Any using a GV800 with 8 or more cameras?

[mamajama 0]

I am curious how the quality of say live viewing is when you have 8 and/or more cameras running on this 120fps card. Is the lower FPS, I assume 15fps for 8 cameras affect seeing most of what is going on? Any tips on this type of setup and results would be great.

 

Thanks,

MJ

[rory 0]

Looks fine, its still fast, using 16 cameras.

It use to be fast enough @ 10fps on stand alone systems, so yeah 120fps is great. Also, a local alarm company here records at 1fps per camera, and it captures everything fine.

[mamajama 0]

also recording the 16 feeds or just viewing them?

 

What's your upload speeds down there? aren't you on the tropical paradise island?

[rory 0]

viewing and recording them, the GV1480 recording is around the same as the GV800 anyway, at least in Mpeg4 and 640x480. The only real difference between the 2 is the GV1480 has all channels in real time live view, and has the video output.

 

Upload speeds vary, DSL is really slow, Cable can be really good, depends on what you pay them. We have direct fiber links from the US. Not all the outislands though, just some of the more populated islands. Company called Caribbean Crossings.

[mamajama 0]

the all live view would be nice in a situation were u r onsite for the viewing. I love looking at the link to the bahamas real estate, I love the beach, cancun, and the US ones, i get crazy thoughts looking at those beach views and wanta sell everything i have and raft on down:)

 

Thanks for your help Rory,

MJ

[CollinR 0]

Yup GV800 looks stellar with 8 and good with 16.

[Guest]

I do not agree that a GV-800 (PAL100FPS/NTSC120FPS)is suitable for surveillance, in fact I am not happy with the frame rate or the picture/video quality at 4CIF/D1 either. But first let me say that this depends on what you want to capture on your harddrive and in what enviroment you are recording. It is a difference in surveillance of a retail store vs. to keep an eye on what is happening outside some factory walls. So YES sometimes a GV-800 is enough. But all in all, nah I dont think so.

 

A Geovision GV-800/4-8-12-16 are giving 100/120 FPS @ 320*240 CIF resolution divided on the number of cameras in use(GV Non-Combo cards also have a feature called SMART that gives a positive effect on the number of frames that can be used for recording). So a GV-800/ gives you 100/120FPS divided on 4 cameras that will say 25/30 FPS but in CIF resolution only. So a GV-800/ would give you approx. 40/50FPS in 4CIF resolution divided by 4 camera channels that is 10/12,5 FPS. With a 16 channel that means 2,5/3 FPS on each channel.

 

I am not happy with the frame rate 25/30FPS is ok, but 50/60 would be better(offcourse this would mean more HDD is needed). Also is 4CIF/D1 resolution not that good when compressed. A new standard with NVR/DVR forMegapixel cameras might help us with getting better quality.

 

But this is mainly on what you are looking for in the video recordings.

 

have to go!

 

JD

[CollinR 0]

Tweak your setting man...

 

Whats your recording config?

 

The framerate is for 640*480 as well! That card has fusion 878a encoders, each good for a solid 30fps in hardware. Your host machine controls how fast it can transcode MPEG2 into X for storage.

 

Geovision has the best recording and multistreaming configuration of any DVR I have ever seen. Most just have a slider 1-10 for compression and what you pick also works for network transmission. If you don't know what you are doing you can config Geovision to use a streaming setting for storage.

[rory 0]

Yall seen the Core 2 Quad is now like $300 ..8MB cache and 4 cores .. Yippee!

[Guest]

Tweak your setting man...

 

Whats your recording config?

 

The framerate is for 640*480 as well! That card has fusion 878a encoders, each good for a solid 30fps in hardware. Your host machine controls how fast it can transcode MPEG2 into X for storage.

 

Geovision has the best recording and multistreaming configuration of any DVR I have ever seen. Most just have a slider 1-10 for compression and what you pick also works for network transmission. If you don't know what you are doing you can config Geovision to use a streaming setting for storage.

 

http://www.geovision.com.tw/english/product/GV-800.htm

 

Recording Rate

At 320 X 240 Resolution

120 fps (NTSC), 100 fps (PAL).

 

The computers have lately been:

 

----CPU---------------------------------------------------------------------------

Intel Pentium P4 HT 3,0GHZ Manufacture ID: BX80552631

Intel Pentium Dual Core 2,33GHz Manufacture ID: BX80557E6550

----Memory---------------------------------------------------------------------------

Corsair XMS2 6400 DDR2, 1024MB PC6400 64Meg x 8, CAS 5-5-5-15, 800MHz, 240pin Manufacture ID: CM2X1024-6400

Crucial DDR2 BallistiX PC6400 1024MB CL4 ,2.1V, 128Megx64, 240pin, 800mhz, E.P.P Manufacture ID: BL12864AA804

----Motherboard---------------------------------------------------------------------------

MSI 945PL NEO-F, I945PL, Socket-775, ATX ,S-ATAII, GbLAN, 2xDDR2, PCI-Ex16 Manufacture ID: 945PL NEO-F (PCB2.2)

Asus P5LD2-VM DH/C,I945G,Socket-775, m-ATX, GbLAN, DDR2, Intel ViiV, PCI-Ex16 Manufacture ID: P5LD2-VM DH/C

----Harddrives---------------------------------------------------------------------------

Systemdisk: Samsung SpinPoint T166 250GB SATA2 16MB 7200RPM Manufacture ID: HD252KJ

Videodisk(s): Samsung SpinPoint T166 500GB SATA2 16MB 7200RPM Manufacture ID: HD501LJ

----Graphic card---------------------------------------------------------------------------

MSI GeForce 7100GS TurboCache DDR2, PCI-Express,supports 512MB,Tv-Out/DVI Manufacture ID: NX7100GS-TD128E

Gainward GeForce 7300LE 256MB DDR2, PCI-Express, "BP7300LE-256-TV-DVI" Manufacture ID: 471846200-8552

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

The recording settings are always:

D1 resolution on all channels, Motion detection, Geo Mpeg4 ASP, Digital Watermark enabled, Audio deactivated, Quality set to 5.

I am currently only marketing Geovision Combo cards + 2004 & 2008, and only sell GV-650/GV-800 if 8 or fewer channels, and for low security locations.

I have never been able to record 100 FPS @ 2 CIF/4CIF resolutions when there is motion on more than 2 channels on a GV-800. Also a GV-1120/8 and a GV-800/8 is both giving 100FPS, but I get more frames when using the combo card then the GV-800 due to the way the preview is arranged. Also if audio is enabled that gives even more frames dropped. So each card model has a maximum amount of resources and you cannot make a card perform higher than its limit by using over dimensioned hardware.

But I must admit that I haven’t got it that he is asking for preview and not recording,  sorry for that, the preview is ok, but not FULL MOTION, so if you going to look on it much, like: use it to sit beside it an monitor for hours every day, then for your eyes and your head sake, choose a combo card!

But if any have any tweaking tips to come with to make higher output from the Geovision compressions cards then, I would like to hear of them off course. This will be perhaps more and more in focus in the future when Geovision is putting more and more features into the software that makes the system needing more CPU/Memory power from the computers. I think the difference in V7 and V8 is huge, since not so many new features.

There are many questions that I have when it comes to Geovision strategy and development; questions like:

Are there to many different Geovision card models? GV-250/600/650/800/1120/1240/1480/2004/2008, and these comes again in 4/8/12/16 +1/2 channels solutions and then again to make it even more to choose between they comes in PCI and PCI-Xpress solution and if not that is not enough you can choose between D-Sub, DVI-Sub and backplane. I think that all this different models make the product higher priced then it should be, it would cost less to have fewer models and higher quantity of the ones you got. I would for instance maybe take away the 600 and 800 series, and maybe the 1240, also as soon as possible changed only too PCI Xpress as soon as possible, not yet but soon, as well as only deliver DVI Sub instead of 3 different models. This is old western industrial realties and all now it cost less per each unit to produce 1000 units of 1 model then 500 of one and 500 of almost identical model.

Also the new GV-2004/2008 doesn’t remind me much of hardware compression cards, they are more like a thing in between Hardware and compression cards, but they was introduced as a Hardware card, but now it seems more like a Hybrid card, because a hardware card that uses 40% + for 8 channels is far away from the CPU use I have experienced from the HikVision cards.

 

I also seen software using the HikVision cards are having more settings for recordings and also have twin solutions for recording in different resolutions at the same time, full D1 FULL MOTION preview, and you can have D1 Recording, D1 preview and also choose what resolution you want to stream on the net all capable of 25/30 FPS on each channel at D1 and at the same time view playback without that your recordings will be reduced. But to make things clear, i am not satisfied with this either.

 

I did see a intresting KOREAN system a few years ago, that was HDTV resolution and also used cameras that was made for this resolution, the playback was better then I seen on any system, but I cant find the company anymore so probably a good idea came to the place where there was no more money to continue.

 

As I said in a tead on this forum before, the perfect DVR havent been made yet!

 

JD

[Guest]

Yall seen the Core 2 Quad is now like $300 ..8MB cache and 4 cores .. Yippee!

 

 

Intel Core 2 Quad Q6600 2.4GHz Socket LGA775, 8MB, BOXED

300,- USD + tax at my location.

 

JD

[rory 0]

Yall seen the Core 2 Quad is now like $300 ..8MB cache and 4 cores .. Yippee!

 

 

Intel Core 2 Quad Q6600 2.4GHz Socket LGA775, 8MB, BOXED

300,- USD + tax at my location.

 

JD

 

yep, only $75 more than the E6600 .. im going to use them from now on .. for now anyway as the prices are dropping like flies .. well up and down right now. By the end of the year who knows what CPU we will be using

[rory 0]

I do not agree that a GV-800 (PAL100FPS/NTSC120FPS)is suitable for surveillance, in fact I am not happy with the frame rate or the picture/video quality at 4CIF/D1 either. But first let me say that this depends on what you want to capture on your harddrive and in what enviroment you are recording. It is a difference in surveillance of a retail store vs. to keep an eye on what is happening outside some factory walls. So YES sometimes a GV-800 is enough. But all in all, nah I dont think so.

 

A Geovision GV-800/4-8-12-16 are giving 100/120 FPS @ 320*240 CIF resolution divided on the number of cameras in use(GV Non-Combo cards also have a feature called SMART that gives a positive effect on the number of frames that can be used for recording). So a GV-800/ gives you 100/120FPS divided on 4 cameras that will say 25/30 FPS but in CIF resolution only. So a GV-800/ would give you approx. 40/50FPS in 4CIF resolution divided by 4 camera channels that is 10/12,5 FPS. With a 16 channel that means 2,5/3 FPS on each channel.

 

I am not happy with the frame rate 25/30FPS is ok, but 50/60 would be better(offcourse this would mean more HDD is needed). Also is 4CIF/D1 resolution not that good when compressed. A new standard with NVR/DVR forMegapixel cameras might help us with getting better quality.

 

But this is mainly on what you are looking for in the video recordings.

 

have to go!

 

JD

 

IMO, the GV800 is great for surveillance. Obviously the 4 channel version is better than the 16, as then it is basically real time video recorded and live. 20 fps is real time to the human eye. 15fps looks real time to the untrained human eye, or at least resembles it enough. A colleague is recording at 1fps set to per camera .. for his alarm central station .. it is fine, evidence is captured without any loss. He is not monitoring a road though, in that case it would be another story. Lower the frames, longer recording. BW cameras (instead of Color), longer recordings also, Due to lower image size.

 

I had a night club with the GE Kalatel DVRs for 5 years, captured every incident, and that was 60pps max, and lower quality evidence sharing; but it still worked fine. Switched to the PC based for faster live video and also higher quality evidence sharing. I remember when we were capturing evidence on Tape even .. before the DVRs came about .. worse thing with that was when needing to search for an event .. well the lower quality also, even when using S-VHS.

 

As to the GV1480 vs the GV800, the GV800 produces better quality live video, in my experiences. There is also a bug with the Combo cards, when set the source to 740x480 you will get black borders around the video in playback and remote - this was acknowledged by GeoVision to effect only the Combo cards, and it still remains today even with a brand new card and version 8.12.

 

All Geo Cards support the software feature "Smart Motion Detection", which means it only records which cameras are picking up motion at the time, so the total fps is distributed amongst those.

 

I agree though, no perfect DVR yet, I want higher resolutions, speed is nice, but less of an issue. With the low cost of storage now, I would prefer lower compression and higher quality, I mean $100 for a 500GB Drive now ..

 

Basically it depends as the GV1480 is quite a bit more $$, the Gv1120 is not that much more, so if you want real time live video, and can deal with the black boxes in 720x480 mode, then the GV1120 it is. if using only 640x480 though no big deal, other than the live video quality is slightly less on the GV1120. The DSP feature is basically useless unless you just want to duplicate the video to another monitor/TV, and if you dont mind loosing Direct Draw overlay for the live video, then you could use the DSP Spot Feature; I dont recommend that though.

 

just my 2cents

[Guest]

I do not agree that a GV-800 (PAL100FPS/NTSC120FPS)is suitable for surveillance, in fact I am not happy with the frame rate or the picture/video quality at 4CIF/D1 either. But first let me say that this depends on what you want to capture on your harddrive and in what enviroment you are recording. It is a difference in surveillance of a retail store vs. to keep an eye on what is happening outside some factory walls. So YES sometimes a GV-800 is enough. But all in all, nah I dont think so.

 

A Geovision GV-800/4-8-12-16 are giving 100/120 FPS @ 320*240 CIF resolution divided on the number of cameras in use(GV Non-Combo cards also have a feature called SMART that gives a positive effect on the number of frames that can be used for recording). So a GV-800/ gives you 100/120FPS divided on 4 cameras that will say 25/30 FPS but in CIF resolution only. So a GV-800/ would give you approx. 40/50FPS in 4CIF resolution divided by 4 camera channels that is 10/12,5 FPS. With a 16 channel that means 2,5/3 FPS on each channel.

 

I am not happy with the frame rate 25/30FPS is ok, but 50/60 would be better(offcourse this would mean more HDD is needed). Also is 4CIF/D1 resolution not that good when compressed. A new standard with NVR/DVR forMegapixel cameras might help us with getting better quality.

 

But this is mainly on what you are looking for in the video recordings.

 

have to go!

 

JD

 

IMO, the GV800 is great for surveillance. Obviously the 4 channel version is better than the 16, as then it is basically real time video recorded and live. 20 fps is real time to the human eye. 15fps looks real time to the untrained human eye, or at least resembles it enough. A colleague is recording at 1fps set to per camera .. for his alarm central station .. it is fine, evidence is captured without any loss. He is not monitoring a road though, in that case it would be another story. Lower the frames, longer recording. BW cameras (instead of Color), longer recordings also, Due to lower image size.

 

I had a night club with the GE Kalatel DVRs for 5 years, captured every incident, and that was 60pps max, and lower quality evidence sharing; but it still worked fine. Switched to the PC based for faster live video and also higher quality evidence sharing. I remember when we were capturing evidence on Tape even .. before the DVRs came about .. worse thing with that was when needing to search for an event .. well the lower quality also, even when using S-VHS.

 

As to the GV1480 vs the GV800, the GV800 produces better quality live video, in my experiences. There is also a bug with the Combo cards, when set the source to 740x480 you will get black borders around the video in playback and remote - this was acknowledged by GeoVision to effect only the Combo cards, and it still remains today even with a brand new card and version 8.12.

 

All Geo Cards support the software feature "Smart Motion Detection", which means it only records which cameras are picking up motion at the time, so the total fps is distributed amongst those.

 

I agree though, no perfect DVR yet, I want higher resolutions, speed is nice, but less of an issue. With the low cost of storage now, I would prefer lower compression and higher quality, I mean $100 for a 500GB Drive now ..

 

Basically it depends as the GV1480 is quite a bit more $$, the Gv1120 is not that much more, so if you want real time live video, and can deal with the black boxes in 720x480 mode, then the GV1120 it is. if using only 640x480 though no big deal, other than the live video quality is slightly less on the GV1120. The DSP feature is basically useless unless you just want to duplicate the video to another monitor/TV, and if you dont mind loosing Direct Draw overlay for the live video, then you could use the DSP Spot Feature; I dont recommend that though.

 

just my 2cents

 

 

 

Hi!

 

Is it these black fields you are talking about?

 

Or are talking about a NTSC only issue here? In PAL we have a 720X576 resolution? This is from Multiview.

 

I mean that to have at least 15 FPS is a minimum for a retailer, if you have only 1 frame a second, a thief would get a package of meat from the cooler to his pockets without getting it on file if he is quick and lucky, I was a retailer before and had one of the first DVR system launched in my country. It was QCIF and approx. 2,5FPS. On one occasion we had a punk hitting after one of my employees and my employee hit back. Then later Police came and we looked on the camera, what did we see? We did see that my employee did hit the punk and nothing else, so instead of having evidence we had evidence for the counterpart, luckily we had another camera filming from another angle and also did take 2,5 FPS but on this camera we did see both the hits and who really did hit first. Of course there are many numbers between 2,5 and 25. On 700sqaure meter sale area I had 48 cameras filming everything in that store. I ended up using 3 16 channels DVR’s 1 Geovision 800 and 2 JOINPRO Full Motion CIF systems. All was networked on a dedicated LAN too my home with 100Mbit Cat5 cable and I had 48 remote cameras showing on 3 15â€

[rory 0]

I had systems in Retail Businesses running 5fps and lower, and they caught every incident of stealing. Trust me, 15fps is not a minimum, heck back in the day we were doing 0.1fps even to tape. We're just spoiled now

 

The more the merrier though, going by todays technology you can easily get faster speeds if you can afford it; back in the day, there was no other choice. Im using the 1480 at the night club for that reason, they have tons of fights and other things, and this helps. Could he get away with much slower, sure, he was for many years. If you have the money and the technology is there though, why not use it. I do feel the GV650 and the GV800 still certainly have their places, especially in retail businesses. That said, for retail business on a budget, even the GV600 is fine (4 camera example).

 

Yes those look like the black borders. Without the black background, they are even more noticeable. The side and center borders should be the same width of the top border in the image on the right. Ive seen them on all kinds of Geo systems I have demoed where they were running combo cards, though cant say if any were NTSC or PAL. Geo confirms the issue, however they mention it is also in 320x240 mode, which I dont use, and also they say it is with H.264, however it appears with Fast Mpeg4 also in my experiences.

[photys 0]

Black borders on PAL D1 GV-1280 confirmed.