FRAME and CIF

[sparks 0]

Can someone please tell me the difference between FRAME and CIF? My Dvr has both of these options and i don't know ehatr the difference is or which to use and why. Any help with this would be greatly appreciated. Also i have recorded content and the picture is a bit blurry,is there a simple solution to make this more clearer on this dvr.

 

Dvr is AVC782 http://www.avtech.com.tw/english/product_13_782.htm

[photys 0]

At least 100 people on this forum are more qualified to answer, but here goes

 

CIF: 352 x 240 pixels

D1: 720 x 480 pixels (or FRAME by their terminology)

It differs if your PAL or NTSC, but those are good guidelines.

 

Most DVRs rate there maximum frames per second capture capabilities when recording at CIF (352 x 240 pixels).

Grabbing at D1/FRAME (720 x 480 pixels) uses roughly 4 times the power.

Your unit can capture 120 frames per second recording at CIF, and 30 frames per second recording at D1/FRAME.

 

Regarding "blur".

1, Clean the lenses

2, Focus the cameras.

3, Check the TLV on your cameras, less than 480TVL may record blurry at D1/FRAME

4, Make sure your cameras can capture close to 720 x 480 pixels or its not worth recording at that lvl, (I sometimes do even with dodgy 510 x 492 pixel cameras)

5, Change the "Image Quality Setting" to "Best"

 

Those GE- 480SHRAI-VF´s you asked about have the pixels and the TVL´s needed.

 

Which cams did you buy in the end?

 

Hope that helps a little.

Let us know how you get on.

[sparks 0]

Thanks for you reply.I am using PAL and Frame and recording 720x576 (I think), i have changed to best and still the same.Am i correct in thinking that for the best results and quality i should record frame and at Best at the res stated earlier?

 

Regarding "blur".

 

I have cleaned lenses.

they fixed lense and focus.

Not sure of how many tvl they have. Also not sure if the cams can capture that res.Haven't got around to the cams yet,still using old ones but tried using a camcorder to see if the outcome was different and it still showed blurry.

 

Still looking for some info on the GE- 480SHRAI-VF

[photys 0]

Yeah, record at best and D1 (or FRAME as they call it).

This means slow frame rate and less storage time, but better quality images.

 

If its an old bullet cam, it probably doesnt supply 720x576 pixels to the recording, so it will be blurred regardless of what we do.

 

I was just wondering how many pixels a camcorder supplies. Remeber that 720x576 is DVD standard.

Except we will never see DVD quality unless ya hook up a near broadcast quality cam

Standard camcorder is probably 640x480 as they tend to connect via S-Video cable.

 

Try recording at CIF.

The bullet cams/camcorder will be able to supply more than 352x288.

If there is still blur then I imagine its due to the DVR´s compression.

The "Best" setting on your DVR means least possible compression, but it will still be compressed.

 

Don´t mistake blur for compression.

I mean, imagine a compressed Jpeg image on the internet, you dont see sharp pixels when you zoom in, you see kinda smoothed out weird coloured pixels.

If you record at "Normal" or "Basic" you will see more compression.

Might help you discern if its the cams limitation or the DVR´s limitation.

 

If i have learned anything about CCTV its that theres always a limitation looming somewhere.

 

 

Have a play, its half the fun mate.

[sparks 0]

I have another (Better) camcorder that i will try later and see if the quality is any better.

 

What is the best settings to record on if i want smoothest possible playback?

 

Also why does the image have to be converted to be viewed on a pc when it gives you software to play it?

 

Don´t mistake blur for compression.

I mean, imagine a compressed Jpeg image on the internet, you dont see sharp pixels when you zoom in, you see kinda smoothed out weird coloured pixels.

If you record at "Normal" or "Basic" you will see more compression.

Might help you discern if its the cams limitation or the DVR´s limitation

Very interesting read,i may have to look into this a bit more to see if i can find out which it is.

 

Thanks

[kensplace 0]

Easy way to find out if its the DVR, is to view the cams direct on a tv or monitor, or in many cases just the live view on the DVR should be ok.

 

If the cams look fine 'live' but no good when recorded then its the dvr limiting things.

[photys 0]

Kensplaces is spot on.

 

Sparks, for smooth playback, drop to CIF.

Smaller image size generaly means more frames per second (smoother playback).

 

I got some really smooth playback of some thieves robbing on Saturday night......cant recognise them though!

Second cam captured at D1 (FRAME) with only 6 frames per second, but i got a recognisable head shot

 

Regarding the conversion issue, I don´t know. Never tried a dedicated DVR.

[sparks 0]

@ken

 

Yes you are correct,the live view is ok ish.But the recorded footage is not too clear. This is like you say probably "down to the dvr limiting things".But i were wondering if i can get a better image through better cameras then they might both improve.

 

@photys

 

I will try and drop to CIF and see what that looks like. Because i only have 2 cams and a 500gb hard drive then the frames is not an issue,so i would like to have as high as possible frames but not sure what to set it as.Can the image size also be set to get a clearer image maybe to something that the cam can handle?

[photys 0]

Can you post a screenshot of some recorded images here?

 

 

"have as high as possible frames"

Looks like you can set the frames per second in the unit, 100 for CIF, 25 for D1

 

Its a 100 Frames per second (FPS) 4 channel DVR.

Generaly this means a maximum of 25 FPS per camera.

CIF recordings - maximum frames per second = 25 per camera (real time recording).

D1 recordings - maximum frames per second = 6 per camera.

 

So you should get real time recordings with lower quality video, or jerky recordings with higher quality video.

[sparks 0]

photys Your post slightly confuses me as you say that i can record

Its a 100 Frames per second (FPS) 4 channel DVR.

Generaly this means a maximum of 25 FPS per camera.

and then mention

D1 recordings - maximum frames per second = 6 per camera.

did you say earlier that D1 is Frame? and therefore should i be able to record at 25 fps on each cam?

 

I will try and post some screenshots.You mention real time recordings with lower quality video is this done by using cif or another way?

[photys 0]

Most DVRs rate there maximum frames per second capture capabilities when recording at CIF (352 x 240 pixels).

Grabbing at D1/FRAME (720 x 480 pixels) uses roughly 4 times the power.

Your unit can capture 120 frames per second recording at CIF, and 30 frames per second recording at D1/FRAME.

[sparks 0]

So is there a simple way for me to find out how many fps i am recording at?

[kensplace 0]

The dvr will probably allow you to show the time on the display, and also to pause then step through the video one frame at a time.

 

Display the clock, then pause, then step through till it gets to the start of a new second. Now step through one frame at a time till it gets to the next second, and the number of steps you took is the number of frames per second.

[sparks 0]

Thanks Ken i will take a look at this.

[sparks 0]

Can't seem to step through the frames (don't know how).

[sparks 0]

Found out how to test the frame thing and it is definatley doing 25FPS. So any one have any ideas why it is still jerky?