick the end of the conduit in to the "trench" facing up and "push" or "pull" the conduit. When you have practised and have got this technique down it should leave the wire buried in the trench. When you are done you can pull the wire up and out and reuse it for other projects. Ask your local cable tv installer how to do this technique.

 

WARNING: This is not recommended for permanent installations! This is only for covert installs for private detective cases, law enforcement cases or short term surveillance. Check your local codes for how deep to bury it. Watch out for sprinkler pipes etc. You may need some tools to chop large roots or prey you do not need to use a chain saw to cut huge roots!

 

Please read the available posts and educate yourself. Ask the pros. You may hear them say bury the wire in plastic conduit. Good advice! Protect the wire as much as you can! There are those that use Sprinkler tubing for conduit. This is great because there are no breaks in your conduit allowing water intrusion if the glue technique fails with regular plastic conduit.

 

CURVES WITH CONDUIT

 

If your are running a long distance with conduit such as to a barn, boat dock, gazebo, or outbuilding try to use the conduit to make your turns. DO NOT USE 90 DEGREE ELBOWS! USE SWEPT ELBOWS. IF YOU CAN, DO NOT USE ANY ELBOWS AT ALL. The reason I say this is if down the road if you need to pull new wire for service it will be much easier to pull through the conduit. If you use 90 degree elbows you will never be able to pull that wire out of the conduit! Swept elbows will allow you to pull the wire through. This is dependent on how many elbows you have on your run. Try to use only two swept elbows. One coming up out of the ground at the house, and one coming up out of the ground at the destination end.

I know you dont need to do this, but do it for me when I come along in a few years for an upgrade!

 

If you are doing a gazebo, dock, etc have a box somewhere between coming up out of the ground and going to the camera. This will make repulling your wire much easier!

 

OVERHEAD CABLE RUNS

 

Watch your height, remember it is going to bow in the middle. If it is not mounted high up enough it may choke someone or as we say clothsline someone. Cable companies use a coax that has a siamese wire running with it. They place a round ring at each end of the wire and the ring goes in to a hook on the telephone pole and the other end hooks to the side of the house. This helps keep tension off the coax.

 

I apologize for deviating from the post but I just wanted to pass some advice to those not in the business who read these comments.

[peanut 0]

all very interesting skorpion I am sure but hardly relevant.

It has already been clearly established in the thread that trenching and overhead are both not possible in this project so I do not see the relevance of your post

[scorpion 0]

Thank you!

 

You are correct. I apologize. I did not mean to disrupt the postings.

 

I should be more clear when I write "advice for others". I know a lot of do it yourselfers read these post and I just wanted to have a bell go off because someone else had found a solution to their problem.

 

Again I apologize to those just starting out in the business for the first time, or the DIY that just needed a trick to save hiring a digging crew.

 

Thanks!

[CollinR 0]

Don't let them get to you for tring to help them. I know it's strange but some people really do think it's okay to complain when they get free advise from professionals. I just blackball them...

[scorpion 0]

Thanks!

 

He is the post author, I at least owe him that.

 

For others, at least I can take a flame. Is someone deserves it, I can throw it with the best of them! If you can't take it don't dish it! Thats my motto!

 

My wife accuses me of bloating my post count!